Cyprus-Forum.com

[LENA]

Attention: I use posts from Nemski, VP and Shah…no offence just use their posts for emphasise my point!!!!

A friendly couple of mine had to been through this weekend something shameful for every Cypriot.

THIS THE FIRST TIME THAT I FEEL SHAME THAT I AM CYPRIOT!!!!

The couple is not one of the “normal” couple that we know…this couple is a young couple of weird people. She is 21 years old Cypriot (Greek speaking) and he is 26 years old Cypriot (Turkish speaking). They met each other in UK where they both study and work. They have been together for 6 ½ months but they knew each other more than that. They proof to all of us that ask, love and agapi is the same thing…when you have to show that it sound the same. But guess what? They had to attend to love lectures…they had to be told what to love and how they have to show their love. They knew that for Greeks and Turkish was weird and odd that they was together…but they was fine until now…they went out all together…but they had to sacrifice friends as well. But never something too serious, that they had to think that they were doing something wrong. Not until this weekend. They try to attend to a Greek & Cypriot party…and guess what since the Cypriots found out about him…they start a fight…he step back…but she was offended and they start fighting…there argument was in Greek so the poor 26 years old TC wasn’t able to understand…but he worried about his love…and when the fight start getting warmer he step in front of her….because he was afraid for her…and the kind Cypriots hit him. He didn’t want to start a fight in front of her and some other calmer students interfere and the couple had to leave the party.

He had to learn as well as the GC girl that love means that you have to fall in love someone who is from your country….!!!
But they are both Cypriots!!!
What they had to know about love that the missed? That love is pronounced as ask…or …as agapi????
That was theire fault? A language problem??? But I guess Shah gave us the answer…

Aggreed, but unfortunately a lot of people do like raising their children against the opposite side, shame really because all they are doing is leaving behind more conflict for when they are gone and the children take over...

Yes Shah …is shame…really it is…and now I am feeling the shame of being Cypriot.

Kikapu i don't think VP is saying we cant live together, from what i understand, he is saying that the GCs are not doing anything that can be perceived as peaceful or as an act of will towards unity, the TCs have shown that they want a solution, but the GCs refused it, and still insist on making life hard for all of us for some reason, while -ironically- preaching about human rights...

Unfortunately those people show to me that we are not able to leave together…they are young for fuck sake and they live with the anger…WHY?

DON’T ANY OF YOU DARE TO SAY THAT HAPPEN ONLY AMONG GREEK SPEAKING because something common happened with a couple among my friend here where I study…but the couple was Greek bloke and Turkish girl and they end up to finish their relationship after 3 months and she is hanging around with people all over the world except her Turkish friends…

Kikapu i don't think VP is saying we cant live together, from what i understand, he is saying that the GCs are not doing anything that can be perceived as peaceful or as an act of will towards unity, the TCs have shown that they want a solution, but the GCs refused it, and still insist on making life hard for all of us for some reason, while -ironically- preaching about human rights...

But Shah you claim that GC are doing nothing and TC show that they want solution…well your words make me laugh with my tiers making my eyes shinning even more from joy…Joy for the Turkish speaking Cypriots that you claim that they want solution. I offered you my friendship and you called me Turkish hater…and you show me that we will not be able to talk without fights and politics. The Turkish Speaking CYPRIOTS that you represent refused to me to teach me even for fun Turkish…and only 2-3 days ago 2 friends start teaching me Turkish and I already have 7 pages full of Turkish and a Turkish dictionary on my laptop….I found support from Turks and you have kindly wish me good luck when I said that I want to learn…and guess what…today on my way to submit my assignment a third Turkish guy offer me his valuable time for lessons and I can teach him back Greek….Can you believe that? I want the Turks outside of my country and they are the only ones who offered me help. My compatriots believe that I am a hater…

I am sorry nemski…but I grow up as you said as well, just want to avoid anything Turkish…

Yes, as a result of my work which involves communicating with mainly the arts professionals on both sides. Before having met any Turkish Cypriots in Cyprus I had been brainwashed to hate 'Turkish' people and anything 'Turkish'. Until a couple of years ago, for example, if I ever accidentally tuned into a Turkish radio station I would automatically switch it off, I couldnt even listen to a Turkish voice! Since having had the opportunity to mix, even on a small scale, with Turkish-Cypriot people my views and behaviour has totally changed. I am disgusted at the racist way I was brought up to think and I understand now that the only way for all of us to move forward (and to encourage people to move forward!) is for the different communities to come into contact, if only for 5 minutes.
Both my family and my husband's family are all refugees who have all lost, emotional, material, psychological. What I know for certain is that I do not want to see my son growing up into the bitterness and hatred that I myself witnessed, no one can want this for their children surely?

