Cyprus-Forum.com

[askimwos]

Just see beyond the words. The annan plan was some form of BBF but it handed way too much power to Turkey over Cyprus. It just created a country that would have been a hostage to the motherlands and GB.

Then why hasn't Papadop been trying to resolve those issues with TCs? whats he waiting for? re-election?

And what makes you think that he has not tried? All I remember was AKEL pleading for some changes in the the area of security in order to say yes in the referendum and the TC side and Turkey rejecting them both before and after the referendum. Don't forget that the there is a Congress decision by AKEL on this issue.

Then why hasn't AKEL raised this with Talat? and made it public via the UN providing details, if these are very small changes I am pretty certain there would not be any objection from the TCs people in fact they would raise their voices and apply pressure on the government and Turkey.

That's the point AKEL did that both in Bourgestock and right before the referendum asking UN and the TC side for these changes. Ofcourse these proposals were rejected first and formost by Turkey who wouldn't allow her right of being a guarantor power to be removed and wouldn't allow for all troops to be sent home. Talat did what he was told by his masters and rejected the changes knowing that by doing this the GCs would say no in the referendum.
There are millions of sources on the internet about AKELs call for these changes - have these changes happend it would have been very difficult for Tpap to say no, knowing that the two major parties in the south were going to back the new plan.

[Viewpoint]

askimwos I recall it now Akel wanted to postpone the referendum to make these changes which taking into consideration the agreed procedure in NY was impossible.

[askimwos]

Don't disagree with what you said, however, Talat was quick to reply with a no both in Bourgestog as well as after that and prior to the referendum. This continues to be mr Talat's position until today, he even refuses to exchange EU for Turkish and Greek troops as the anan plan described.
Now tell me why the hell does he refuse to do this? Btw the last is a rhetorical question and I do not expect an answer...

[Viewpoint]

Talats position is not made an easier by Papadop, he is sandwiched between Turkey and the GCs trying to take steps forward but being criticized every time he opens his mouth. The bridge fiasco for example shouldn't the GCs have embraced the move positively and made similar gestures of goodwill by knocking down the wall and agreeing all the other conditions along the way.

The GCs have to take bold steps and they will not do this as long Papadop is in office, when hes gone you maybe able to decide on unity measures but will you find Talat/Soyer in office the swing has started in the north towards the much hardened nationalistic party UBP as they show that this government has been unable to agree anything with GCs as this is impossible and that they also faced the same problems when in office and were thrown out on the solution card which CTP promoted.

[askimwos]

Talats position is not made an easier by Papadop, he is sandwiched between Turkey and the GCs trying to take steps forward but being criticized every time he opens his mouth. The bridge fiasco for example shouldn't the GCs have embraced the move positively and made similar gestures of goodwill by knocking down the wall and agreeing all the other conditions along the way.

The GCs have to take bold steps and they will not do this as long Papadop is in office, when hes gone you maybe able to decide on unity measures but will you find Talat/Soyer in office the swing has started in the north towards the much hardened nationalistic party UBP as they show that this government has been unable to agree anything with GCs as this is impossible and that they also faced the same problems when in office and were thrown out on the solution card which CTP promoted.

Vp I agree with you on saying that Talat is in the middle but again one needs to ask what did Talat managed to do was to totally allienate himself from the GCs as well. At the begging the GC had a lot of faith in him and that something would have changed but nowadays it is not the case. The whole thing about the isolation is something that CTP wouldn't have used 5 years ago. Instead of concentrating on the solution of the problem he seems to be following a different agenda and that is the recognition of his state. Tell me how different is that from Dektash policy? At the beggining the GCs understood that he was having some problems because of the GC no in the referendum, however, this game has gone too far.
Here there is an agreement (8th July) why the hell doesn't he negotiate on the basis of this? The whole oil issue may well be discussed in the context of this agreement. Where there is will there is a way.
As for the bridge fiasco, don't forget that it was the Turkish army who erected the bridge in the first place. Hadn't the done this the whole issue would have been resolved 18 months ago. I am optimistic on this one, it will take some time but we are going to get there.

[Viewpoint]

askimwos I think you are being slightly unfair as never forget people react in accordance with the responses one gets and he is not getting many positive signals from Papadop or the GC people. Gcs have to take the lead and invite TCs to work with them in order to eliminate the mistrust and create an atmosphere where both sides can work towards unification.

The 8th July agreement delay is not just down to Talat we hear the opposite and hear the Papadop is still preparing the preparation for talking to us. When you consider that Papadop cannot have another negative result in the eyes of the world then I think you can work who is delaying.

The oil issue lets talk when you actually find something.

[GorillaGal]

VP, I hope we can all be productive in this forrum and use it just for that, to create the solution for the Cyprus Problem the more time we spend on sqabling and blaming and expecting the other side to create the right conditions, we are a day away from solving it, if we unite on this forum and use our time constructively I am sure we can come up with the basis of a plan, something we could send to our leaders in a formal manner that they would need to consider it.


If both sides created the right conditions we could unify and come together as a nation and as a peoples that is proud to be Cypriot, regardless of age sex religious or ethnic background. if turkish and greek cypriots make up some of the population of Australia and live and work together in harmony why can they not achieve it in Cyprus?

Living in Australia and living your own country are 2 different things humanist, you choose to move to Australia and you know you are going to be ruled by them plus you do not have bad history with them so you are sure they will not try to exploit or dominate you in anyway. We on the other hand are the product of hidden agendas and due to the past we question everything in the future. The GCs have problems dealing with equality and TC have a problem with trusting GCs.

The conditions necessary to encourage one Cypriot people will not come about if the 2 sides do not talk to each other without outside inference. This is where the key is the side with international recognition should be making bold moves towards the TCs showing they have changed and can cater for TCs in a truly democratic and human rights respecting manner. This is not the message we get quite the opposite, instead of creating solutions to problems they take measures to ensure they continue and become even more perplexed, this is how TCs view things and decide that we do not belong in the "RoC" or united with GCs and we are best of going with what we know the TRNC and Turkey.

imagine that, "hidden agendas" in Cyprus? i don't believe it!

[G.Man]

NO NO NO!!!! (from a true GC with roots on the other side)

So what would you say to all your refugee GC friends that have land in the north and along the green line? Kiss it goodbye?

I may not be a GC, but I have many friends that want a resolution so they can get their land back!

[ken910]

alexios - on the matter of compensation there r now compensation bodies that any persons with ligit demands can go and demand thier dues, so the monatery excuses are none ,so the only reason left that i can c is nationalistic am i correct or can u think of other reasons?

[ken910]

g man get youre friends to ask 4 compensation that is all no need to kiss good bye anything