Cyprus-Forum.com

[alexISS]

P.S. I personally regret that Venizelos did not get his wish, and Greece did not enter WWI until very late. As otherwise, if it had, there probably wouldn't be a Cyprus problem today, and there wouldn't be all this pathetic bickering about whether we are Greek, Cypriot or whatever.

I regret that too, but noone knew how things would turn out at the time, and you can't really blame anyone for not wanting war.

[Simon]

Not to mention that the King was part German, I am sure this had some bearing on his decision, when he decided not to enter the War against the Germans.

[miltiades]

Not to mention that the King was part German, I am sure this had some bearing on his decision, when he decided not to enter the War against the Germans.

I thought all royalty in Greece was of foreign descent. To the best of my knowledge , please correct me if I'm wrong , Greece has never had its own royalty , meaning Greeks as royals , since gaining its independence from Turkey in 1829 .

As far as the schools books provided by the Greek Education system , I think you will find that the books are given free but they are paid for by the Cyprus government.

[seleucus Nicator]

Not to mention that the King was part German, I am sure this had some bearing on his decision, when he decided not to enter the War against the Germans.

I thought all royalty in Greece was of foreign descent. To the best of my knowledge , please correct me if I'm wrong , Greece has never had its own royalty , meaning Greeks as royals , since gaining its independence from Turkey in 1829 .

We gonna resurrect Constantine XI Palaiologos to satisfy you and have a pure Greek royal family.

In July 1821, he head of the Cypriot Orthodox Church Archbishop Kyprianos, along with 470 prominent Greek Cypriots, amongst them the Metropolitans Chrysanthos of Paphos, Meletios of Kition and Lavrentios of Kyrenia, are executed by beheading or hanging by the Ottomans in Nicosia. This act was followed by the massacre of about 10,000 Greeks of the island .
I m sure that you must be also not satisfied (they were not neo Cypriots) with these bad guys that wanted their freedom from the Ottomans.

[alexISS]

We gonna resurrect Constantine XI Palaiologos to satisfy you and have a pure Greek royal family.

Well, Constantine XI was half serbian
Anyway, when talking about royal families there is no point in discussing their ethnicity. A king is supposed to be a descendant of kings so, since there were no such Greeks when the Greek state was formed, one was sent to us. King Otto's descendants were of course half Greek. And Kings tend to marry members of other royal families, even from other countries, since they are considered more of "their kind" than their "common" countrymen. That's the case with the King of Spain's wife or (if I remember correctly), the former Serbian Queen, both of them are Greek I believe, relatives of former King Constantine of Greece

[alexISS]

As far as the schools books provided by the Greek Education system , I think you will find that the books are given free but they are paid for by the Cyprus government.

Quoting from audit.gov.cy

"Το Υπουργείο Παιδείας και Πολιτισμού έχει την ευθύνη για την προμήθεια κάθε χρόνο των βιβλίων που θα χρειαστούν τα δημόσια σχολεία της Δημοτικής, Μέσης και Τεχνικής Εκπαίδευσης. Τα βιβλία προμηθεύονται δωρεάν από την Ελλάδα μέσω του Οργανισμού Εκδόσεων Διδακτικών Βιβλίων (O.Ε.Δ.Β.). Επίσης μεριμνά για την ετοιμασία και εκτύπωση βιβλίων στην Κύπρο, μέσω των τριών Υ.Α.Π. που λειτουργούν στο Υπουργείο."

Some of the books are printed in Cyprus, some are imported from Greece for free but in both cases the content is provided to the Cyprus government for free.

[askimwos]

As far as the schools books provided by the Greek Education system , I think you will find that the books are given free but they are paid for by the Cyprus government.

Quoting from audit.gov.cy

"Το Υπουργείο Παιδείας και Πολιτισμού έχει την ευθύνη για την προμήθεια κάθε χρόνο των βιβλίων που θα χρειαστούν τα δημόσια σχολεία της Δημοτικής, Μέσης και Τεχνικής Εκπαίδευσης. Τα βιβλία προμηθεύονται δωρεάν από την Ελλάδα μέσω του Οργανισμού Εκδόσεων Διδακτικών Βιβλίων (O.Ε.Δ.Β.). Επίσης μεριμνά για την ετοιμασία και εκτύπωση βιβλίων στην Κύπρο, μέσω των τριών Υ.Α.Π. που λειτουργούν στο Υπουργείο."

Some of the books are printed in Cyprus, some are imported from Greece for free but in both cases the content is provided to the Cyprus government for free.

Even though I am not sure that the above quote rally says that the books provided by Greece to Cyprus are for free, what is your point?

I would rather pay what they are worth or simply print new books on our own so that people like you stop using this as an argument. Sorry my dear friend but this is way too small a price to pay for the disaster that the Greek Junta brought to Cyprus (not the people). Would you exchange a few books and some university places for another 10 years of Junta oppression (the Junta collapsed mainly by the Cypriot disaster). I would surely exhange those small "gifts" from Greece with the opportunity to avoid the results of the Turkish invation.

[miltiades]

Well I shall for ever be grateful for the free books ! The junta collapsed not mainly by the Cypriot desaster but exclusively , undeniably profoundly as a result of the Cyprus catastrophe.
The junta was not challenged by the people , their ridiculous posters depicting " I EPANASTASIS IPIRXE ISTORIKI ANAGGI " "ELLA ELLINON XRISTIANON " were in every corner of Greece .None were vandalized , the people were indeed petrified , I witnessed it first hand in the Northern part of Greece a small town called Arithea , in another village near bye called Ambeli , I enquired as to why these ridiculous posters are left standing . I was stepped upon to be quite.

