Cyprus-Forum.com

[zan]

1964: Deaths follow Cyprus truce breachFighting between ethnic Turks and Greeks in the disputed island of Cyprus has left at least 16 people dead.
Shots started to be exchanged between the two sides' lines in the port town of Limassol late yesterday afternoon.
Four Greek Cypriots including a schoolgirl were reported to have been injured in the shooting before a ceasefire was negotiated.
Soon after ambulances driven by RAF personnel went into the area of fighting to bring out the wounded.
However, fighting resumed at around dawn on Wednesday morning.
By the time peace was restored the Greek Cypriots had succeeded in ousting the Turkish Cypriots from their last remaining strongholds in Limassol including Berengaria Castle.
The island's two

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/date ... 745245.stm

no real fighting after that because the GCs had achieved their goal and ousted every TC they needed to. Then came the power cuts and the water cuts to prepare the TCs for the next stage, either get back under Greek rule and accept ENOSIS or starve. We did not starve fast enough for Greeces liking and they sent troops and Grivas to finish us off.

[zan]

Hold on there cowboy. I think the magnification effect is working it’s magic on you too. Apart from Vatican City can you name me anywhere in the world where all of these institutions are not present? Apart from the army that was placed by Attaturk to prevent the system he put in place from being taken over the rest is par for the course. Lift the embargoes and see how quickly we can get rid of the rest. When you lock up people in a pigsty they will live like pigs. Let us out and we can reclaim our dignity. You make it seem as if the GCs and the RoC are our only chance for freedom and a future. I am telling you that we are man enough to make it on our own. We do not need baby sitters. Turkey has spent billions keeping us alive when it could have taken us over years ago, long before any aspirations for the EU, why didn’t she. Life is sometimes hard under the army but it would be harder under a government that we don’t trust and does not trust us. As for seeing everything in black and white, the colour version seems to be to blood covered for us to even look at. We caused the Cyprus problem and left it in such a way that we have wound up with embargoes on our selves. Black and white or multi coloured vomit. The black market, the Mafia and everything else or starvation and then surrender are these the colours that we are supposed to be attracted to.

I never said I was perfect,Zan...just almost perfect...
You are right that most of those vices present everywhere,including the Vatican City
But in other countries there are so much more positives that you can get away from their actual and moral corruptive influences.In the TRNC you can't. And you are right about "pigs in the stye". And don't think I don't know the GC role in keeping us where we are in that stye. I just don't like stating the obvious.Not while there are so many others doing it.
I agree we are man enough to make it on our own,but I don't think Turkey will leave us alone to do it. I think we are man enough to do it together with the GCs.Provided that we establish the trust and respect necessary before hand.
Your talk about "starvation" and "surrender" or living with the negatives smell suspiciously as if you too are under the magic spell of "all or nothing thinking" and "overgenaralisation"...

Two of my sisters have moved back in the last four years did they do it because they thought they would jump straight into the arms of the army or the Mafia.......I don't think so. One of my brother in-laws is working as a manager for a chain of betting shops, a prime business for organised crime you would think........My brother in-law is over in the UK at the moment picking up new electronics for the tills to stop the workers stealing from the owner, why not just send the boyz in to ruff them up a bit and get obediance or are they just scared of the Army.......

Just as a matter of interest, what do you think would have happened if Turkey had not intervened? Would Cyprus have been a haven for ALL Cypriots to this day? My Brother in-laws sister nearly died of starvation and disease in one of the enclaves. Dr. Kucuk was not sure that she would live, that is how bad she was. One off maybe/....depends which end of the magnifier you are looking from.


Of course they could all be working for the army or the Mafia. I wondered why my brother in-law started calling himself General Don Gultekin......................

[humanist]

Murataga ..... vilifies Birkibrisli ..... Why is it that people who seek a true UNIFIED Cyprus get vilified by other's who simply do not share their victim attitudes. Simply speaking the truth for the sake of all Cypriots?

Birk is insulted by a Turkish Cypriot

I was vilified the other day by Greek Speaking Cypriot.

Is truth fairness and justice that difficult of a concept for some people to comprehend, that the some of us who wish for a UNIFIED Cyprus and can see through the suffering of our people get cautioned for those not ready to leave the past behind and create a new Cyprus.

[humanist]

Kartal Aetos I agree with you ... ENOSIS was the stupidest idea that I have come accross in the Cypriot history. What the hell was all that about. perhaps it was to get the British out of Cyprus. Not sure but I think it was stupid and it has landed us in the shit we're in today.

[Viewpoint]

Birkibrisli please make a comparison of the status of TCs pre 1974 and how they are now. When did you last visit the TRNC and see how the average TC lives?

We are making a go of it despite all the disadvantages and we never claim to be perfect but I would much rather live as is with all the imperfections you state than live in a GC state under the administration of people like Piraits and Kifeas who will not as much as look your way once they have gotten what they wanted and that's land.

Did you not notice the reaction of Piratis when he realized what he was demanding was seen as being unreasonable and that he sole aim was to reduce the TC people down to 18% of the island. please show me 1 state in the world where the population % determine the amount of land they administer.

You would do better to direct some of criticism towards the GC arguments as you to have experienced first hand what our negotiators are up against when it come to solving the Cyprus issue, I have personally seen this during the Annan plan and let me tell you the GC side made no friends of the UN or the EU intermediaries.

