Cyprus-Forum.com

[Bananiot]

Markides run against Klerides and this probably tilted the balance and led to Papadopoulos being elected.

Anyway, its a sorry state of affairs when someone is accused for such serious violations and he keeps quite. He makes no effort to answer his critics and behaves as though he is above the law. This is his trade mark. Remember the furore when he claimed in all earnesty that not a single soul (TC) was lost between 1963-1974? Well, he has kept silent then too.

[MicAtCyp]

Bananiot,

What do you have to say about Klerides complete silense when the Anan Plan 1 came? Why did he hide in his office and shut his mouth like a sphinx, and let Markides go on TV and shock the GCs in their armachairs? Do you think that it was the proper attitute of a President, for the TOP PRIORITY issue of the people? Do you think it recommends a leader?

Why Makarios Droushiotis, or Loucas Charalambous or any other opposition journalist NEVER questioned the Government spokesman about Papadopoulos alledged statements at the Arab newspaper??? Why they don't question the Government spekesman about the Attorney General Investigations? Is it perhaps because they need something to write in their newspapers for eternity?

[Bananiot]

Why Makarios Droushiotis, or Loucas Charalambous or any other opposition journalist NEVER questioned the Government spokesman about Papadopoulos alledged statements at the Arab newspaper??? Why they don't question the Government spekesman about the Attorney General Investigations? Is it perhaps because they need something to write in their newspapers for eternity?

Alledged statements ...! Anyone can get a paper copy of Papadopoulos's answers from the PIO. Have you ever seen Makarios Drousiotis on a TV panel or chat show? He is one of the most prolific historians in Cyprus at the moment and yet the Papadopoulos controlled TV stations never invite him. He does not exist for them. So here is your answer.

What do you have to say about Klerides complete silense when the Anan Plan 1 came? Why did he hide in his office and shut his mouth like a sphinx, and let Markides go on TV and shock the GCs in their armchairs? Do you think that it was the proper attitute of a President, for the TOP PRIORITY issue of the people? Do you think it recommends a leader?

So Klerides shut himself in his office and probably you know the answer as to why. You should tell us. Klerides also said that if we do not accept the plan, as we were asked by the international community to do, it would be like taking a plunge down a ravine whose depth is unknown.

By the way, two journalists saw and heard Papadopoulos say in Helsinki that partition is the next best solution to a functional and viable solution. These were from Phileleftheros and Politis newaspapers. Yet you chose to believe the RIK reporter who was not even in the room but as always came to the rescue of the President.

[Piratis]

The fascists can not accept the democratic choices of the people. It is really sad that they are trying in all ways possible to remove from power somebody that was democratically elected.

Why don't you just wait for next elections. When Papadopoulos will win again after all the mud you were throwing it at him what would you say?

By the way, have you noticed the recent polls that show that DIKO is the only one from the big parties with significant gains? Sorry Bananiot, but your mud campaign has failed miserably.

[erolz]

The fascists can not accept the democratic choices of the people. It is really sad that they are trying in all ways possible to remove from power somebody that was democratically elected.

Why don't you just wait for next elections. When Papadopoulos will win again after all the mud you were throwing it at him what would you say?

Is it not a 'fundamental requirment of a functioning democracy' (ooh the irony) that dissenting voices be allowed to be heard with out the dissenters being attcked and a called traitors and facists and called on to 'shut up' simply because the do no hold the same view as a numerical majority?

[cypezokyli]

ok it will turn really gc now.
just wondering, did the tc ever disagreed publicly in the forum as we do?

anyway

imo none of our politicians gives a damn about the cyprus problem. and that was at least one positive thing concerning the Aplan. they showed us their real beliefs.
why do i say that?

