Cyprus-Forum.com

[Kikapu]

Pantheman,

After my last post, I was wondering what was it that we were disagreeing with, regarding the firing mechanism of the shotgun. Then I realized what it was. It seems like I was talking about one type of shotgun, and you another type. Too bad, as a hunter and use of various types of weapons, you did not spot what I was talking about.

As I said, I'm not a hunter, and last time I saw a "real classic" type of shotgun, was in Cyprus in the 60's as a child, which was a double barrel, side by side, with 2 separate hammers, with 2 separate triggers, that can be fired separately, or both barrels same time. These types, when broken, had no chance of being fired if dropped, since the hammers had to be cocked manually, unlike what you were describing to what happens to modern version of shotguns, that, the hammer/s are cocked, upon the barrels locking.

Anyway, this does not take away what I've said regarding hunting.

1. I don't consider it to be "sport"

2. Children have no business going hunting with adults.

3. If someone gets shot, it should be a criminal offence, with jail time for the shooter.

4. Shooting someone during hunting is not an accident, it is carelessness.

I could go on, but you get my point.

Be safe out there.

[Kikapu]

Dinos,

Fish for the fish, catch the fish, fry the fish, and eat the fish. Did I miss something, so where is the "sports" aspect of it.

Now, if the fish had it's own "Human rod" and tries to fish you same time, that would be Sport.

Kikapu, the sport is in fighting the surf to catch a 12-pound bluefish. Around here, we consistently get 3-6 foot waves in the ocean. Not a big deal in and of itself, but can get tricky when you're hip-deep and have a bluefish at the other end of the line. You probably also know that bluefish are quite capable of biting through the leaders used to keep the line away from the hook. So you have to use strength to fight the current and waves, yet have enough finesse to not let the fish cut itself off the line.

I consider sport any type of activity that requires above-average physical exertion. If we're talking fishing off a pier or off a boat, then you're absolutely correct.

Yes, the Bluefish will fight you and try to bite you at the same time. Do you actually stand in the surf or what. Look, it sounds like fun, but you're having to "sport" with a creature that has an IQ less than 1, so lets not give the fish too mush credit. They eat what they see, with a hook or without, so you're not doing too much to entice it.

We caught great deal of "Dorado", also known as "Dolphin Fish" and "Mahi-Mahi" across the Pacific. They too fight like hell, at almost 4 feet long. But the silly things chase a plastic cuttings with a hook inside to eat, and get themselves caught, without any help from me.

They do taste yummy.

[reportfromcyprus]

It's not necessarily my argument's logical conclusion that you wouldn't be able to take a kid in a car. Taking my point to its logical conclusion would be as follows:

If you take a child in a car without safety measures and speed on a regular basis whilst driving a badly-maintained car - then you are reckless and endangering the kid's life. As the child's legal guardian, you are responsible for its health and safety, no?

That covers about every driver in Cyprus!

Most of them never even strap their children in yet (with many more casualties) you aren’t calling for children to be banned from cars until they are able to understand the risk. Why?

And you have yet to prove that this hunter was behaving in a reckless manner or was badly handling his weapon.

The police report said that he told them he was walking with the gun - loaded and unbroken, so when he fell, it went off and shot the kid. That's reckless and unsafe handling of a gun.

I would call for unsafe drivers who are caught not strapping their kids in and driving in a dangerous way to be banned, to have their license taken away.

[reportfromcyprus]

But in general, I think that dangerous drivers in Cyprus is an entirely different subject, and difficult to link with hunting.

I understand the point you're trying to make though.

[cyprusgrump]

But in general, I think that dangerous drivers in Cyprus is an entirely different subject, and difficult to link with hunting.

I understand the point you're trying to make though.

Excellent!

I’ve enjoyed debating with you.

[dinos]

Yes, the Bluefish will fight you and try to bite you at the same time. Do you actually stand in the surf or what. Look, it sounds like fun, but you're having to "sport" with a creature that has an IQ less than 1, so lets not give the fish too mush credit. They eat what they see, with a hook or without, so you're not doing too much to entice it.

We caught great deal of "Dorado", also known as "Dolphin Fish" and "Mahi-Mahi" across the Pacific. They too fight like hell, at almost 4 feet long. But the silly things chase a plastic cuttings with a hook inside to eat, and get themselves caught, without any help from me.

They do taste yummy.

Yep, I do stand in the surf, which is a lot of fun. We get mahi here as well, but off shore. With the price of fuel these days, I just don't want to bother with it. But I do respect the fight they give.

In any case, you're absolutely right - once bluefish get into a feeding mode, they'll hit anything. Even a Pepsi can. But they do have certain behavior patterns, in the way they corner bait fish inland, that can be taken advantage of. My personal favorite for eating is striped bass, though...

Hope you're well,
-dinos

[reportfromcyprus]

But in general, I think that dangerous drivers in Cyprus is an entirely different subject, and difficult to link with hunting.

