Cyprus-Forum.com

[mehmet]

Magicthrill,

where is your information about low literacy rates coming from? Can you provide some evidence?

Look, people have children for all sorts of resons. Catholics are supposed to consider abortion and contraception a sin so you may find in catholic countries such as Ireland, Italy, Spain and France differing levels of birth rates to mainly protestant countries like UK, Germany and the Scandinavian countries.

[magikthrill]

oy,

i got the following info from the CIA World Factbook. I could find more but I have 11 hours of class followed by a 9 hour flight tomorrow:
( http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/index.html )

Country Avg. Lt. Rate Birth Rate
India 59.5 22.8/1000
Turkey 86.5 17.22/ 1000
USA 97.0 14.3/ 1000
Singapore 96.3 9.63/1000
Greece 97.5 9.73/1000
Cyprus 97.6 12.66/1000
UK 99.0 10.9/ 1000
Japan 99.0 9.56/1000



As you can see with the exceptions of Greece (which has a VERY low birth rate) and Singapore (very small overpopulated country) there is a CLEAR trend between birth rate and literacy rate, so hence I am not pulling this stuff out of my anus.

Additionally, I used some Eastern countries to disporve yoru Catholic theory.

If I had more time I could easily develop an equation as well. I'm actually quite into this so maybe I will do so when
I get back

[mehmet]

Magicthrill, thanks for the statistics. I can see your point about the link between literacy and birht rates. I wouldn't say 87% literacy was low though, would you? Certainly in comparision to 99% it's undeniably so but would you say you got a low mark if your course work was marked at 87%?

[magikthrill]

mehmet,

hehe. no it is not THAT low. in fact for Turkey, the male percentage is quite higher but the female is lower.

however, literacy rate is defined as people being able to read and write over the age of 15. so if you think about it even if just 1 out of 100 people arent capable of reading and/or signing a check, then that is still quite bad , no?

I wonder what the TC literacy rate is though. Im almost positive its higher than Turkey's just wondering how close it is to the GCs (maybe higher?)

[erolz]

As you can see with the exceptions of Greece (which has a VERY low birth rate) and Singapore (very small overpopulated country) there is a CLEAR trend between birth rate and literacy rate, so hence I am not pulling this stuff out of my anus.

Additionally, I used some Eastern countries to disporve yoru Catholic theory.

If I had more time I could easily develop an equation as well. I'm actually quite into this so maybe I will do so when
I get back

Whilst there is a strong correlation between birth rates and literacy levels it is not as clear as you make out here and neither is it without it's glaring exceptions. The issue is complicated and whilst literacy certainly has a realtionship to birth rates it is not a simple and clear cut one that applies universaly in all countries / areas.

They believed that only literacy could spread the ideas and techniques that made the birth rates fall, and that literacy would not grow fast enough. Well, literacy has grown a lot faster than they expected - between 1980 and 2000, literacy rose from 18% to 47% in Afghanistan, from 33% to 64% in Nigeria, from 66% to 85% in China, and from 69% to 87% in Indonesia. But birth rates have dropped even more steeply than literacy has risen: the global average is now 2,7 children per woman.

Some of the most startling recent drops have been in places where women's illiteracy is still quite high - Bangladesh and parts of India, for example - so we clearly need a broader criterion than mere literacy. In fact, any form of mass media, including broadcast media that do not require literacy, seem to produce the same effect in many places. (Though purely local cultural factors also play a role: Pakistan and Bangladesh both had a birth rate of 6,3 in 1981; now Bangladesh's is 3,3 while Pakistan's is still 5,6.)

source http://www.witness.co.za/content%5C2004_12%5C30029.htm (my empahsis)
[/b]

[magikthrill]

erolz,

I don't understand how you can't see the trend in my statsistics. If I were to remove Greece and Singapre the trend would be 100% clear. However, every rule has exceptions.

Additionally, I agree with the article you wrote. Illetracy is obviosly not the only criterion. Aside from the media though, the reason why these countries have lowered their birth effect rates is due to many western feminist organizations that go around these regions teaching about birth control (I saw a documentar on this a long time ago).

[mehmet]

My mother was one of five, when she came to England and married she had four. I have two. I am not aware of this movement of feminists preaching birth control but there are obviously advocates for and against birth control amongst both men and women.

[turkcyp]

actually that is one of the reasons.

did you guys really not know this?

countries associated with lower literacy rates:

a) use less contraceptives
b) use children as assets rather than liabilities, hence they make more children

this is basic high school economics.

In general it is true. The true part is that there is a decent correlation between literacy rate and birth rates. Of course there are exceptions to it.

But what is still disputable in the literature is what causes what. Classical chicken or the egg story.

Does the high birth rate cause low literacy rates? (Because you have more kids to educate, and so on)
Does the low literacy rate cause high birth rates (for the reasons Magik had given and so on)

But no matter what is the cause and effect relationship, it is a cycle for sure, where every developing nation is trying to break through.

Here is another fact or another cycle I should say. When you develop and get richer your death rate is reduced much more than your both rate initially and thus life expectancy gets higher. This in return causes an increase in population growth rate temporarily till the birth rates catch up in reduction. And this increase in population growth rate causes income and subsequently literacy rate to lower as well.