Cyprus-Forum.com

[Issy1956]

Kifeas,
Is the same Claire Palley that has been the Constitutional Law adviser to Cypriot governments since 1980. Clearly a neutral on the subject sure to be objective and unbiased about the whole thing.

[Piratis]

Word of warning: Claire Palley is on the pay roll of Papadopoulos.

And you on the payroll of the Turks.

That is why you promote their Annan partition plan and you are trying by all means to harm Republic of Cyprus.

[Bananiot]

Yes it is the same Claire Palley. I think she is no longer holding this position however. She probably retired a few months ago. I have read chunks of the book and some parts are quite interesting. After all she has been around in important discussions on the cyprob for so long. The book clearly gives the Papadopoulos prospective and it hardly constitutes an unbiased effort. Probably she made a mess of describing and explaining the events in New York in December 2003, but there was little she could do, since she was compelled to give support to the Papadopoulos approach that went terribly wrong because Papadopoulos thought he could rely on the usual Turkish intransigence to save our day. Of course, Papadopoulos failed miserably to evaluate properly the huge changes that were taking place in Turkey at the time. Thus, he had to deceive the world in order to get out of the predicament he put himself in.

Piratis, spare us the agony. She was on the payroll, it is no secret. Why do you always react so childish? You are giving a very bad impressions to outsiders for us Cypriots.

[Kifeas]

Word of warning: Claire Palley is on the pay roll of Papadopoulos.

You are also on the payroll of Papadopoulos, as a highly paid state employee, yet no one stops you from publicly supporting and promoting the Turkish pan-turanist propaganda and objectives on the Cyprus issue, which aim at vindicating and legitimizing the ethnic cleansing, usurping and Turkification of 37% of the Greek Cypriot's ancestral and historical homeland.

[BirKibrisli]

Wasn't it the Roman emperor Nero who was playing the flute, or something, while Rome was burning?

Sometimes I get the feeling that this is what we are doing in these forums.The partition of our country is more and more entrenched each passing day,but we are still busy digging up the past,and using decades old arguments to attack each other.

The Turkish general in charge of "Cyprus Turkish Peace Corps" was in the Karpaz region recently and was greeted with slogans like "Army and nation hand in hand" and "We don't want a life without the Army"...

This attitude (blind nationalism) is on the rise in the North and I imagine in the South as well.What are we going to do to save our beloved Cyprus from permanent partition? What are we going to do to convince Turkey,Britain and Greece to take their soldiers and their bases (and their mothers too,to borrow a phrase from Erdogan!)and leave us alone to rebuild our nation? But above all what are we doing to make the TCs feel secure enough to shed their blindness and embrase their Cypriotness?

[Viewpoint]

Wasn't it the Roman emperor Nero who was playing the flute, or something, while Rome was burning?

Sometimes I get the feeling that this is what we are doing in these forums.The partition of our country is more and more entrenched each passing day,but we are still busy digging up the past,and using decades old arguments to attack each other.

The Turkish general in charge of "Cyprus Turkish Peace Corps" was in the Karpaz region recently and was greeted with slogans like "Army and nation hand in hand" and "We don't want a life without the Army"...

This attitude (blind nationalism) is on the rise in the North and I imagine in the South as well.What are we going to do to save our beloved Cyprus from permanent partition? What are we going to do to convince Turkey,Britain and Greece to take their soldiers and their bases (and their mothers too,to borrow a phrase from Erdogan!)and leave us alone to rebuild our nation? But above all what are we doing to make the TCs feel secure enough to shed their blindness and embrase their Cypriotness?

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

[Piratis]

Wasn't it the Roman emperor Nero who was playing the flute, or something, while Rome was burning?

Sometimes I get the feeling that this is what we are doing in these forums.The partition of our country is more and more entrenched each passing day,but we are still busy digging up the past,and using decades old arguments to attack each other.

The Turkish general in charge of "Cyprus Turkish Peace Corps" was in the Karpaz region recently and was greeted with slogans like "Army and nation hand in hand" and "We don't want a life without the Army"...

This attitude (blind nationalism) is on the rise in the North and I imagine in the South as well.What are we going to do to save our beloved Cyprus from permanent partition? What are we going to do to convince Turkey,Britain and Greece to take their soldiers and their bases (and their mothers too,to borrow a phrase from Erdogan!)and leave us alone to rebuild our nation? But above all what are we doing to make the TCs feel secure enough to shed their blindness and embrase their Cypriotness?

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

You are doing nothing Viewpoint? You are working for partition since 50s, you promote crimes and illegalities, you do everything you can to partition Cyprus, you call that nothing?

Bir, Turkey and Britain can not be "convinced" just with words. What they care about is their strategic interests and those will not change with words. The same for TCs. What they care is about how to gain on our loss, not about words. (this was proven time after time in this forum)

The only thing we can do now is to be patient, like we have been during many times in our history and be ready to reclaim our land with the first chance that will be given.

[Viewpoint]

Wasn't it the Roman emperor Nero who was playing the flute, or something, while Rome was burning?

Sometimes I get the feeling that this is what we are doing in these forums.The partition of our country is more and more entrenched each passing day,but we are still busy digging up the past,and using decades old arguments to attack each other.

The Turkish general in charge of "Cyprus Turkish Peace Corps" was in the Karpaz region recently and was greeted with slogans like "Army and nation hand in hand" and "We don't want a life without the Army"...

