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[Pyrpolizer]

In other words Piratis you should degenerate to an ape, so that the Zans would feel first class.

[zan]

[Pyrpolizer]

Let me ask you straight Zan.
Do you consider the TCs incapable of catching up with the GCs? Do you consider them genetically faulty or something?

[zan]

Let me ask you straight Zan.
Do you consider the TCs incapable of catching up with the GCs? Do you consider them genetically faulty or something?

The point is not whether they can catch up, of course they can, but how and when.


Fling open the doors to unification and hope?
What structure is going to be put in place to ensure that they do?
Can we ensure a way before unification?


My example of SA is testament to the difficulties. My understanding of the situation of unification is that not only do the GCs want to return to their properties but want hundreds of thousands of pounds in compensation which will automatically take them to the top of the social scale. The landowners will be GC to the point of saturation. Where does this leave the TCs? Well let me tell you. We will be the service providers. We will be the rent payers. We will be the employed. Of course I am talking about majorities here and not in total. I hope that paints a picture in which you can see where I am coming from even if you do not agree with me.

[Pyrpolizer]

OK. Since we have agreed that the TCs are totally capable of catching up with the GCs, then the obvious answer to your first question of "when" is yavas-yavas. And the answer to you question of "how" is by hard work.


....


Have to go now, we continue later.

[Pyrpolizer]

OK let’s continue

From what you said it is obvious that all your concerns arise from the property issue.

Well lets cut the property pie into some pieces to have a clear picture.

Before 1974 the TCs were about 120,000. Only half of those are actually refugeesithe rest are original inhabitants having their own properties at the northern part. So the property issue is a problem ONLY for those 60,000 TCs.

The GC refugees in 1974 were 180,000. Considering about 40,000 are from Famagusta, and that some another 50,000 will return under GC Fed State then the property issue remains pending for about 90,000 GCs

From those 60,000 TCs at least a quarter will be able to exchange their own properties with an equal number of GC refugees, so in the end we are left with 45,000 TCs holding properties of 75,000 GCs having on the average nothing to pay.

Paying rent is a logical social compromise, compared with the capitalistic approach of "get out of my property" go live in the streets.On the other hand think about to whom will they be paying rent? To a person who was practically outsted, living for yeeeears under terrible conditions, and who in the end will again pay the price of been deprived his own property for the sake of a solution.

So your conclussion that overall the TCs will be losing basically errs to the fact that only a fraction of them will be in difficult economic conditions, and hey the GC refugees who will still be deprived their properties will be double as many.

You talked about compensation for loss of use from the TCs. Absolutely not. You cannot ask for compensation from a person who was simply a victim of circumstances.The same way the TCs will not be able to ask for compensation for loss of use from GC refugees living in their homes.
Maybe Turkey will be asked to pay compensation or sued at EU courts, but that is not our bussiness.

Your image of the situation in SA is totally irrelevant. In SA the blacks were and are by majority illiterate. In fact one of their major tribes the Zulu were cannibals until the 50s. They need aeons to catch up. It is not the same with the TCs. Their education is equal to the GCs, they have no limits to catch up other than on a standard of living. Nothing else.

What would the alternative be? Stay as we are? Are the TCs hapy now, living in uncerainty, living in properties that don’t belong to them, in an isolated puppet state controled by the deep state with settlers coming almost uncontrollable? And what if Turkey enters the EU finally, how are the TCs going to deal with the property issue then? Agreed partition is absolutely impossible, so what are the alternatives? Dreams upon dreams?


I think I left out one point, that of the return of refugees. Think logically! Everybody says will return but how many do you think they will actually return? And if they return where are they going to stay? I tell you no more than 10% will return. And from those very few will live at their original houses. Most propably they will build houses somewhere else, either using money they already have or by selling exchanged property.

To summarise. Arithmetically the solution will be bitter to more GCs than TCs as far as the property issue is concerned. Politically it will be bitter only for the GCs.For the TCs it will be salvation. Safetywise the Tcs will be concentrated in the Northern part and administered by themselves.

NB. I forgot to mention the settlers. Yes those settlers who will finally stay will most propably be on bottom of the social ladder. The question is:At what step of the social ladder were they when they were in Turkey, at what step are they now? Some of them will catch up, some will move to Germany, some will stay here under difficult conditions. Kismet.

[Pyrpolizer]

I also forgot to mention the properties in the buffer zone, which is admitedly a considerable amount. You yourself said you have most of your properties in the buffer zone, am I right?

[zan]

Sorry I am a bit late getting back to you pyro but the realities of getting back to work after a long break has hit me a bit hard this year.



Anyway back to the subject.


You are playing with numbers that are picked from the air again like your 30,000 Turkish workers under glass . You can't just guess at these things and expect me to accept them.


Never the less they are not fully representative of the problem. The problem is that the infrastructure is not there in the north. We have been subjected to embargoes that have not allowed us to build the businesses and banks and all the other parts of the system that will help us climb the ladder. Having money in the bank is not the be all and end all of the problem. We have had to subsist in conditions where only small businesses exist and therefore the opening of any gates as such will mean that we will be steam rolled over by the GC system. Yes that is beginning to change so your yavash yavash or siga siga will have to be another 40 years before we can safely say we can hold our own in such a scenario.


As for belittling the SA blacks by saying they are illiterate to the last is pure nonsense. Even their vast numbers and the fact that they are immensely talented in many ways still keeps them down. They have no infrastructure of their own. But like us they are getting there.