at the night of the referendum i entered the UN site and found that the bizonal bicommunal thing was there since the early nineties. and they all, let me repeat ALL of them promised all refugees return, all settlers and all armies when they ALL knew what was coming.
lets take names just to have some more fun:
pap has a minister (hristou) who disagreed with him on the most important issue (if i am not mistaken it is the most important issue) and still he accepts him as a minister. the minister himself accepts working for a president someone who disagrees with him on the cyprus problem. ofcource u can say this is not an important issue to leave or kick him out of the goverment
half of the ministers of klerides disagreed with him on the cyprus problem
klerides was using patriotic symbols and speeches for 10 years just to win the elections while he was negotiating sth completely different.
from one point of view that makes him a great politicians. just wave a flag at them and they will vote for you, they dont even know what u r really doing in negotiations
markides was supported by people who disagreed with him on th Aplan. can u understand that? they voted for him and they didnt even discussed what there stance is regarding Aplan 2 which was present at the time. i can just imagine them meeting and saying :
what do we write on our programm regarding the cyprus problem?
just write fair and just solution. that means everything and nothing.
1 year later prodromou rikkos and the rest of the gang had a chaos in theirn opoinion with markides (the person that they voted for president!!!) regarding the Aplan.
a number of important members of AKEL voted yes disagreeing with thir party, but they didnot leave the party. no no no.
ofcource the party is ranked higher in our prororitiiesc than cyprus...
do you realise that on the day of the invasion they all agreed to increease their wages and then they continued with their patriotic b*llsh*tology
i dont want to continue bc i ll get even more pised
....
DIKO was and is a rousfet party. no wonder it will increase
as for pap
just for his history in EOKA and Akritas plan he shouldntn have been voed as a negotiator. just like denktash
to be honest before learning that i used to respect him but even as a president he dissapointed me
-showed his character in the lilikas case, even after the goverment official said that his minister was giving public money to his wife
-the way he treets reporters
-he is responsible for the resign of the one decent highest judge we ever had. (AKEL also)

as for the Aplan
his biggest mistke was NY.
at least for that he should have apoligised
he supported no for his own reasons. at least he had some in comparison to AKEL which had none.
anyway i dont consider him able to find another solution (that is if we are still interested having one).
i somehow didnt get what his plan is which is going to lead us to another solution. i mean ok the Aplan was not good. we rejected it. also ok.
where is the the next plan coming?

in any case i dont consider that anyone of them cares.
only the people coulld do it if they would want....

piratis wrote :

The fascists can not accept the democratic choices of the people. It is really sad that they are trying in all ways possible to remove from power somebody that was democratically elected.

i agree. thats is why the fascist socrates died after a perfectly democratic vote. i would even argue to ban his books on the name of democracy.

[Bananiot]

The list goes on my friend Cypezokyli, it is endless. AKEL made a pact with the very man that ordered the murders of its members during the EOKA period. This was just to have a foothold in the government because 10 years in the doldrums was a very long period. They would side with the devil to this end, let alone Papadopoulos. Anyway, probably the question that we need to answer now is what is Papadopoulos after? What solution does he care for and how is he going about in order to succeed? In my mind he is not interested in BBF and he is taking us on a merry go round asking for things that are even better than the London-Zurich agreements which, by the way, he also rejected, along with each and every plan that was put to us since then. He calls vaguely for a functional and viable solution but he is stating the obvious. If the solution would be viable it has to be functional!

What can I say about Piratis? He reckons that a democratically elected person should be above criticism. This, he claims, is the essence of democracy! Hear this, everybody that criticises the President is a fascist! Can we have a serious conversation with such a person?

The rise of DIKO after Papadopoulos came to power says a lot for our society. It is a perfect example of a society that swimms deep in the corruption ocean. In proper democratic countries ruling parties lose strength after a while but not in this banana republic. Papadopoulos party, when participating in the parliamentary elections of 1981 by itself got a mere 1% but now, when Papadopoulos climbed to the top with the help of AKEL, suddenly he became an ethnarch. We have the leaders we deserve!

Do TC's argue with each other? They got rid of mighty Denktash who was a fatherfigure to many, in a popular uprising. They stood up and were counted despite the obstacles and the intimidation that even saw the murder of Denktash's political oponents. Piratis, you probably know that Kutli Adali was murdered because he turned against the democratically elected Denktash. Perhaps you are calling for this kind of treatment for the GC dissidents. During the Denktash era, his simpetheros (his daughter's father-in-law) was accused, tried and condemned to imprisonment. In our community can anyone seriously envisage something to this extend happening? Sometimes I wonder which is the pseudo state.

[MicAtCyp]

Anyone can get a paper copy of Papadopoulos's answers from the PIO.

Can you then show us or direct us to one of Makaros Droushiotis or any other journalist paper copy of Papadopoulos answer?

Have you ever seen Makarios Drousiotis on a TV panel or chat show?

