Cyprus-Forum.com

[bg_turk]

Their motivation is not religious fanaticism; but Turkish nationalism, imperialism and irredentism!

What a lie, what a distortion! Turkish Cypriots are the most open-minded and anti-nationalistic Turks that you can find. Often they are criticized in Turkey for not being nationalistic enough. Sezer even refused to meet President Talat in Anakara for his friendly policies towards the south.

[Bananiot]

Kifeas, you have tried to set the mind of Issy1956 at rest by pronouncing categorically that we have buried our aspirations for enosis and that Greece is no longer militarily involved in Cyprus. That is good, but as you probably know, the damage that has been done by our persistant pursuing of unachievable objectives, cannot be deleted by saying "look we have changed now, let's go back to what we were". Any schizo could tell you this but of course, it would take a bigger schizo to ignore this plain fact.

[Pyrpolizer]

Similarly, there is no Hitler in modern Germany. Should the Germans claim Gdansk, back from Poland? I am afraid this is not how the world functions. Parts of East Germany have been lost for ever for Germany, because of the policies of Nazi Germany. I cannot really see how we (the little minnows) can convince the world to go back to the situation as it were. I wish we could but simply these things do not function like this. At best we should aim at a compromise and try to save as much as possible. to save as much as possible. From the Greek Cypriot point of view, that is. Otherwise we risk to lose much more.

Defeatist of the forum, would you take Viewpoint’s proposal for partition on an 18% basis
to save as much as possible?

NB. Waiting your usual rhetoric accusing Honorable Mr Papadopoulos, and you red white and blue ghosts, for an answer.

[Bananiot]

Partition? My help is not needed. Papadopoulos is doing quite well, by himself!

[Pyrpolizer]

Papadopoulos huh?

What did I tell you?



You are such a predictable Defeatist


Papadopoulos huh?

[Pyrpolizer]

BTW the question was not to help or provide assistance. The question was WOULD YOU ACCEPT?

Defeatist of the forum, would you take Viewpoint’s proposal for partition on an 18% basis
to save as much as possible?

NB. Waiting your usual rhetoric accusing Honorable Mr Papadopoulos, and you red white and blue ghosts, for an answer.

[Bananiot]

The path to partition is two-pronged. One way is to mutually agree for it and go for velvet partition. The other way is to insist on maximalist gains and thus cement partition. Your right Honourable, has already stated that the present situation constitutes the second best solution, thus, perhaps you should contemplate asking Papadopoulos your little, silly and moronic questions

[Kifeas]

Kifeas, you have tried to set the mind of Issy1956 at rest by pronouncing categorically that we have buried our aspirations for enosis and that Greece is no longer militarily involved in Cyprus. That is good, but as you probably know, the damage that has been done by our persistant pursuing of unachievable objectives, cannot be deleted by saying "look we have changed now, let's go back to what we were". Any schizo could tell you this but of course, it would take a bigger schizo to ignore this plain fact.

Bananiot, the nature of your intervention in this discussion is completely redundant and only provocative. First of all, no one has made any reference to the type and nature of the solution, as such, that we should be striving to agree between our selves (i.e. the two communities!) No one has said that we should be trying or insisting to go back to any kind of past situation pertaining or relating to the nature of our (two communities) relationship. The fact that we (the GCs) have agreed to a bi-communal and a bi-zonal federal solution, since 1975, and that we still continue to try for a solution on that basis, is a fact that proves that their no such pursuit or agenda, contrary to what you have tried to imply. You are mixing up two different issues. The nature and the parameters of the political settlement that we the two communities should try to establish, which must also be based on sound and universally acknowledged and accepted premises, and the fact that Turkey wants to promote and secure a “solution” that will further its geo-strategic interests in and with Cyprus, a factor and a parameter that complicates and endangers the prospects of an agreed solution between the two communities. The present day comparison between the agendas of the two “motherlands” is a perfectly legitimate one, in the sense that Greece doesn’t have any similar or parallel objectives that Turkey does, and which would inevitably further complicate the prospects of a solution. This is an undeniable fact, and this is what we are discussing! I have no doubt that should Turkey have adopted a similar stance and distance with Cyprus that Greece has, we would have been able to find a compromised and agreed solution between our selves, a long time ago! The TC community is not “free” to negotiate and agree on the merits and basis of its own legitimate and genuine interests, and on the basis and merits of its common future with the GC community in Cyprus, but rather (or in addition to them) on the merits and basis of Turkey’s geo-strategic interests in Cyprus, something that makes a solution -so far- an impossible task!

[Viewpoint]

VP , you did not use the inverted commas , I did to show that you posted the phrase.
I do come to Cyprus quite often , but as I said earlier I see T/Cs daily here in London because of the line of business I'm in. I avoid political discussions but always talk about the best place in the world being Cyprus.
They all know me as fierce supporter of the Cypriot identity and I think I'm respected for that at least.

Unfortunately knoeing the TCs and Gcs in London are no comparison to actually living on the island and actually living the Cypriot life. The people in London and I fear yourself are stuck in a time warp they still feel Cyprus is the best place in the world and they all want to return "someday" which never seems to come around. I dont wont to burst any of the bubbles in your head but people on both sides are to wrapped up in making a living and raising their children the best way they can. We have been seperated for 32 years so the people on the other side of the border do not play a role in our lives and no one relaly seems to care about reunification as they dont feel it wll ever happen. This stem from the negative result of the referendum and the current negativity which comes out of the south, the fact that a GC administration would not allow refugees from Lebanon to dock at Famagusta is a clear sign of what I mean. We have become more TCs and GCs than ever before, we are more TRNC orientated, and reunification or even a solution is something which many feel will never take place. Lots of talk and fuss without a result.

[Viewpoint]

This has totally confused me, you want us to love you?

Love is good but not required. If you are racist and you can not love, live along, talk etc with somebody due to his race thats your problem.

What I want, what I actually demand, is respect to our human and democratic rights and the sovereignty of our country.
Refusing to show this kind of respect is criminal and illegal and you should expect that in return you will face the concequences of your illegal choices.

Respect is a prerequisite for trust, love or anything else. If there is no respect then a "cold war" is the best that can happen between us.

You can demand all you want this doesnt mean you will get, the current situation is a result of our own actions so we have to bear the consequences until a time we can trust each other again.

Respect =To take notice of; to regard with special attention; to regard as worthy of special consideration; hence, to care for; to heed.

Trust = Assured resting of the mind on the integrity, veracity, justice, friendship, or other sound principle, of another person; confidence; reliance; reliance.

If you take into account the above meanings of the words Respect and Trust you will see I can respect you but I dont have to trust you which I do not. This is my biggest problem with many GCs I do not trust their sincerity and do not feel they are genuine in their desire for a united Cyprus made up of 2 equal partners.