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The calendar of Turkish atrocities

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby cypezokyli » Tue Nov 07, 2006 11:15 pm

Jerry wrote:You can trade atrocities until the cows come home, the point is who started it?


allow me to disagree.
this is not the point. "who started it" can hardly ever be proven, not to mention that this logic ends up justifying almost averything!

this is an irrelevant question.
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Postby Jerry » Wed Nov 08, 2006 12:18 am

cypezokyli wrote:
Jerry wrote:You can trade atrocities until the cows come home, the point is who started it?


allow me to disagree.
this is not the point. "who started it" can hardly ever be proven, not to mention that this logic ends up justifying almost averything!

this is an irrelevant question.


How can it be irrelevant. It's quite obvious where the original aggression came from. The Greeks have been trying to regain lost ground ever since the Ottoman conquest.
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Postby cypezokyli » Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:35 am

Jerry wrote:
cypezokyli wrote:
Jerry wrote:You can trade atrocities until the cows come home, the point is who started it?


allow me to disagree.
this is not the point. "who started it" can hardly ever be proven, not to mention that this logic ends up justifying almost averything!

this is an irrelevant question.


How can it be irrelevant. It's quite obvious where the original aggression came from. The Greeks have been trying to regain lost ground ever since the Ottoman conquest.


you really think so ?
do you honestly believe that conflicts brake out today, or did so any time before, bc of ancient-long hatred ?
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Postby andri_cy » Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:43 am

Jerry wrote:You can trade atrocities until the cows come home, the point is who started it?



I beg to differ. The point isn't who lost the most, or who started it. That's all just a small part of all this. The point is what are we doing to fix all this and overcome it?
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Postby andri_cy » Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:46 am

Jerry wrote:
cypezokyli wrote:
Jerry wrote:You can trade atrocities until the cows come home, the point is who started it?


allow me to disagree.
this is not the point. "who started it" can hardly ever be proven, not to mention that this logic ends up justifying almost averything!

this is an irrelevant question.


How can it be irrelevant. It's quite obvious where the original aggression came from. The Greeks have been trying to regain lost ground ever since the Ottoman conquest.


Jerry you are a bit off the mark.
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Postby Piratis » Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:48 am

Everything in history is part of a chain. Greeks, Armenians, Kurds etc have been the original inhabitants of the lands that Turks now occupy. If peace was allowed to exist for several centuries then everything could be forgotten and everybody could be friends. But how can this happen when conflicts keep coming up all the time?

Today for examples Turkey insists to occupy northern Cyprus, have claims over the Aegean, oppress the Kurds and deny the Armenian genocide. This guarantees that the future will not be any more peaceful.
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Postby Viewpoint » Wed Nov 08, 2006 9:13 am

Piratis wrote:Everything in history is part of a chain. Greeks, Armenians, Kurds etc have been the original inhabitants of the lands that Turks now occupy. If peace was allowed to exist for several centuries then everything could be forgotten and everybody could be friends. But how can this happen when conflicts keep coming up all the time?

Today for examples Turkey insists to occupy northern Cyprus, have claims over the Aegean, oppress the Kurds and deny the Armenian genocide. This guarantees that the future will not be any more peaceful.


The same can be said for many countries. Each has internal and external problems and historical issues which if analyzed will show you that Turkey is no different from the rest. Your hatred for anything Turkish makes you focus only on Turkey bad points. The GC also have to normalise relations with Turkey, its not a one way street. If the future of the EU is with Turkey included would it not be more beneficial policy to have Turkey as a friend rather than a foe as they will be the second largest nation in the EU. The GCs imo are also blind to this opportunity and should use the key to smoothing out their relations with Turkey by working closely with the TCs.
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Postby Klik » Wed Nov 08, 2006 2:29 pm

Germany had one huge attrocity in the last years, and they have at least apologised for it.

Turkey has over a douzine in the last 100 years, and think they can hide them, and they seem to want to do more!

BIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIG DIFFERENCE, and probably a catalyst on why Turkey will never join the EU :wink:
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Postby Viewpoint » Wed Nov 08, 2006 2:41 pm

I agree with you that Turkey will never join the EU so its best she drops any hopes or aspirations to join and looks for pastures new.

But hey Kliky where will your GC state be? still crying on 63% of the island with no EU leverage to solve shit.
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Postby MR-from-NG » Wed Nov 08, 2006 5:32 pm

GREEK ATROCITIES COMMITTED DURING

THE 19th &20th CENTURIES

The Turks have well established reputation for ferocity and a notion of the “Terrible Turk” is deeply ingrained in the western mind. Unfortunately too little is known that during the 19 and 20 century the Turks have much more often been the victims of aggression than they have been aggressors .
They have been involved in two wars of aggression 2nd Balkan war of 1913 and the brief participation in the 1st world war which involved not allowing allied troops through the Dardenells of Gallipoli to help its enemy Russia. However Turkey has been invaded numerous times: once each by Italy, France, England, Serbia, Bulgaria and Montenegro and Four times by Russia and Greece.