I understand the point you're trying to make though.

Excellent!

I’ve enjoyed debating with you.

Likewise

This is the text of the original story:

Man Shoots Son, Hunting Accident
A 14-year-old Larnaka boy has been shot in the arm by his father in a hunting accident that seriously injured him.

Around 10.50am on October 1st, a 52-year-old father took his son to Larnaka General Hospital with shotgun wounds to his right arm. According to the man's statement, he had been hunting with his sons, aged 14 and 16, when he had lost his balance and fallen to the ground. As he fell, the loaded shotgun he was holding went off, shooting his son, who was close by.

The boy was moved to Nicosia General Hospital and doctors say he's in a serious condition. Larnaka police are investigating the incident.

Reported October 2, 2006

[Kikapu]

Man Shoots Son, Hunting Accident
A 14-year-old Larnaka boy has been shot in the arm by his father in a hunting accident that seriously injured him.

Around 10.50am on October 1st, a 52-year-old father took his son to Larnaka General Hospital with shotgun wounds to his right arm. According to the man's statement, he had been hunting with his sons, aged 14 and 16, when he had lost his balance and fallen to the ground. As he fell, the loaded shotgun he was holding went off, shooting his son, who was close by.

The boy was moved to Nicosia General Hospital and doctors say he's in a serious condition. Larnaka police are investigating the incident.

Reported October 2, 2006

I'm sure the father feels like shit for shooting his own son, not to mention the shit he has been getting from his wife, but this should not absolve him from the fact he shot another person. If the father is not charged with at least aggravated assault with a loaded gun, then I don't think I can trust the Cypriot courts system to carry out it's obligations to protect it's citizens.

[dinos]

.. people will always justify what they think is ok, a combination of conditioning and and justifying a mentallity. neanderthal thinking, but those who have an advanced mentallity, who can see that the inequality of the hunt, over innocent animals is not ok, and what makes it worse is that it is not a necessity, and that food is not scarce, if it was then i can see the justification, but it is what it is a sport, and the pleasure to hunt and kill.. sorry.. but it dont wash with me nor with anyone that has evolved into a humane person with an emotional iq of at least a 100.. infact i cant even be bothered to carry on arguing with you as you have not the ability to see farther than your conditioning or have the ability to be deeper than a puddle.. you carry on with your thinking, and stay where you have chosen to be.. i cant change anyone but i dont have to be around you.. it just hurts me to think and feel your stupidy and ignorance will still be out there..

Since I've only really defended fishing, I'll add a touch more to this, as the thought is out there that there's plenty of food in grocery stores, so fishing shouldn't be necessary. The following is probably true for hunting, albeit to a lesser degree.

Commercial fishing is one of the most destructive processes on earth. Not only are fish treated cruelly, but various other unintended species are also caught and killed, like sharks, dolphins, turtles, seals and even sea birds that go in for the bait and drown in the nets. The "by-catch" is usually thrown overboard; either dead or dying.

Tuna are gaffed onto boats (stuck with poles that have large hooks on the ends and pulled into the boat via the hooks). They are killed via the "iki jima" method - a corer is pushed into their brains and a wire is pushed into the hole and down their spinal column. There are no regulations mandating the killing of fish in humane ways, as is the case with livestock, which are generally stunned prior to the slaughter process.

There are a number of ways to fight the above. Fish farming is one, not eating fish is another. Personally, I like to eat fish. Killing anything inevitably involves pain. I don't like the idea of being responsible for the above, so I catch my own. But anyone that thinks getting fish, at least, from a grocery store is more humane that killing their own fish is mistaken. I guarantee you that I'm not indiscriminately killing anything that gets in my way, and I'm not using cruel methods to kill the fish I do take.

For those that like fish, my way is quite valid, from anti-cruelty, environmental and conservationist standpoints.

http://www.animalliberation.org.au/fishcom.php
http://www.fishinghurts.com/CommercialFishing.asp

(Note: The "fishing hurts" page is just secondary backup of practices in commercial fishing. PETA is an extremist organization and not an unbiased source of info on anything regarding animals, and is not portrayed as such by myself.)

[pantheman]

Dinos,

you dont' have to justify yourself to anyone about your fishing. I hunt, its legal, i follow all the guidelines and i enjoy it. All the anti's can get stuffed i have no time for them. Let them lobby governments and leave me in peace to enjoy my hunting.

If we follow the logic of the antis' we would all be veggies locked in our houses, no tv, no radio, no internet no nothing. Ask any veggie / anti moron what he/she wears on her feet. Bet you 1000000000000/1 its leather. So there you are when it suits them its OK otherwise its not.

When jesus wanted to feed all those people what did god send ??? Fish and birds right ? So, please you anti, biggoted sad people, just get yourselves a lif and leave me in peace to enjoy my hunting/fishing or whatever .

Good day and good riddens.

Pantheman.