Cyprus-Forum.com

[Nexties]

Nexties says, "According to the very latests polls 70% of Americans disapprove of the way President Bush is handling Iraq. Support, now at an all time low of 28%, continues to steadily decline. The Republican Party of President Bush just lost control of the Congress in both the House of Representatives and the Senate. As of this post President Bush has 763 days left in office."
Nexties concludes, "However, anger over the events of September 11th is still something most of the 300,000,000 Americans have in common."

[humanist]

Gorilla yes I am gay and I do like a man or two in uniform ...... make of this what ever you like.

I maintain my stance that the invasion of Iraq is no less an act of terrosim than the events of september. If it makes you feel better I am an Australian who is ashamed of our prime ministers decision to invade Iraq.

I don't believe that women of Iraq are better off today than they were a few years ago. I do not believe that there has not been a woman of Iraq that has not been affected by the war on Iraq, that has not lost a loved one, hence traumatised by the experienced. I find rather arogant of so called westernised nations who have the need to potray a picture to the world that they know best. I do not make an apology for having my views that the invasion of Iraq by the coalition forces led by Bush has caused more pain and sorrow to people of Iraq, Once again I refer to the "News Hour" most of America feels that the Bush administration has been less than upfront and honest about the Iraq war.

I also refer you to the organisations within the US who have been set up to assist those American parents, brothers, sisters, wives, children of those young American men and women who have lost their lives in Iraq.

raw I am not prepared to give any accounts on Iraqi history you may wish to google the information yourself.

All I know is that the Australian government had insights into AWB (Australian Wheat Board) giving kickbacks to Sadams regime and did nothing about it.

In all what I am saying is that there are no innocent governments out there but many innocent lives are lost on daily basis. If you do not wish to accept that the american government has acted innappropriately in its invasion of Iraq that is fine that is your view and you are entitled to own it. But please do not personally attack me by calling me names just accept that we are two people who sahere different views. What you wish to support that is entirely your right but do not sqaush my beliefs.

[miltiades]

Humanist , I think it was Kifeas who suggested that you are confused , I most certainly second that.
The are millions of people the world over who are confused so you are not on your own.
Let me just say that America owes it to the free world to further intervene in a number of rogue states and stop their ambition to wipe out entire nations. We have George Bush now , will we in the future have a statesman as well . I wonder .

[humanist]

763 days thats a lot of deaths and peril .... sorry to hear.

[Natty]

Wow...Nexties angry is actually pretty scary....

[cypezokyli]

Let me just say that America owes it to the free world to further intervene in a number of rogue states and stop their ambition to wipe out entire nations. We have George Bush now , will we in the future have a statesman as well . I wonder .

after the current defeat do you think they will dear to attack iran ?
did you read what their advisers told them to do ?


...btw hows that old afganistan doing ? are people convinced of the "well intended democratic process" ?

[Kikapu]

Our friend Kikapu showed us figures some time ago showing that the value of oil produced at Iraq, is less than what it costs the Americans to have the Iraq war and sustain their presense there. So I wonder what is the REAL reason they did it.

Pyrpolizer,

I really did not want to get into this again, but since you asked, how can I refuse.!!

We still have a lot of people who want to look the other way, and not face the facts. It is easier to do that, than accept the truth. I suppose every person have the right to be an idiot, and choose to live in the dark, but please allow the rest of us to speak the truth, so that we can open the eyes of the "gullible", and may I say, we're are succeeding. We have gone from 75% approval for the Iraq war, down to 28% in the USA. Of course, there is still work to be done, on few more "hard core Bushies" members on this forum. No need to name names. You all know who you are.

Now, as to why we went into Iraq.?

All you need to do, is to read this "Statement of Principles" from "PNAC", Project for the New American Century. You don't have to read the whole document, just this www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm and see who wrote and signed it. You will notice, George Bush's name is not on it, because he is not the "sharpest knife" in the draw. Bush is being used by those around him, just because he is an Idiot.