Yes I ve seen him many times. I know his face, I know his voice, because I saw him on TV many times.

So here is your answer.

Which answer???? You gave absolutely no answer.You just made monologue that only God knows to what the hell is referring to.Here we are not the Delphi oracle nor we are loaded with acids.Let me try once more: Does Droushiotis have his own web site or does he not? Is it difficult for him to upload his evidence there or is it not? Is he the only opposition journalist I mentioned to you? How about Loucas Charalambous? How about the rest of the parade?

So Klerides shut himself in his office and probably you know the answer as to why.

No, I don't know the answer thats why I asked you. Furthermore I asked you if you think that is a proper attitute for a President for the NUMBER ONE issue in comparison with other alledged types of silences that you mentioned in your original post.

Klerides also said that if we do not accept the plan, as we were asked by the international community to do, it would be like taking a plunge down a ravine whose depth is unknown.

I did not ask you what he said for Anan Plan 5. I asked you why he kept complete silence regarding Anan Plan1 three years before that. I ask you why he locked himself in and let Markides deal with the fire.

By the way, two journalists saw and heard Papadopoulos say in Helsinki that partition is the next best solution to a functional and viable solution. These were from Phileleftheros and Politis newaspapers. Yet you chose to believe the RIK reporter who was not even in the room but as always came to the rescue of the President

What I beleive and what I don't beleive is not upto you to tell. It's upto me.

[Piratis]

Is it not a 'fundamental requirment of a functioning democracy' (ooh the irony) that dissenting voices be allowed to be heard with out the dissenters being attcked and a called traitors and facists and called on to 'shut up' simply because the do no hold the same view as a numerical majority?

What can I say about Piratis? He reckons that a democratically elected person should be above criticism. This, he claims, is the essence of democracy! Hear this, everybody that criticises the President is a fascist! Can we have a serious conversation with such a person?

Oh, so what you are making against our president is criticism???
So tell me how exactly criticism will send Papadopoulos to War Crimes Tribunal? No, what these traitors do is asking from the Americans to intervene and forcefully take away from us the leader we elected and that we continue to support. These people do not understand about democracy and they want to force their will on us. If this is called "criticism" then maybe the plans of EOKA B, the Junta and CIA to overthrown Makarios can also be called "criticism"??

We will resist to the fascists successfully this time. You stand no chance.

[Bananiot]

Can you then show us or direct us to one of Makaros Droushiotis or any other journalist paper copy of Papadopoulos answer?

I can do better. You can get a copy from Marios Karayian, the President's ofice secretary.

Yes I ve seen him many times. I know his face, I know his voice, because I saw him on TV many times.

I said Makarios Drousiotis not Makarios. You seem to have mixed up the two Makarios's. Drousiotis on TV many times ... my foot!

Which answer???? You gave absolutely no answer.You just made monologue that only God knows to what the hell is referring to.Here we are not the Delphi oracle nor we are loaded with acids. Let me try once more: Does Droushiotis have his own web site or does he not? Is it difficult for him to upload his evidence there or is it not? Is he the only opposition journalist I mentioned to you? How about Loucas Charalambous? How about the rest of the parade?

Loucas Charalambous made a very serious claim directed at an elected person who happens to be accountable like all elected officers. I remember in the 70's in the UK, Jeremy Thorpe, leader of the then Liberal Party, stood down just because someone said he was a homosexual. By doing so he protected his party. At the time, I do not recall any MikAtCyp's asking for ... evidence. You, however wouldn't know about this kind of political culture.

No, I don't know the answer thats why I asked you. Furthermore I asked you if you think that is a proper attitute for a President for the NUMBER ONE issue in comparison with other alledged types of silences that you mentioned in your original post.

Well, let me now reveal to all the answer. He wanted some private time with his Lilla who later became Irene.

I did not ask you what he said for Anan Plan 5. I asked you why he kept complete silence regarding Anan Plan 1 three years before that. I ask you why he locked himself in and let Markides deal with the fire.

Now, this is a serious question and I smell conspiracy. Now it occurs to me that Klerides has always been outspoken and to go into silence is very fishy. You have a point there.

What I beleive and what I don't beleive is not up to you to tell. It's up to me.

The understatement of the year! Hold your horses, I believe and I grant it to you to believe whatever you like.