Cyprus-Forum.com

[GorillaGal]

GorillaGal, you seem to have an extraordinary overview of the situation in Iraq and deserve some praise for your constant defence of your country's involvement.

Have you considered, I wonder, just what the previous comments you made regarding the rights of the women of Iraq imply ?.

Your idea of 'freedom' is ideally suited to your own decadent culture, where women parade the streets half naked spouting foul language, smoking, drinking and behaving in a fashion that would be an embarrassment to a mule!, do you seriously advocate that this conduct should be adopted by the respectable women of Iraq.

I choose the word 'decadence' advisedly since it means:- of a lower standard than previously existed, in particular with regard to morals.
Would you dis-agree with that interpretation, regardless of the nonsense advanced by our friend 'miltiades'?.

As to your contention that future generations will look back and consider it all worth while, I wonder if the current descendants of the 'Red Indian' races would subscribe to that observation.

You may feel that the gift of 'freedom' your country offers is of value from your stand-point, others, particularly those who are more concerned with their 'spiritual' development and less with their 'bodily' attributes, should be allowed to maintain their respectability, or would you prefer to drag them into the quagmire of filth that permeates your own nation?.

the women of iraq should have every opportunity to get an education. they should have every opportunity to vote. they should be able to dress how they want. they should be able to speak thier minds. they should be protected from the laws that are there to chastise them if they step out of line. who am i to tell them they can't parade around in a bathing suit if they want, or to get a tattoo, or to wear makeup....

[GorillaGal]

well, that is debateable.....

GG your naivity makes me sick! and what you are 50 something?!? you should be ashamed of yourself!

who the hell do you think you are to think that you can actually make presumptions on the lives of the people FOR THEM, who died for a cause that in reality wasnt even to do with their freedom, and regardless of the 600K that died SO FAR, you still beleive it is "debetable" that maybe the SURVIVORS would look back and say "...oh well that was definately worth it, i mean just look at that glorious brand new Mc Donalds, and my flashy new Nikes"!!!

how about i kill your family and tell you its for your own good and that im sure you would appreciate it some day? you would like that, huh?


i am actually shocked

i am in my 40's, not 50's....
and you can be as shocked as you want, but all throughout history, some have died for freedom, some have died for the betterment of others. that's the way it is. that's the way it is always going to be. don't you cypriots think perhaps you should start treating your pets and animals nicer as opposed to telling the americans how thye should treat others. don't you have your own problems to fix? pets are living things and they deserve as much protection as any human.

[GorillaGal]

eliko,
those iraqi's were blowing each other up way before the americans invaded thier country. so whoever it was on this forum who made the assinine comment that they are doing it because they feel they have no other choice because of the americans being there, is ignorant.

[shahmaran]

GG people fight FOR THEIR OWN freedom, they dont get killed by foreign nations FOR THEIR OWN freedom, can you see the twisted diffrence? USA bombing people into freedom is nothing but bullshit, its obvious that it is not going to work and its obvious that it is not the real intention of the US.

Iraq was definately A LOT more peacefull before US came into the game, i mean please show me a time-slice of a few consecutive years in the near Iraqi history before the US invasion, where at least 60 and sometimes 100 people were dying every other day.

Soon the deathtall will match Saddams, and what will you tell them then? That you are saving them from the horrible dictator that killed SO many people?!

"But heyyyy come on guys why the face, look at least you got democracy now and soon you will be able to enjoy seing ladies walking around in miniskirts all round your city, how about that hey....oh and guess what, we own your government too.."

All i can say is that im ever so thankfull that my country is not sitting on any substantial amount of oil....i would definately not want the old Uncle Sam to try "free" me as well

[miltiades]

GorillaGal, you seem to have an extraordinary overview of the situation in Iraq and deserve some praise for your constant defence of your country's involvement.

Have you considered, I wonder, just what the previous comments you made regarding the rights of the women of Iraq imply ?.

Your idea of 'freedom' is ideally suited to your own decadent culture, where women parade the streets half naked spouting foul language, smoking, drinking and behaving in a fashion that would be an embarrassment to a mule!, do you seriously advocate that this conduct should be adopted by the respectable women of Iraq.

I choose the word 'decadence' advisedly since it means:- of a lower standard than previously existed, in particular with regard to morals.
Would you dis-agree with that interpretation, regardless of the nonsense advanced by our friend 'miltiades'?.

As to your contention that future generations will look back and consider it all worth while, I wonder if the current descendants of the 'Red Indian' races would subscribe to that observation.

You may feel that the gift of 'freedom' your country offers is of value from your stand-point, others, particularly those who are more concerned with their 'spiritual' development and less with their 'bodily' attributes, should be allowed to maintain their respectability, or would you prefer to drag them into the quagmire of filth that permeates your own nation?.

May I be " nectarus " and suggest that you stick to your chickens and and leave political philosophy and wisdom for those of us with just a little common sense. Your comments on American society exemplify your extreme hatred of the USA , and as for your comments on the "respectability " that others would wish to retain , they are more than welcome to carry on preserving their respectability in their own perverted worlds where the only justice they receive is that decided by a despot , a dictator and a fascist.