Greece was determined to exterminate as many Turks as possible.The Greek war of Independence set the tone for all that was to follow:
The orthodox Greeks at once fell upon their Turkish neighbours and slaughtered them indiscriminately.


To quote the distinguished historian

Mr William St.Clair:

"The Turks of Greece left few traces.They disappeared suddenly and finally in the spring of 1821 unmourned and unnoticed by the rest of the world.It is hard to believe then that Greece had once contained a large population of Turkish descent living in small communities all over the country, prosperous farmers, merchants, and officials,whose families had known no other home for hundreds of years. As the Greeks said "The moon devoured them." Upwards of Twenty thousand Turkish men, women, and children were murdered by their Greek neighbours in few weeks of slaughter. They were killed deliberately, without qualm or scruple, and there were no regrets either then or later..."

All over the Pelopponense roamed mobs of Greeks armed with clubs, scythes, and a few firearms, killing, plundering, and burning. They were often lead by Christian priests who exhorted them to greater efforts in their holy work...Within a few weeks the Turkish and Moslem Albanian population of Pelopponse previously about ninth of the whole , had ceased to exit

During this period the inhabitants of the important islands of Hydra, Spetsae, and Psara decided to join the revolutionaries.... They armed their ships and began to attack traders flying the Turkish flag. They ranged all over the Aegean and beyond.

Many Turkish merchant ships were captured, their crews killed, or thrown overboard, and the booty brought back to port. On several occasions ships crowded with Moslem pilgrims on their way to or from Mecca were seized and the crews and passengers put to death.... The crew of a Turkish corvette, fifty-seven men in all, were brought back to Hydra in triumph and individually roasted to death over fires on the beach.

Crete

When Greece invaded Crete, in February 1897, Greek Muslims and Turks were slaughtered by the thousands. In the district of Sitia alone, 851 Persons (including 374 children) were killed. The eighty Muslim villages of Central Crete were entirely destroyed. The massacre was stopped only by the timely arrival of British and French military units. An eye-witness to the slaughter, a woman from the village of Roukaka, in the district of Sitia, gave the following deposition to French officials:

"Christians threw Halime, the pregnant wife of Huseyin Mehmedakis, on the ground and slit open her belly, taking the foetus out. They also knifed Fatime, daughter of Mustafa Omer Efendakis, cutting her open from her breasts to the middle of her back. They pushed the men into the mosque and, as they killed them, hurled them from the minaret, which they then set ablaze with gasoline. Dogs were running all over the village carrying half-burnt hands and feet. The children were stabbed to death, and a few were crushed beneath the minaret when it collapsed."

izmir

When the Greeks occupied the izmir region in 1919 and later, as they penetrated into central Anatolia, they carried out a policy of genocide on a grand scale. Typical was the Aydin massacre of June 25, 1919. Greek troops at first subjected the Turkish quarter of the town to an intensive artillery bombardment. All Turks who tried to escape were shot down by Greek soldiers or civilian auxiliaries. Then the Greek Army entered the quarter and continued its orgy of destruction. Some Turkish families were burnt alive when their homes were set on fire. Others were gunned down in the streets. When four women who had barricaded themselves into a building were captured, they were impaled on wooden stakes. Altogether, an estimated 9,716 Turks were butchered that day.

H.J.Psomiades in "The Eastern Question" points out that since 1912 some 4 million muslims (most of Turkish origin)had left Greece or areas occupied by Greece.

Their butchery didn’t stop with the Turks !



Jews were also driven out of Turkish territories seized by the Greeks. The fate of the Jews of Salonika was typical. According to Jacov Benmayor, an authority on subject:

In 1917 a great fire destroyed most of the town, leaving some 50,000 Jews homeless. The Greek government, which followed a policy of Helenizing the town, was ready to compensate the Jews whose house were destroyed, but it refused to let the Jews return to certain parts of the town, causing many of them to leave the country. . . . In 1922 a law(no. 236) was enacted which forced all the inhabitants of Salonika to refrain from working on Sundays, thus causing another wave of emigration.... In 1932-34 the Campbell riots, which accompanied the elections and were anti-Semitic in tone, took place. An entire Jewish neighbourhood was burned to the ground by hooligans, and most of the Jews who lived in the Campbell neighbourhood emigrated after the riots

Hellenization and Genocide

Today their policy of Hellenization and Genocide continues large scale human rights violations in western thrace will lead to the extermination of Turks living there as they cease to exit, yet no one car, And while the world turns a blind eye no doubt in a few years people will say, were their any Turks in western Thrace .No doubt their answers will be the same .

"The moon devoured them"
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