I applaud your comments well done I only wish there were more GCs like you but unfortunately many are not sincere or genuine and very superficial. This we can sense and makes us very apprehensive about uniting with the GC community.

But I guess I was wrong …I had to avoid anything Cypriot whatever is that TC or GC!!!!!!

You have a point Shahmaran, and this is all the more reason for getting these people to see the reality, not what theyve been brainwashed to believe, by bringing them in to direct contact with Turkish Cypriot people and vice versa... Until this happens I dont think alot can change, but only the people can make this happen.
We shouldnt waste so much time arguing with eachother and getting no where with fascists in forums like these and do something pro-active about the situation.
Also by the time our children grow up there will be a very different population mix with so many other nationalities living and migrating to Cyprus. So before Greek-Cypriots and Turkish Cypriots get round to doing anything positive it will probably be too late. I heard that the GC gov just announced they will give 40,000 to families having a 3rd child!...

What do you think now nemski? Who do you really have to avoid? Cypriots (any TC, GC), Turks, Greeks,????? Who???

I thought that the solution will come with the new generation…who will believe on humanity, love, trust peace….

The fears and scars of Cypriots and the consistent daily reminders over the years is what stops them from seeing the truth. My grandmother (80yrs) met a Turkish Cypriot person, at an event in Lefkosia last month, for the first time in 32 years and she was surprised at how 'polite and friendly' he was and also that he was educated! of course her mindset has been that all Turkish-cypriots are 'barbaric' and living in the middle ages... She is living proof that these attitudes can easily change in just a short meeting. Im glad that she had this opportunity before she dies.
Good night all, you guys should get some rest!

Thank you for reminding to me that since those people die any hope for solution and unification will die as well!!!

I decided that I will take off from the section…may be I will banish myself from the section and may be from the forum as well…I am fed up with this section and the hypocrisy, the preach, the accusations, the insults, the circles…I thought that it will be nice to express my views since I avoid to do that back home…because I wanted to avoid the fights and the arguments among friends!!! But reality shows me that I might have to go back to silence… I will be serious involved with TCs very soon because of my research and I need off from all that… so forgive me but I am not going to reply any more to this section.

Good mooring to all of you – Gunaydin – Kali sas mera

[askimwos]

Not surprised by the incident involving a GCandTC couple. However, I am aware of four cases of GC-TC couples and all of them are doing fine. In fact one of these couples have decided to get married next summer.
I wouldn't be disappointed as any reactions no matter how harsh they might be on people that go against the current and decide to break the taboos are part of the process of raproachment and reconciliation.

Just think back a few years and I am sure that you will notice that such weddings were almost impossible - this was the case prior to 1974 and 1960's as well.

The fact that young TC and GC have gone forward and are willing to fight against these taboos proves that there is a future in this small society called Cyprus.

[humanist]

I am sorry to hear of this incident, what can i say I am disappointed and more disillusioned. I gues some cypriots are racists. I can only be responsible fo r my actions it would be nice to think that others were more inteligent and enlightened. Sorry to tsc's.

[joanna]

I know 2 such couples. In London there are lots of GC's married to TC's. My cousin decided to move back to Cyprus with her husband who is a TC and their 3 young boys, they live in Larnaca and they havent had any trouble. Obviously there are some comments by ppl some times, but what can you do, ppl have varying oppinions and i guess they are entitled to think what they like, but it is bad for them to start attacking ppl at a party. I think its like holliganism in general, if ppl want a fight then theyll start one and it doenst really matter about the subject.

[Kikapu]

Not surprised by the incident involving a GCandTC couple. However, I am aware of four cases of GC-TC couples and all of them are doing fine. In fact one of these couples have decided to get married next summer.
I wouldn't be disappointed as any reactions no matter how harsh they might be on people that go against the current and decide to break the taboos are part of the process of raproachment and reconciliation.

Just think back a few years and I am sure that you will notice that such weddings were almost impossible - this was the case prior to 1974 and 1960's as well.

The fact that young TC and GC have gone forward and are willing to fight against these taboos proves that there is a future in this small society called Cyprus.

These are exception I'm afraid.

If the Greek Cypriot Girls are as much protected by their families as Turkish Cypriot Girls are, then there are always going to be problems in their relationships, if the man is from the "other side".

When mrfromng makes a statement, that he would rather "cross breed" with a Jamaican than a Greek (Cypriot), although the message comes across being very Racist, I believe it was more about the acceptance of such unions between TC & GC that peoples "15th Century mindset" from both sides, will not allow it.

I was having a dinner with couple of ladies few years ago, who worked for NATO & EU in Brussels. They were Dutch, so we got to the subject of Cyprus and all it's problems. They had asked me the very question regarding intermarriages between Cypriots, or lack of them.

I told them that, if TC males was to be having sex with a GC female, the whole GC community would feel, as if they are the ones being "DONE".