This attitude (blind nationalism) is on the rise in the North and I imagine in the South as well.What are we going to do to save our beloved Cyprus from permanent partition? What are we going to do to convince Turkey,Britain and Greece to take their soldiers and their bases (and their mothers too,to borrow a phrase from Erdogan!)and leave us alone to rebuild our nation? But above all what are we doing to make the TCs feel secure enough to shed their blindness and embrase their Cypriotness?

ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

You are doing nothing Viewpoint? You are working for partition since 50s, you promote crimes and illegalities, you do everything you can to partition Cyprus, you call that nothing?

Bir, Turkey and Britain can not be "convinced" just with words. What they care about is their strategic interests and those will not change with words. The same for TCs. What they care is about how to gain on our loss, not about words. (this was proven time after time in this forum)

The only thing we can do now is to be patient, like we have been during many times in our history and be ready to reclaim our land with the first chance that will be given.

and what are people like you doing Piratis? answer me that, you create enough negativity to put TCs wanting to live with people like you for ever, you do more harm than good the sad part is you don't realize this and continue to fuel division indirectly, at least I am honest and have the guts to admit that we are 2 communities who will never compromise enough to unite and that we should accept this fact and move on. Just ask yourself this question before its to late how would you feel if the North was recognized, and GCs could return to live there under TC administration cause that's where we are headed although your arrogance and blindness wont allow you to see it. Continue to irritate the USA you are doing a great job and the day will come when you will cry out for the Annan plan to be returned, but it will be too late.

[reportfromcyprus]

Do you really want to know or are you lining me up for another zinger?

Report, to cut a long story short, you said:
"You've just admitted that the plan was negotiated, since it changed forms."

Now tell me (a) where have I admitted that the plan was negotiated and (b,) if the above is a logical statement for one to have made?

You have said in other words that, because a chair has 4 legs, as many as a dog has, then the dog is a chair. Is it a logical thing to say that because the plan changed forms, it means that it was negotiated and agreed? Couldn't the authors -Lord Haney, Annan and de Sotto had simply modified their own brain child, on their own accords, without necessarily this being the result of negotiations and agreed changes by the interesting parties? Of course it is possible, and as a matter of fact this was the case, from one version to the next one. Yet, you make the above illogical assumption and conclusion, that only a child that had not yet developed logic to its fullest could have possibly made!

Furthermore, you said: “And they did sign it, and in the final version was this statement:”
Isn’t this a complete nonsense?

The only thing the two leaders signed was to give Kofi Annan the right to make amendments to his previous version’s plan -which they did not sign either, and then put the final product (after the whatever amendments) in front of the people in a referendum, to approve or reject it. The two leaders did not agree to accept the content of the plan themselves, but only to ask the people if they accept it or not! The two leaders only agreed with Kofi Annan to ask the people in a referendum, and not to accept or sign the plan themselves! They would have agreed with it and sign it as the solution of the Cyprus issue, only if the people would have accepted it.

I said and I repeat again that you should at least first lean what you are trying to talk about, and then attempt with the assertiveness of ten Einsteins to criticise anyone -set aside the very president himself, for their positions and views.

Start from this book, and you will learn a lot!

http://www.amazon.com/International-Rel ... F8&s=books

You are right, Kifeas, that the plan wasn't signed and approved by our leaders except for giving Annan the right to make amendments to the plan. That still implies negotiation...in bad faith...but negotiation all the same.

Neither leader had any intention of changing things for the better, I am not impressed by either Denktash or Papadopoulos and not afraid to criticise if I feel it necessary, it's my right to speak my opinion.

What I'm getting at is a simple thing; we are talking about bias, about companies like the financial times being a mouthpiece for the foreign office, about Cyprus being forced into things against its will and getting a bad reputation in the international press because of propaganda. This paranoia and negativity has created a new atmosphere in cyprus, we're going through our own cold war and it started from the childish behaviour of the leaders during the Annan Plan negotiations.

I think it's dangerous and I think that people need to rethink their approach and start creating some goodwill instead. Gestures that will make the international press pay attention in a positive way.

Things like bicommunal activities that are genuinely directed to bringing people together, constructive actions that change the mood for the better instead of creating even more bitterness. Stories of human being cooperating despite their differences. The stories now are all about the rifts, divisions and anger about the past and they're being run in many respected publications.

[miltiades]

Reportfromcyprus , have noted your comments re: AP . Let us not forget the plan was rejected by the people . Th e people exercised their democratic right and casted their votes. They did not vote against a solution they voted against a solution that was unacceptable to the vast majority .That the Plan was unacceptable to the majority is a matter that the UN , USA , and Brittain ought to take on board. No solution can survive if it does not have the support of the majority.

You have read some of my posts I'm sure , and I know that my views are shared by all those Cypriots who want a solution to the problem but a solution that will not take us back to conflict. Foreign powers such as Turkey and Greece as well as the UK must reduce drastically their influence in Cyprus and allow the Cypriots to adopt their true identity.
In one of my posts I stated that nothing would make me happier than to have a T/C as leader of a political party working for the benefit of the nation , and should this party come to power I will applaud the President regardless of ethnicity. Likewise may T/Cs would be ready to afford the same respect to a party whose leader is a G/C but working for the benefit of the nation and not for a foreign power.