Viewpoint...I was last in the TRNC in 1999.Things were not very good then,and I believe they are a lot worse now.However,I do not disagree with you that things are better for TC now in some respects (physical security comes to mind) than before 1974.But it has come at a great price. This is the loss of identity and any hope of self determination.And potentially total extinction of Turkish Cypriotness.This is what I revolt against and try to warn others.

I am not suggesting we live Under Piratis' or Kifeas' administration. I think we can live together and share power in a democratic way. You obviously don't trust the GCs and they don't trust TCs.That is why I believe a just solution will only come in stages. That is why I don't think it is possible or desirable to reduce the TC state to 18%.
To give people the chance to live together to learn to trust each other,
we must have a state controlled by the TCs which contains a large minority of GCs,and vice versa. This interim stage cannot be skipped. I hope everyone will get to realise this eventually.

Birkıbrıslı if you can get your hands on the report prepared by the World Bank you will see some real figures about the TRNC and not just hearsay. We are no worse off than many new EU members and much better than others, Latvia, Poland and Slovak Rep have lower GNI per capita than us is just one example and they are not under any sort of isolation. So what gets me is that you so easily criticise TCs who are doing the best they can under the prevailing circumstances and do not speak out against GC acts of continuing the isolation to force us back to 1960 agreements which they themselves openly admit to not wanting and will oppose at the first opportunity once they have snared the TCs community into think that that is the only way forward.

[pantheman]

Piratis,

save your breath, its no good talking to those guys (Bir,VP,Mrfrog) you will get more sense from a brick wall. It is quite clear what they want, they are not going to agree on giving back what isn't theirs.

I would be happy for things to stay as they are, the RoC should stop the crossings in both directions and then we'll see if mother turkey will keep on pouring money into a dead state, oh sorry i should have said a puppet state.

I take back the bit about Birk..... i have been reading his posts and i am wrong on him, if only a few more could be more realistic then a solution might be found.

I still stand by what is said earlier that thr RoC should close the crossings, then we will see how good the TCs in the TRNC will really fair.

[pantheman]

Right so it is settled then. We are going to open the boarders and all the refugees are going to live in the same houses as their Turkish counterparts and have mixed race children by the score. We will sacrifice all the first born males to the Greek gods and then distribute their bodies amongst the poor TCs. The settlers will be put on a ship and that will be sunk in Turkish waters. We will have a government of 99% GC, ½% TC and ½ % new Cypriot mouse taking up the rear. Filching, I think it’s called in the gay society. The Donkeys will live in enclaves and only be allowed to vote on Tuesdays. Disney will build a new park in Varosha and that will be run jointly by the UN and Mickey Mouse. “ENOSIS and TAKSIM”, will be our new motto and will be printed on Cypriot currency. We will have a new flag that looks exactly like the RoC one today but will be designed by a GC. The constitution will be written in stone and changed accordingly as to when the GC presidente’ thinks fit and all doner kebabs around the world will contain pork.


Where do I sign.

Zan,

i got to give to you mate, I have never laughed so much thanks. How on earth did you think all that stuff up, god i'm sure you could make money on it.



Pantheman

[Kartal_Aetos]

ok, so kifeas, what u are saying is that the junta actually DIDN'T have the aim of enosis?

and what it has got to do with our discussion is that i wouldn't trust government statements

[zan]

Right so it is settled then. We are going to open the boarders and all the refugees are going to live in the same houses as their Turkish counterparts and have mixed race children by the score. We will sacrifice all the first born males to the Greek gods and then distribute their bodies amongst the poor TCs. The settlers will be put on a ship and that will be sunk in Turkish waters. We will have a government of 99% GC, ½% TC and ½ % new Cypriot mouse taking up the rear. Filching, I think it’s called in the gay society. The Donkeys will live in enclaves and only be allowed to vote on Tuesdays. Disney will build a new park in Varosha and that will be run jointly by the UN and Mickey Mouse. “ENOSIS and TAKSIM”, will be our new motto and will be printed on Cypriot currency. We will have a new flag that looks exactly like the RoC one today but will be designed by a GC. The constitution will be written in stone and changed accordingly as to when the GC presidente’ thinks fit and all doner kebabs around the world will contain pork.


Where do I sign.

Zan,

i got to give to you mate, I have never laughed so much thanks. How on earth did you think all that stuff up, god i'm sure you could make money on it.



Pantheman

Thanks friend.........send all donations to Zan, care of the Betty Ford clinic.

[BirKibrisli]

Just as a matter of interest, what do you think would have happened if Turkey had not intervened? Would Cyprus have been a haven for ALL Cypriots to this day? My Brother in-laws sister nearly died of starvation and disease in one of the enclaves. Dr. Kucuk was not sure that she would live, that is how bad she was. One off maybe/....depends which end of the magnifier you are looking from.

It is difficult to say,because we don't know what Sampson would've done re Turkish Cypriots. And we don't know if the junta in Greece would've fallen without the Turkish intervasion (your work,I like it ).

Given that Makarios was deposed to make it easier to achieve Enosis,and given that Sampson was a murderous thug he would've turned against the TCs eventually,and probably force Turkey's hand in any case.

Now if you ask me what would've happened had there been no coup against Makarios,I'd say that there would be very little TC presence in Cyprus by now. Come to think of it,there is very little real TC presence in Cyprus now anyway.The biggest losers in this sorry conflict are the TCs. Just listen to Bayrak Radio and tell me how many of its speakers speak Cypriot Turkish...You'll get my point.