Cyprus-Forum.com

[Sotos]

Bg_turk you should be a director!

[MR-from-NG]

Thanks for that bg_turk. Enjoyed both clips thoroughly.

[miltiades]

Kifeas , I knew you had a sense of humour , how else could you have posted such a scholarly joke.
I shall refrain from regressive responds and hope you can revert to your well known intellectual and stimulating posts , you will never make a comedian.

[ManoWAR]

Simple mathematics:
Since TC are the 28% are one of the iland´s minorities...

[MR-from-NG]

Simple mathematics:
Since TC are the 28% are one of the iland´s minorities...

Rubbish. How can I be a minority in my own country. I have as much right in Cyprus as you do. If you do not pull your socks up and see the realities of the situation you will leave me no choice but to forget a settlement or reunification and leave thing just as they are. I'm an equal individual in the TRNC, why should I give that up knowing full well I will be a second class citizen in the company of the likes of you. Thank you but no thanks.

[Piratis]

I am not surprised by your remarks. What I'm saying is that if you are going to strike, you should plan this secretly, because the natural instinct of the other side will be to strike first.

Sadik, we are in a war and there is a cease fire. What secret are you talking about? Isn't it common sense that if RoC had the power to liberate its own land it would (and it should) do it?

Turkey, by occupying the northern part of the island, have fullfilled all her startegic needs as she sees it, so she will not strike again under normal circumstances. However, it will be a different situation if your scenario comes to life. So, this scenario actually is risking another attack and the complete annihaliation of the island for an uncertain gain. Hence, this is an extreme position to defend, under the circumstances.

Under the circumstances I am not arguing that Cyprus is able to do anything. However the time will inevitably come that the balance of power will change. I am talking about that time, not now.

Defending your country is a noble cause, but it should be done when you actually can defend your country.

It should always be done with whatever means available.

Plus, defence is not only by military means.

Most definitely. In the case of Cyprus military means are the least possible scenario. For example Latvia, with a 30% Russian minority, got its independence from the former super power without firing a bullet.

Biggest defence for Cyprus is solving the Cyprus problems as soon as possible, without postponding it until an uncertain time that the circumstances will be more favorable.

The most important thing is to have a good viable solution. A bad "solution" (e.g. Annan plan) will only be part of the problem and will only create more problems and bring more disasters. If we can have a good solution, the faster we can have it is of course better. However today a fair viable solution doesn't seem possible.

During the negotiations in 60s and 70s, the TC side had accepted all the 13 points that Makarios had made in 1963.

Without asking for something that could take them closer to partition in return? Can you give a bit more details about this?

However, Makarios thought that he would even get a better solution in time. Not closing the problem in 1972, made 1974 possible.

I don't know about the particular issue you are talking about. However I said many times that as long as we have two conflicting communities each side will try to get as much as possible on the loss of another. Greediness is in the nature of all of us.
The only way to put a stop in this is to agree that universally accepted principles such as human rights, democracy etc will be what will limit our greediness, and not the balance of power.

The Turkish side also accepted the Gali set of ideas and the Annan Plan, which were both rejected by the GC side eventually.

From what I remeber non had accepted the Gali set of ideas eventually.

This is just to show that there are instances of the Turkish side accepting solution plans!

Partition plans only.

It is not true that there is no hope for an agreement. Occassionally a government in Turkey with the intention of solving the Cyprus problem will come to power (like when Erdogan's AKP first came to power). In that case we should sieze the opportunity, not postpond the problem.

So far I have not seen any such signals from anybody with significant power in the Turkish side. Just some voices from tiny minorities. Even those that talk about "unity" they realize it as a kind of two states side by side unity, like the "unity" of Cyprus with Ireland within European Union. Not like a one country unity as it exists in all other democratic countries in the world.

[Piratis]

Since TC are the 28% are one of the iland´s minorities

18%, not 28%.

Rubbish. How can I be a minority in my own country. I have as much right in Cyprus as you do. If you do not pull your socks up and see the realities of the situation you will leave me no choice but to forget a settlement or reunification and leave thing just as they are. I'm an equal individual in the TRNC, why should I give that up knowing full well I will be a second class citizen in the company of the likes of you. Thank you but no thanks.

You don't have to be a minority if you don't want to. All Cypriot citizens are equal without second class and first class. Beyond that if you want you could define yourselves as minority which would give you extra minority rights such as affirmative action quotas, guaranteed representation in the government etc. If you don't want these extra minority rights then no problem at all.

[Simon]

From the above comments, I think the TCs have a choice to make. If you do not want to be a minority, fine. But then this means 1 person, 1 vote; with no veto, no different set representations in parliament etc. Everybody is the same and the parliament is simply made up of those voted for. OR

You do recognise yourselves as a minority and therefore enjoy the rights of a minority community. YOU CAN'T HAVE BOTH.

[miltiades]

Simon it is highly improbable that any T/C will take the slightest bit of notice in your statements while you insist antagonizing them by using a foreign flag as your avatar. I'm a Greek Cypriot and so are you , but don't you think that we have our own unique identity , of course I can never suggest to you or to a T/C that you should forget the ties with Greece or Turkey , but I would strongly suggest that since the main ingredient that is causing friction between us is the "ethnic" one , it is prudent to re examine closely our adherence to ideas and ambitions that not only will contribute greatly to a permanent division but were we to listen to Kifeas and Piratis such ideas could more than likely bring about a catastrophe of immense proportions.
You are free to criticize my steadfast views on my Cypriot identity but would appreciate the slightest effort on your part to raise your own Cypriotness a level or two.

[Kikapu]

I was doing a little bit of "posts" analysing for the last couple of days on this thread, and my findings were very disturbing. The whole analysis was a little bit like testing athletes for "dopping", and what I found was very much like the Tour the France winner/losser which tested way way above normal subtance in "Testosterone". So I have prescribed for Piratis, Kifeas, Miltiades, Mrfromng, Bananiot, Simon, Bg_Turk,Viewpoint, Pyrpolizer and few others, a heavy dozes of "Estrogen" for you all to calm down, and get in touch with your feminine side a little. You should all be feeling more kissy kissy and lovey lovey by morning. It turns out, I was normal, so I will maintain my usual manly self.

... George Burns, a Comedian / Actor at the age of 99, shortly before his death, was asked by a reporter, "Mr. Burns, don't you think is dangerous for a man at your age, having sex with much younger woman", in which he replied, "Hey, if she dies, she dies".