Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

Turkish and Greek Cypriots can live in harmony and peace as each other`s "neighbours", but not as each other`s "administrators".

The ones that choose to be our "administrators" are the Turks that came to Cyprus and oppressed us for 300 years. We certainly didn't invite any Turks to come to Cyprus so we can administer them.

Turks should stop their racist attitude and accept that multi-culture, multi-religious societies are very possible, as many other countries can show.

If they insist that ethnic cleansing and separation is the "solution" then in the end they might get their solution, but in the reversed way, as it happened in Crete, since what is for sure is that we will not sign away our homeland.

[bg_turk]

bg_turk: your looser remarks towards BirKibrisli put all Turks in a very difficult and embarassing situation. I hope that the people on this forum do not judge us by your pubescent remarks.

Yes, my remarks represent me and my views alone, and are not the views of the Turkish people in general.

[Murataga]

Ottomans took the island from the Republic of Venice in 1571, which by the way was not established by the Greeks the last time I checked:) The Greek inhabitants of the island were being suppressed by the Catholics and were granted their religious autonomy after the Ottomans took over.

Furthermore, how has the Turks` efforts to administer you worked so far? You should proudly answer "not so well" as history suggests. And the vice versa is true for us. So, let`s stick at being each other`s neighbours rather than rulers.

Never on any part of the world at any time in history has two societies like the Turks and the Greeks with such long history of conflict have lived together in peace. Never. Make no mistake about this.

[BirKibrisli]

Words like Barbarian and Kafir originally were neutral terms to describe strangers and unbelievers respectively. Over time and through historical animosity they became derogotary terms of abuse.Civilised and well mannered people refrain from using them.

Birkibrisli, what kind of a Turk you are? How can you remain so calm at this blatant provocation? Stop slacking and agreeing with everything Piratis and Sotiris and their likes say, for once be a real Turk, feel the Mongolian blood boiling in your veins, accept Kemalism, embrace Turanism, cry out that you want Cyprus to be Turkish. Unleash this innate anger and hatred. Show them the true barbaric nature of the Turk.

Rudyard Kipling. 1865–

48. Gunga Din

YOU may talk o' gin an' beer
When you're quartered safe out 'ere,
An' you're sent to penny-fights an' Aldershot it;
But if it comes to slaughter
You will do your work on water,
An' you'll lick the bloomin' boots of 'im that's got it.
Now in Injia's sunny clime,
Where I used to spend my time
A-servin' of 'Er Majesty the Queen,
Of all them black-faced crew
The finest man I knew
Was our regimental bhisti, Gunga Din.

It was "Din! Din! Din!
You limping lump o' brick-dust, Gunga Din!
Hi! slippy hitherao!
Water, get it! Panee lao!
You squidgy-nosed old idol, Gunga Din!"

The uniform 'e wore
Was nothin' much before,
An' rather less than 'arf o' that be'ind,
For a twisty piece o' rag
An' a goatskin water-bag
Was all the field-equipment 'e could find.
When the sweatin' troop-train lay
In a sidin' through the day,
Where the 'eat would make your bloomin' eyebrows crawl,
We shouted "Harry By!"
Till our throats were bricky-dry,
Then we wopped 'im 'cause 'e couldn't serve us all.

It was "Din! Din! Din!
You 'eathen, where the mischief 'ave you been?
You put some juldee in it,
Or I'll marrow you this minute,
If you don't fill up my helmet, Gunga Din!"

'E would dot an' carry one
Till the longest day was done,
An' 'e didn't seem to know the use o' fear.
If we charged or broke or cut,
You could bet your bloomin' nut,
'E'd be waitin' fifty paces right flank rear.
With 'is mussick on 'is back,
'E would skip with our attack,
An' watch us till the bugles made "Retire."
An' for all 'is dirty 'ide,
'E was white, clear white, inside
When 'e went to tend the wounded under fire!

It was "Din! Din! Din!"
With the bullets kickin' dust-spots on the green.
When the cartridges ran out,
You could 'ear the front-files shout:
"Hi! ammunition-mules an' Gunga Din!"

I sha'n't forgit the night
When I dropped be'ind the fight
With a bullet where my belt-plate should 'a' been.
I was chokin' mad with thirst,
An' the man that spied me first
Was our good old grinnin', gruntin' Gunga Din.

