Cyprus-Forum.com

[shahmaran]

so basically what you are saying is, we r the majority we rule, u are minority so deal with it, coz i believe that was the case in cyprus before it all went gunho.

coming back to what i said, i beleive i said only 1 thing,

now my understanding of "jungle rules" is very much on the Darwinian side. survival of the fittest and so forth.

Barbarism is one way to wipe out a nation but not soo effective nor poppular these days, so instead u can just liquidify them, promise them better lives and slowly assimilate them and make them a part of you. thats how thoose lovely successfull democracies that "we should follow" keep the wheel turning. now that i believe still holds the fundamental laws of the jungle, just a much more "humane" and politically correct way to do it. and to be honest im not really up for it.

so i have a crazy idea, how about we give YOU passports and u can come live in your properties deal? :p

[bill cobbett]

Absolutely right. I hear so much about compromises. The net is full of Anan Plans 1 to 101 and counting. I would agree with anyone who says solutions must include as their basis, as the starting point, a total commitment to the basic human rights enjoyed in the rest of the EU and elsewhere, for both communities. These would include such matters as the rights of the minority community to security, to equal job opportunities, to equal treatment before the institutions of the Republic etc; the right for a return of property to 1974 owners and a whole host of matters. This isn't an exhaustive list and so it shouldn't. People must add to it their own grievances, their own concerns and their own hopes and dreams and what is more expect them to be met in full.

Compromises are a palliative or band-aid that may buy you some time but as sure as eggs is eggs unless the fears and dreams of all are met are met and met, in full, you will do nothing except store up trouble for your children or their children to sort out.

Now, quite style of language they use to express these ideas, and that was remember the original post, I do not know other than to say that if you expect a full and frank exchange from which some sort of truth might emerge, then, well... you must expect a degree of less than temperate language. I would however put the boundary below the level that deters others from having their say.

[shahmaran]

hey man that sounds lovely if it ever came to exist and everything is fair and square i would be more then merry to share my garden with a greek brother, but i believe it wasnt us who didnt like the recent "compromises" put forward, and in return they go into EU and we get buggerall, lovely! thats EU for you....

[bill cobbett]

If you want to help build the New Jerusalem brother publish your personal list of fears and dreams using the modest style of language of the Imans or Bishops, lest we offend anyone.

[shahmaran]

to be honest i would not do anything that resembles an ImaM or a Bishop, i find them profoundly annoying and worthless, however thanks for the tip BROTHER, if i ever decide to help build a New Jerusalem (!!) i would make sure to contact you for more interesting tips...

[bill cobbett]

I agree with your comments about Imans and Bishops.

[Piratis]

so basically what you are saying is, we r the majority we rule, u are minority so deal with it, coz i believe that was the case in cyprus before it all went gunho.

What I am saying is that we are all Cypriots. If you split Cypriots based on ethnic background, then since 82% have Greek ethnic background and 18% have Turkish, the naturally those with Turkish background are a minority. I don't say this, numbers do. In the same way, blonds in Cyprus are a minority as well. Rich people are minority also. Nothing wrong with that as long as you live in a truly democratic country were everybody is respected.

What is wrong however is not to accept a simple fact (that 18% is less than 82%) and try to change this fact by committing ethnic cleanings and other atrocities.

Barbarism is one way to wipe out a nation but not soo effective nor poppular these days, so instead u can just liquidify them, promise them better lives and slowly assimilate them and make them a part of you.

Sounds very similar to what Turkey is doing to you right now. If Turkey succeeds in her aim, then TCs will become something like a 0.001 minority of Turks. In a united Cyprus with Turkish an official language (and an official language of EU because of that) and with the TCs having their deserved proportional or even boosted power and say in Cyprus and EU, not only TCs will not be assimilated but they can flourish as European community as well.

[shahmaran]

im sorry did you say WE r trying to ethnically clens YOU?! the turkish cypriots with no army?? i think we r both trying to argue the same point but based on 2 totally opposite grounds. see i always thought it was the greeks who started the atrocities on the minorities, hence my stand on the need for the separation to keep you away from us, not vice versa....i think if we disaggree on these points then there is not much left to discuss, since we both seem to think that we r the victims of the opposite sides....but returning to my argument on my beliefs, the point is not who is the minority (coz clearly its us) but how you have been treating the minority over the years before the war...plus i would much rather be assimilated by other turks (if that is possible) than greeks, no offence, but as cypriot as i am im still turkish...but yes we r still all cypriots and yes we should be united, i just dont see this bringing fairness and peace to the island as it is at the moment...

[Piratis]

im sorry did you say WE r trying to ethnically clens YOU?! the turkish cypriots with no army??

No, I was talking about the Turkish army and not TCs, and I didn't say they "tried", I said they did, which is a fact not "trying" theories, but something which in fact happened. The northern part of Cyprus (like the rest of the island) has a Greek Cypriot majority. In Famagusta, Kerynia, Morfou, Karpasia and 100s of villages in the now occupied areas Greek Cypriots lived for 1000s of years. And then in 1974 all 200.000 of them were forcefully removed from the places they and their ancestors were born and they are still denied their right to return. This is a text book case of ethnic cleansing.

see i always thought it was the greeks who started the atrocities on the minorities, hence my stand on the need for the separation to keep you away from us, not vice versa

If we are going to start the "who started it game" then you have to go a few centuries back and the answer is obvious but I don't see a point in doing that.
What happened in the early 60s was not one sided atrocities by one side against the other, but an intercommunal conflict were both sides had about an equal number of victims.
TCs were both the victims and the aggressors in that time (the same with GCs) but unfortunately you are only taught half of the story.

[zan]

im sorry did you say WE r trying to ethnically clens YOU?! the turkish cypriots with no army??

No, I was talking about the Turkish army and not TCs, and I didn't say they "tried", I said they did, which is a fact not "trying" theories, but something which in fact happened. The northern part of Cyprus (like the rest of the island) has a Greek Cypriot majority. In Famagusta, Kerynia, Morfou, Karpasia and 100s of villages in the now occupied areas Greek Cypriots lived for 1000s of years. And then in 1974 all 200.000 of them were forcefully removed from the places they and their ancestors were born and they are still denied their right to return. This is a text book case of ethnic cleansing.

see i always thought it was the greeks who started the atrocities on the minorities, hence my stand on the need for the separation to keep you away from us, not vice versa

If we are going to start the "who started it game" then you have to go a few centuries back and the answer is obvious but I don't see a point in doing that.
What happened in the early 60s was not one sided atrocities by one side against the other, but an intercommunal conflict were both sides had about an equal number of victims.
TCs were both the victims and the aggressors in that time (the same with GCs) but unfortunately you are only taught half of the story.

What matters is the first president of the first republic of Cyprus started it so stop this rubbish about centuries and look at the facts