[Eliko]

GorillaGal, thank you for your assessment of me, you are not the first to call me 'ignorant', your old friend from across the sea may also claim that distinction.

I feel as though I am about to be victim to a two-pronged attack now, in a small measure that must be how the Iraqi people felt when your nation assaulted them, however, I am not defenceless as were they, I can defend my corner quite adequately without resorting to insults and personal slurs.

I am in possession of the truth of the matter and am prepared to state it, you are also privy to the same truth but are ashamed to admit it, that is where our opinions are in conflict.

You may not insult my intelligence freely, I have never insulted yours nor do I intend to do so.

Please try to place yourself in the position of an Iraqi woman, forget about what you would like for them and allow them to decide what they want for themselves, they are accustomed to their culture and do not wish to have yours (which they consider to be inferior) foisted upon them.

I also consider their culture to be superior to yours, you are aware of that and we should analyse the differences between us, you are entitled to your views, I to mine.

[Eliko]

miltiades, 10 out of 10 for 'nectarus', I think I am bringing out the best in you sir. X

[cypezokyli]

GorillaGal, you seem to have an extraordinary overview of the situation in Iraq and deserve some praise for your constant defence of your country's involvement.

Have you considered, I wonder, just what the previous comments you made regarding the rights of the women of Iraq imply ?.

Your idea of 'freedom' is ideally suited to your own decadent culture, where women parade the streets half naked spouting foul language, smoking, drinking and behaving in a fashion that would be an embarrassment to a mule!, do you seriously advocate that this conduct should be adopted by the respectable women of Iraq.

I choose the word 'decadence' advisedly since it means:- of a lower standard than previously existed, in particular with regard to morals.
Would you dis-agree with that interpretation, regardless of the nonsense advanced by our friend 'miltiades'?.

As to your contention that future generations will look back and consider it all worth while, I wonder if the current descendants of the 'Red Indian' races would subscribe to that observation.

You may feel that the gift of 'freedom' your country offers is of value from your stand-point, others, particularly those who are more concerned with their 'spiritual' development and less with their 'bodily' attributes, should be allowed to maintain their respectability, or would you prefer to drag them into the quagmire of filth that permeates your own nation?.

the women of iraq should have every opportunity to get an education. they should have every opportunity to vote. they should be able to dress how they want. they should be able to speak thier minds. they should be protected from the laws that are there to chastise them if they step out of line. who am i to tell them they can't parade around in a bathing suit if they want, or to get a tattoo, or to wear makeup....

please do read some history of the region before you both talk about women rights in iraq.
Iraq , yes , it was a dictatorship BUT A SECULAR ONE!...for f****s sake

you have created a twisted image of the arab world and you think that it applies to every arab state.

Iraqi women traditionally have enjoyed more rights, even under the Saddam regime, than women in the surrounding Arab countries. Now with the possibility of a Muslim conservative regime gaining power, Iraqi women are worried that their hard-won rights will be taken away.

In 1970, under Saddam’s secular Baath party, the constitution declared all women and men equal under the law, according to a BBC article on March 31, 2003.

Labor shortages during the ’70s and ’80s caused the government to hire more women. During that peak time of women’s rights, some women walked down the streets in mini-skirts, according to a San Francisco Chronicle article on Jan. 25, 2003. By 1980, women could vote and run for elections, according to the BBC article.

During the Iraq-Iran War in the 1980s and the 1991 Gulf War, women held many of the jobs left by male soldiers. Many of the soldiers did not come back, making women-headed families more common in Iraq, according to an online Women’s E-news article.

Women’s rights took a downturn in Iraq as the economy worsened due to U.N. economic sanctions, (you dont want me toremind you which countries wanted to lift those embargoes and which not ) according to the BBC article. They lost their jobs and abandoned their education; nationwide, women’s literacy figure plummeted.

Even as Saddam changed his party outlook to be more decidedly Islamic so as to gain support from the masses, Iraqi women still enjoy more rights as they are still permitted to hold jobs and attend higher education, all with uncovered faces.

Most important of all, women can participate in the government through suffrage and holding positions in the government. Women had almost 20% of Parliament seats during Saddam’s reign, compared to the average 3.5% in other Middle East parliaments, according to a Press Association article.

the women voting rights were recognized in iraq already in 1980.
why dont you ask when your buddies , Quwait recognised that ? ....2005 perhaps ?
as for the main buddy : Saudi arabia it has not done that yet.... but we dont mind do we ?

i can still remember the rediculous western media a couple of years ago : "elections took place in iraq... women participated as well ! ".... as if women didnot participate before , you lyars

[Eliko]

cypezokyli, I do hope you are not directing your comment to me for I have never made any reference to the voting rights of the Iraqi women, I have constantly asserted that the people of that nation are entitled to conduct the affairs of their country in their own manner, they have their own culture and it should be respected.

The awful attack upon that nation is, in my opinion, a disgrace to the civilised peoples of the entire world.

[Eliko]

cypezokyli, as a follow up to the above comment, may I also congratulate you on your past post when you introduced the subject of the 'Papalagi', I found the article engrossing and wish the subject had attracted more attention. I have read it severally and would recommend others should do so. Many thanks.