'E lifted up my 'ead,
An' 'e plugged me where I bled,
An' 'e guv me 'arf-a-pint o' water—green;
It was crawlin' an' it stunk,
But of all the drinks I've drunk,
I'm gratefullest to one from Gunga Din.

It was "Din! Din! Din!
'Ere's a beggar with a bullet through 'is spleen;
'E's chawin' up the ground an' 'e's kickin' all around:
For Gawd's sake, git the water, Gunga Din!"

'E carried me away
To where a dooli lay,
An' a bullet come an' drilled the beggar clean.
'E put me safe inside,
An' just before 'e died:
"I 'ope you liked your drink," sez Gunga Din.
So I'll meet 'im later on
In the place where 'e is gone—
Where it's always double drill and no canteen;
'E'll be squattin' on the coals
Givin' drink to pore damned souls,
An' I'll get a swig in Hell from Gunga Din!

Din! Din! Din!
You Lazarushian-leather Gunga Din!
Tho' I've belted you an' flayed you,
By the livin' Gawd that made you,
You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!









Someone in this forum has renamed me Gunga Din!
Perhaps you will agree,bg_turk...

[Viewpoint]

If you think I am asking for too much for asking that one thing (!!!) lets reverse it: We have the BBF the way I understand it, the power sharing they way I think is correct, the security issues dealt the way I believe is right etc, and in return you get one thing, the land distribution with 29% that you want. Would you accept that?

Piratis,if you are upto another exercise,I'd love to know very briefly the way you understand the BBF,the power sharing,and the security issues etc...Feel free to tell me to piss off,as it is 2.09 am Wednesday here,and I'd love to go to sleep...

Bir, to put it very briefly, I would do it just like USA is, just instead of 52 states to have 2. Unlike some others in here, I am not trying to create something that would suit my needs perfectly and screw the others. I would just adopt the model of the most known federation in the world.

So I see Birkıbrıslı and Piratis could not unblock the problem of land distribution. Could somebody actually explain to Piratis that the united states land distirbution between states is not a ratio of its population and people can freely go live in any state they wish under the administration of that state.

And can we just get it clear as to what Piratis has accepted as he claims to "accepted" all my demands and I do not concede to his one demand. I think posters can read that the only issue you partially agreed on was settlers being treated humanely in accordence with EU norms on the understanding that they vacate GC properties.

[BirKibrisli]

Hello BirKibrisli. You mention "...do not see the need to insult people to get your points across". I was making reference to Greeks seeking independence from the Ottomans and expressing my "respect" to their effort when Piratis argued about this historical fact. The seeking of autonomy for Turkish Cypriots shall be respected aswell. This was simply my point. I do not understand how this is insulting?

No No.You got me wrong,Murataga. I was not accusing you of being insulting.I was complementing you for not insulting people when you made your points.

You speak of the "bitterness and hatred which exist today as the result of the "Peace Operation"? "... Than I ask you: How about the bitterness and hatred of the Turkish Cypriots that were brought to the brink of extinction in mass graves? Tell the relatives of the murdered Turkish Cypriots laying in the mass graves in MURATAGA about the bitterness and hatred which exist today as the result of the Operation... This is not a popularity contest that we are talking about!

I never said bitterness and hatred only started after the 1974 Turkish operation.The relatives of all murdered people everywhere,from both communities deserve our sympathy.I was wondering how you will manage the bitterness and hatred of your "neighbours"and hope to live with them side by side in peace? But I guess your implied anwser is "by
arming yourself to the teeth and staying always on your side of the border"...The notion that, the most humane and civilised way to live peacefully with your neighbours is by making them your friends,not by threatening them with weapons,obviously has no appeal for you.

The Turkish Army did not carry out the Operation for a couple of old buildings and hotels left by the Greek inhabitants which you can claim is at most what the spoils of the Peace Operation may be... Furthermore, neither Turkey or its armed forces have one day claimed that they are in Cyprus to own the land or that they are permanent in the island.

And what do you call giving away houses and land legally owned by the refugees,to be developed and sold to whoever will pay the highest price?
Is that not profiting from the spoils of the "peace operation"? How safe would you say the TCs feel in their homes knowing that their state has become a heaven for drug pushers,gamblers,prostitutes and the money laundrerers? Not to mention knife wielding petty thieves,muggers, child molesters,traffic terrorists,and other desperadoes?

