Cyprus-Forum.com

[bg_turk]

Who the fuck is Southern Cyprus prick ?? 25 members of the EU , NONE IS CALLED SOUTHERN CYPRUS.
Get it in your head , it is called f..ng CYPRUS .

I am sorry for using the wrong term. By Southern Cyprus I meant the Greek Cypriot Administration.

[pitsilos]

hey miltidiades he is a natural talent for finding subliminal messages in ice cubes

[Piratis]

According to some EU leaders, and obviously to Cyprus and Greece, without the necessary steps Turkey should forget about the "special status" as well.

Turkey had this special status far before Cyprus even became a member. Currently Turkey enjoys close economic ties with Germany, many Eastern european countries, and even Greece (Greek banking sector is expanding into the TUrkish market). You are telling me that Germany and the other countries, whose business with Turkey is worth billions of dollars, will sacrifice all of this, just to accomodate the whims of Papadolpulos and Greek Cypriot rejectionism?

The Germans also do business with China, USA, Mexico etc. Thats irrelevant with any "special status".

In the end, Turkey is just another 3rd country for Europeans. There is nothing very "special" about it. (apart from the trade union)

Therefore Turkey will have to compete for German money with countries like China, India etc, while for, say Bulgaria, it will be much easier as the legislation will be harmonized, no import taxes, easy to cross the borders, stability in their currency (and soon a common currency) etc etc.

So of course the German companies will always want to sell their Siemens and BMWs in Turkey (and Turks will want to buy them), but much fewer German companies would choose Turkey to open their factories than if Turkey was an EU member, or even on its way of becoming one.

So don't try to tell us that this huge failure of Turkey is not a big deal. It is. And the Turks know it. That is why they have been struggling to achieve this for decades.

However the Europeans now learned what we always knew: That the Turks only know how to take, and even doing what they have to do is a "sacrifice" for them!!

[bg_turk]

The Germans also do business with China, USA, Mexico etc. Thats irrelevant with any "special status".

China, USA and Mexico are not members of the EU customs union. Turkey is.

In the end, Turkey is just another 3rd country for Europeans. There is nothing very "special" about it. (apart from the trade union)

precisely - apart from the trade union.

Therefore Turkey will have to compete for German money with countries like China, India etc, while for, say Bulgaria, it will be much easier as the legislation will be harmonized, no import taxes, easy to cross the borders, stability in their currency (and soon a common currency) etc etc.

So of course the German companies will always want to sell their Siemens and BMWs in Turkey (and Turks will want to buy them), but much fewer German companies would choose Turkey to open their factories than if Turkey was an EU member, or even on its way of becoming one.

So don't try to tell us that this huge failure of Turkey is not a big deal. It is. And the Turks know it. That is why they have been struggling to achieve this for decades.

However the Europeans now learned what we always knew: That the Turks only know how to take, and even doing what they have to do is a "sacrifice" for them!!

Since I do not wish to dwell on your economic credentials, which you are obviously lacking, I will just ask you what point you are trying to make. You have made a sport of Turk bashing, and you are entering this vicious circle where you confuse the means with your final aim. If we assume all of the above is true, then what in the above will compel Turkey to abandon Turkish Cypriots and comply with all of your demands? Do you believe that by hurting the Turkish economy you are going to compel T urkey to withdraw its troops?

[bg_turk]

Turkey with its soft diplomacy is apparently now making new friends:



More here:
http://www.gulfnews.com/opinion/columns ... 84472.html

[Piratis]

Bg_Turk, Trade union was something important when the EU members were just 12 or 15 mostly rich countries. Today with the 25, and tomorrow with 27, including many eastern European countries, the benefit from the customs union for Turkey has decreased even further.

Do you believe that by hurting the Turkish economy you are going to compel T urkey to withdraw its troops?

When the Turkish economy will be seriously hurt due to the nationalistic hostile policies of Turkey, many in Turkey will start questioning the policies of their government. Thats of course not enough for a country that is ruled by the army to make her change direction.

What will make a difference is that the Turks will have less money to support their army and their puppet state. More importantly though, pushing the Turks out of EU will inevitably increase the anti-EU, anti-western and anti-Christian sentiment within Turkey, pushing her even further into Islam.

So you will have a group of the more affluent European Turks dissatisfied that their government is keeping them in a 3rd world status, then you will have an increase in Islamist fanatics, and at the same time you will have the Kurds with their renewed aspirations for an independent country.

I can not predict how exactly this will affect Turkey, but it definitely raises the chances of something going seriously wrong there. The possibility of Turkey braking up into parts will then be very possible.

[bg_turk]

Piratis, by how much do you project a Cypriot veto will hurt the Turkish economy? 0.1% 1%? 2%?

The Turkish economy plummetted whole 10% a few years ago and was still able to rebounce with an impressive growth rate and single digit inflation figures despite bad relation with the EU during Yilmaz and Ciller's premiership. Meanwhile trade with Russia and the Arab states has been further expanded,with a Gulf firm building a skyscraper, the higehst in the region, in Istanbul and trade with EU member states such as Germany is not going bad at all as a Turkish firm is now planning to buy the German ProSieben TV station. The Baku-Ceylan pipeline is now complete and is about to flood Cyprus with cheap Turkish oil. A Greek-Turkish pipeline is also being discussed now in an effort to curb EU dependence on Russian oil.

The only things that an EU membership would have offered Turkey were higher rates of foreign investment and a more stable climate, but Turkey has managed without it so far, and can manage from now on.

You cannot seriously believe that the insubstantial and inconsequential decrease in stock markets, mostly short term capital, due to Greek Cypriot veto is going to lead to the disintegration of a state boasting the biggest army in NATO? You are too blinded by your wishful thinking.You wish Turkey was more tied to the EU process to put more weight to your veto, but the reality is that it is not.

The reason why the current mildly islamic government has been so persistent in the EU process was the hope that it could change Turkey in ways that are undesirable to secular Turks (such as the lifting of the headscarf ban).

[Piratis]

We will see if it is going to be 0.1% or 2%. Thats your wishful thinking.

USSR had an army 100 times more powerful than Turkey and tons of oil. That didn't stop it from collapsing.

Turkey can become highly unstable quite easily. Then it will be up to some others to decide if they will save Turkey again or decide that an independent Kurdistan would be a better solution for them this time.

What is for sure is that Turkey will remain a 3rd world country and probably it will even move backwards after being rejected from EU.

[alexISS]

Are you always this confrontational?

Not always, you seem to bring out the worst of me

Southern Cyprus being a member does not really affect anything in the big scheme of things. With or without it Turkey would not have become a member due to the geopolitical situation mainly due to French opposition.

Even if France agreed, if Cyprus disagrees then Turkey does not become a member.

What pisses you off probably is that even as a member Cyprus still cannot enforce any of its demands.

Nothing pisses me off, Cyprus did not become a member to veto Turkey as you like to think

How ignorant a statement is this? The German and Greek commercial relations with the EU are precisely withing the context of Turkey's customs union with the EU.

Whose statement is ignorant? Turkey can trade with the EU countries without the customs union, as do all other non EU countries. Is that false?
Do you think that a "special status" for Turkey is more important to the German or French government than the anti-EuroTurkey feelings of their voters???

What happened to the allempires forum by the way? Is it down?

Yes, their domain seems to have expired and has not been renewed, why I don't know

[bg_turk]

Even if France agreed, if Cyprus disagrees then Turkey does not become a member.

But France will not agree. The Greek Cypriot veto would have been effective if it was the only hurdle, but it is not. How do you see Turkey making sacrfices for something which lies 15 years down the line, and may or may not actually occur?