[alexISS]

Even though I am not sure that the above quote rally says that the books provided by Greece to Cyprus are for free, what is your point?

You can check the site yourself, it says exactly that.

I would rather pay what they are worth or simply print new books on our own so that people like you stop using this as an argument.

You would, but your government obviously disagrees.

Sorry my dear friend but this is way too small a price to pay for the disaster that the Greek Junta brought to Cyprus (not the people).

Please read my previous posts, Greece provides Cyprus with much more than schoolbooks, quite a big price the Greek people pay for what (as you yourself admit) was not their fault. And please do not forget that the Junta had some pretty able and 100% Cypriot collaborators in Cyprus who carried out the coup, am I wrong? So before you baptize the coup as "Greek", don't underestimate the part that your own people played in this disaster.

Would you exchange a few books and some university places for another 10 years of Junta oppression (the Junta collapsed mainly by the Cypriot disaster). I would surely exhange those small "gifts" from Greece with the opportunity to avoid the results of the Turkish invation.

The coup was a good chance for the Turkish invasion, but what caused it was your own Makarios's disregard to the RoC constitution, which he wanted replaced at its birth. If only you had been content with what was given to you after so many struggles, there would be no invasion. But hey if blaming others makes you feel good go ahead. I'll say it again, without Greece, there would be no Republic of Cyprus for Turkey to invade in the first place, you would simply be a Turkish province

[askimwos]

The Junta responsible for the 1974 coup had nothing to do with the Greek people, it wasn't elected and, although the USA immediately recognized it as the Greek government, the Greeks never did. And what about after 1974? Where would the RoC be now without Greece's support? Do you really think you would have the quality of living that you do without Greece? Does anyone believe Cyprus would be an EU member without Greece? What would Turkey do after the 1974 events had Greece declared herself neutral to the Cyprus problem? Could a country with a tiny army, no airforce and no navy afford an enemy like Turkey? Cyprus is an independent country with a strong economy and a european profile because of the continuous efforts of Greek politicians which, more often than not, were AGAINST the stubborness of the short-sighted Cypriots who were still waiting for Enosis... You may now enjoy your independance as a state, but that state was not what you wanted 40 years ago. So go ahead and advertise your "Cypriot-not Greek" identity all you want, it's thanks to Greece that you can.
I don't know if Cypriots hate mainland Greeks but I DO know that mainland Greeks (I'm one myself) DO NOT hate Cypriots. All the above proves that

What a moron! Should we now say thanks a bend down to you?
I have nothing against the Greek people as I have nothing against any other everyday people.

However, your stance reminds me of the Pontius Pilatous one. You cannot simply overwrite Greece's (as a country) faults by simply saying that the Junta was not elected! If you want to talk politics then talk politics and do not use this flip flop attitute.

Greece is very much responsible for what happened in Cyprus and the disaster in Cyprus actually made Junta collapse at least a decade earlier. Greece would have been in pretty much the same position as Turkey is today in terms of development hadn't been the Cyprus disaster. So please mate stop bragging about what Greece did for Cyprus after 1974 and simply brushing aside the resposibilities of Greece for what happened.

Greece had the moral oblication to help Cyprus stand on its own feet after the disaster and Greek people did all they could to help but going that far to claim that it was because of Greece that Cyprus economy developed and surpassed that of Greece is at least a blasphemy towards the Cypriot people. Cypriots worked very hard and in many times had to leave their families behind and work in the Arab countries a early as the 90's in order to prosper. They had to rebuilt the country and house 200,000 people that lost everything so next time you quote something like the above be aware that you are just scratching old wounds that are still in th process of healing. To answer your stupid question in short YES I BELIEVE THAT THE CYPRIOTS WOULD ENJOY THE QUALITY OF LIFE THEY ENJOY TODAY EVN WITHOUT GREECE. Maybe it would have taken a couple of years more to reach this state but the answer is still the same.

Cyprus became a member of the EU because it met the criteria of entry. Yes Greece did help as an existing member of the EU but other countries such as France and Germany helped equally. Greece is just a "small" member of the Eu and hadn't we had the support of France we wouldn;t have entered. So please don't flatter yourself as the EU big power.

As for the military service being 3 times more if it wasn't for Greece. I suggest you wake up and see that in Cyprus there are no more than 2,000 Greek soldiers. A bit more than the 950 ELDYK regiment but again claiming that because of the presence of some 1000 more Greek soldiers on the island the military service is a third of what it would have been is a joke.

As for Greece supposedly providing military power to Cyprus, well that is debatable. As you say Cyprus is very close to Turkey and as prominent Greek politicians have stated before "too far from Greece". Personally I do not trust Greeks on what they are saying about defending Cyprus. Their first priority in the case of a war is the defence of the Greek islands and not Cyprus. History has taught us this many times. Cypriots will be once again left on their own. I don't blame Greece for this either as as a country it is quite normal to seek to protect their people first. But don't come here preaching about Greece protecting Cyprus cause you make yourself look like a clown!

Finally I suggest to climb down from your Grand-Hellenic horse and stop being so provocative because you are making Greek people looking fools in the eyes of Cypriots.

I know some GCs like Sotos or Simon may not agree with what I said but don't fool yourselves. Cypriots are very proud people to accept a "Greek" preachin about them still being more or less in the middle ages without the help of Greece.