Going to war, is what the NeoCons wanted, to rule the Middle East, and it's people, and the uninterrupted flow of oil, to feed the American economy. Iraq was going to be a show case. Next would have been Syria, then Iran, then gradually to Saudi Arabia. The mistake that the NeoCons made, was, that they did not figure out, that all these other Arab countries had already figured this out in advance, and that America could not be trusted, that Iraq was the only target. That's why, all the Arab countries did not want America to attack Iraq, whether Saddam had WMD or not. Saddam was trusted more than USA, even if he had WMD. Since we invaded Iraq, now, all these countries are helping fuel the violence in Iraq, to help defeat their "common enemy", the USA.

Bush went to war, so that he can push his Conservative ideals, helping BIG business making as much money as possible. Wars are great way to spend "peoples money" on Defence contractors, which the Daddy Bush, is heavily involved in as well as oil. So Bush in essence went to war, to rob close to $$500 Billion$$ US Dollars from the Treasury, to fund this war. Can you think of another reason, why Bush has not changed tactics in Iraq, and maintain "staying the course", is because, they have the right formula to "bleed the American Treasury" into the pockets of BIG business, so for the remainder of Bush's 2 years in office, Bush will continue to play the role of "Robbin Hood", except, he will take it from the poor, and give it to the rich. But as a result, Bush also created a "runaway train" in the Middle East, that's going to crash with terrible consequences for the "West" of tomorrow.

All these people that brought shame on America, plus Blair and that little shit Howard from "down under", all deserve to be sitting in jail, along with Saddam. "They all committed the crime, so they should all do the time"

[cypezokyli]

just to add some few more facts to kikapus story.
saddam already signed contracts for more exploration of iraqs oil fields with french , chinese and russian companies surprised that they were against the war ? .....surpised that from the late 90s they were pushing for an end to the embargo ? ... surprised that these contracts are not considered valid anymore?..... i am not telling you who will have these contracts today
so it was not so much to get saddams oil. but to prevent others from getting to it

saddam wanted to get paid in euros. the petrodollars for years helped the american economy. the problem was not so much the quantity of euros used to buy iraqs oil. the problem is the chain reaction this might had - or the new leverage each oil producer would have against the US. dont forget that what started the nationalisation of oil companies in the middle east was an insignificant oil-exporting country.

moreover saddam posed an embarrassement to the US , since the (non-smart) sanctions actually strengthened his position , instead of bringing his downfall. he had ambitions for regional hegemony , but that is over now.... ironically by pushing saddam out of the picture they have strngthened the position of iran in the region. so rediculous are their achievements.


i cannot really say what the real outcome was , since as i said above the US-led coalition is experiencing a defeat. from a defeat one cannot go back and search for the targets.

[Pyrpolizer]

Very well explained Kikapu I believe you are absolutely right in what you wrote.

Robbing peoples money seems to be the new fashion everywhere in the World, and the so called defense spending is the number 1 way. Of course here in Cyprus we discovered some other ways long forgotten elsewhere like the Cyprus stock Exchange where we all lost our lifetime savings... I am sorry if this might offend our friend GorillaGal but I beleive the average American citizen is practically living in the dark. That's very strange for a country who imported most of worlds finest brains there.


@Cypezokyli:

I heard about this shifting of the oil producing countries towards the Euro as they don't really trust the US$ which has nothing to back it up in value. I heard that was a nightmare for the Americans as their currency would practically flank -it actually did Vs the Euro. So, do you know how the matter stands today, I mean how many OPC sell in Euro and how many in $? Or were they all forced to transact in holy US$ by the Americans?

[miltiades]

We shall see soon. As far as the free world is concerned the only thing that Afghanistan offers the world is drugs.
If I had my way I would most certainly piss off out of Afghanistan and let these prehistoric savages kill each other and have a race as to who gets to paradise first.