Don't you think that building a state on other peoples misery,pain ,and suffering will only lead to more of the same down the track?
Are you happy for the TRNC to be known as the immoral,corrupt, pariah state of the Mediterranean Sea? Is that the gift you want to leave your children? And for what? So that you can satisfy your twisted Turkish nationalism?

[Viewpoint]

Birkibrisli

Is that not profiting from the spoils of the "peace operation"? How safe would you say the TCs feel in their homes knowing that their state has become a heaven for drug pushers,gamblers,prostitutes and the money laundrerers? Not to mention knife wielding petty thieves,muggers, child molesters,traffic terrorists,and other desperadoes?

Don't you think that building a state on other peoples misery,pain ,and suffering will only lead to more of the same down the track?
Are you happy for the TRNC to be known as the immoral,corrupt, pariah state of the Mediterranean Sea? Is that the gift you want to leave your children? And for what? So that you can satisfy your twisted Turkish nationalism?

You are out of order the same could be said for the south, why do you not say the same crap to the GCs? Have you lived in the TRNC over the last 20 years? you really do need to come and experience what goes on here and the life we lead and then talk about what we wanna leave to our children. Compare south with north and the crap we hear coming out of the "country" built on our misery,....you to hit a brick GC wall with piratis he is just the tip of the iceberg of people you want to live with from god knows how many thousands of miles away.

Well done.

[Strahd]

You are out of order the same could be said for the south, why do you not say the same crap to the GCs? Have you lived in the TRNC over the last 20 years? you really do need to come and experience what goes on here and the life we lead and then talk about what we wanna leave to our children. Compare south with north and the crap we hear coming out of the "country" built on our misery,....you to hit a brick GC wall with piratis he is just the tip of the iceberg of people you want to live with from god knows how many thousands of miles away.

Well done.

So all this time you and your supporters are talking bullshit. You just offer your blind support and you talk things as you would have liked them to be. Go hide in you enclave and let the real people do the change.

[Viewpoint]

You are out of order the same could be said for the south, why do you not say the same crap to the GCs? Have you lived in the TRNC over the last 20 years? you really do need to come and experience what goes on here and the life we lead and then talk about what we wanna leave to our children. Compare south with north and the crap we hear coming out of the "country" built on our misery,....you to hit a brick GC wall with piratis he is just the tip of the iceberg of people you want to live with from god knows how many thousands of miles away.

Well done.

So all this time you and your supporters are talking bullshit. You just offer your blind support and you talk things as you would have liked them to be. Go hide in you enclave and let the real people do the change.

Please clarify what you are trying to say.

[Murataga]

Birkibrisli, you can find my answers below:

"And what do you call giving away houses and land legally owned by the refugees,to be developed and sold to whoever will pay the highest price?
Is that not profiting from the spoils of the "peace operation"? How safe would you say the TCs feel in their homes knowing that their state has become a heaven for drug pushers,gamblers,prostitutes and the money laundrerers? Not to mention knife wielding petty thieves,muggers, child molesters,traffic terrorists,and other desperadoes? "

Born and raised in TRNC, I have no idea what and where you are talking about. I pity your statement and invite you to live in TRNC before you make such false claims on public forums. You humiliate us with your false accusations.

"Don't you think that building a state on other peoples misery,pain ,and suffering will only lead to more of the same down the track?
Are you happy for the TRNC to be known as the immoral,corrupt, pariah state of the Mediterranean Sea? Is that the gift you want to leave your children? And for what? So that you can satisfy your twisted Turkish nationalism?"

TRNC is build on the simple desire of the Turkish Cypriots to live securely and peacefully under their own self determined administration on land whose population was/is dominated by the Turks. If this is your understanding of "twisted Turkish nationalism", you leave me nothing further to say.

You stated: "But I guess your implied anwser is "by
arming yourself to the teeth and staying always on your side of the border"...The notion that, the most humane and civilised way to live peacefully with your neighbours is by making them your friends,not by threatening them with weapons,obviously has no appeal for you. "

Turks and Greeks will live as friends as long as either is not forced under the rule of the other. TRNC is not a threat to anyone who respects its borders. Never on any part of the world at any time in history has two societies like the Turks and the Greeks with such long history of conflict have lived together in peace. Never. Make no mistake about this.