If a GC male was to be having sex with a TC female, the whole TC community would feel, as if they are the one's being "DONE".


This is the "15th Century mentality" for almost all Cypriots.

[DT.]

Not surprised by the incident involving a GCandTC couple. However, I am aware of four cases of GC-TC couples and all of them are doing fine. In fact one of these couples have decided to get married next summer.
I wouldn't be disappointed as any reactions no matter how harsh they might be on people that go against the current and decide to break the taboos are part of the process of raproachment and reconciliation.

Just think back a few years and I am sure that you will notice that such weddings were almost impossible - this was the case prior to 1974 and 1960's as well.

The fact that young TC and GC have gone forward and are willing to fight against these taboos proves that there is a future in this small society called Cyprus.

These are exception I'm afraid.

If the Greek Cypriot Girls are as much protected by their families as Turkish Cypriot Girls are, then there are always going to be problems in their relationships, if the man is from the "other side".

When mrfromng makes a statement, that he would rather "cross breed" with a Jamaican than a Greek (Cypriot), although the message comes across being very Racist, I believe it was more about the acceptance of such unions between TC & GC that peoples "15th Century mindset" from both sides, will not allow it.

I was having a dinner with couple of ladies few years ago, who worked for NATO & EU in Brussels. They were Dutch, so we got to the subject of Cyprus and all it's problems. They had asked me the very question regarding intermarriages between Cypriots, or lack of them.

I told them that, if TC males was to be having sex with a GC female, the whole GC community would feel, as if they are the ones being "DONE".

If a GC male was to be having sex with a TC female, the whole TC community would feel, as if they are the one's being "DONE".


This is the "15th Century mentality" for almost all Cypriots.

It might be better to stick with gay couples then since we'll both get "done"

[askimwos]

The four cases I refered to include both the male being GC and TC.
I understand what you say about the relationships with the female being a TC face more problems as TCs seem to be a more close society when it comes to marriages.

What I have not mentioned is that in all cases that I am aware of the families have either supported the relationship or have not put any obstacles. Of course, all 4 cases come from a left political background but again rapproachment was a left wing thing in the past and now is supported by the majority of the political spectrum.

[Kikapu]

It might be better to stick with gay couples then since we'll both get "done"

DT,

I'm not Gay, but I do not believe being Gay means, that they take turns for getting "DONE".

Anyway, I do get the point you were making. Just don't be surprised, if you start getting comments from others, that you're being ignorant of Gay lifestyle.

[zan]

As an older member of the forum I do hate to see the bitter realities that life shows the younger members. I always get exited about the new discoveries and phases that unfold time and time again in life but also get uncomfortable that each one will leave a new scar. I also feel sorry when I see people that have these realisations want to shut them selves off from it because sometimes it is too much to bear and all hope vanishes. Shame.

People are fickle. We need a sense of belonging and we latch on to the nearest thing we can in order to feel part of something.

I used to go to a Disco (that is what we called them in my day), years ago in Southgate, North London in which the vast majority of the males were Cypriot. Although there were a few Cypriot girls, mostly GC, the vast majority was English. There were the usual English and Black males because it was a Soul Club, there too but were outnumbered greatly by the Cypriots. How do you think these people set themselves up into groups? GCs to one side and TCs to the other? Well, no! It was Arsenal supporters to one side and Tottenham to the other. I remember that there were at least two fights every time we went there and that was nearly every week. One time I can remember watching from the balcony as what seemed like hundreds of people were fighting. It was like a western film.

As individuals, we must not mix our politics with the man on the street. Couples break up everywhere and in all denominations. By putting all your hopes in a couple that happen to be TC and GC to get along and therefore prove that we can all do the same is a roller coaster that has no end. When I see my friend Fedos, I don’t see a GC but an old friend. The fact that the Cyprob makes it difficult for us to be together on the Island of Cyprus is another issue and I am ashamed to say that when he and his family are in the RoC, I feel they are in a place that is foreign, alien and hostile to me. I do not belong in that club or on that side of the hall, in that Disco.

[Kikapu]

I do not belong in that club or on that side of the hall, in that Disco.

But isn't it interesting Zan, that when you take politics out of Cyprus, we Cypriots seem to Dance to the same Music.

There are politics in every country, that not all citizens see eye to eye. The USA is split down the middle, but we can say, we are all Americans, and the country moves on.

In Switzerland the Swiss Germans, French and the Italians do not always see things eye to eye, but at the end of the day, they are all Swiss, and the country moves along.

We can have politics, without having to hate or physically fight each other.

If we can all dance to the same music at the Disco, we should all be able to respect each others political views, without throwing punches. That's the wonderful thing about a "True Democracy", that in time, "we the people" can get rid of "evil" leaders and elect others to take their places.