Cyprus-Forum.com

[Pyrpolizer]

his is the man who promote war as a possible future solution and is preapring by going to the gym and taking shooting lessons so that one night when we are weak he will creep up on us and no not to give us roses but shoot us with point blank accuracy.

My, my so the gyms became sort of Military Academies today?

I won a free one month ticket for a gym a couple of years ago. It was full of hungry women staring the muscles of men, and hungry men lured by the bottoms of women. Almost everybody was looking for an extramarital affair there.

I told my observations to my missus, she pulled my ears, never let me go there again.
What did I do?

[miltiades]

VP , I hope I did not offend you by wrongly presuming you were a woman. It was an honest mistake .My apologies.

[Natty]

Kifeas,

I'm sure you know what you're talking about with the above, but I'm having a hard time getting my hands around it to try and understand how it all suppose to work. Are you saying, if there are 80 GC members and 20 TC members in the parliament (80%-20%), then only 16 GC and 4 TC members (20%) +1 to have a simple majority to make some decisions, and 24 GC and 6 TC members (30%) +1 to make decisions on higher level.??

Not exactly!
I think what I said is quite simple.
If we have a house of 100 members (80 GCs plus 20 TCs) and decisions are taken on simple majority, it means that at least any 51 members out of the above 100 members will have to approve it. However, in order to qualify as simple majority, at least 4 (or 6) of the votes must come (included in the 51 votes needed) from the 20 TCs (20% or 30% of the TC members,) and at least 16 (or 24) of the votes must come from (included in the 51votes needed) from the 80 GCs.

For example we can have the following combination for simple majority to qualify.
I take a special case example that needs 30% minimum from each side.

Case 1:
6 TCs plus 45 GCs equals 51 /100. (Qualifies)

Case 2:
20 TCs plus 31 GCs equals 51 /100. (Qualifies)

Case 3:
5 TCs plus 46 GCs equals 51 /100 (it doesn’t qualify)

Case 4:
1 TC plus 80 GCs equals 81 /100 (it doesn’t qualify)

It may achieve the same results perhaps, however, I think numbers mean something in the psyche of the TC's to have equal number of members in the lagislator. The 50-50 is seen as an equal partners in decision making, and if we had 50 members from each side in the House (Congress), for the simple majority 50%+1 to pass or reject any laws, before going to the next stage to the equal number members in the Senate, to achieve the 60% to become law. I think this method adds more safeguards in protecting the rights of all Cyptiots.

Therefore you are basically saying that the 50:50 issue is rather symbolic than one of essence for the TCs. And why the GCs should not claim the above argument (symbolisms rather than essence,) so that they stand against a 50:50 representation.

What you seem to be asking is not for Political equality like the TCs were asking so far, but you are also asking for numerical equality too. Well, will your community be willing to contribute the 50% of the annual budget for the government as well, or you will only be contributing your proposition, which currently would even be less than the 18%. Isn’t this also a symbolic issue for you?

What I offered above is a form of political equality, as you have been asking for one, and as it is defined by the UN resolutions. What you are asking for is a levelling out of two numerically unequal groups of people. Why should we be paying from our tax money the salaries of 50 TC MPs and 50 GC MPs, if the TC community's tax contribution will at best be equal to the 18% of the budget, and the rest will be the GC contribution?

Kifeas,

Thanks for your examples above. I now understand what you meant with your percentages for the voting system within the government. As far as I can see, what you have proposed makes good sense, and it appears to be fair. As far as the 50-50 "numerical numbers" goes to have equal members on both sides, the results will be the same in the House ( Congress) , since the budget to pay for 100 members will cost the same, whether they are 50-50 or 80-20. Sometimes "good will" is worth much more on the long run than just money.!! I guess with the Parliamentary system, you would also want to do away with the second layer of government in decision making, being the SENATE.

Kifeas, overall, I do not have a problem with what you have outlined for both sides to work together, and with all the safeguars in place, I would accept it.

Sounds like a good plan to me..Or at least it's a plan that can be used as a basis....

[Kikapu]

I think what I said is quite simple.
If we have a house of 100 members (80 GCs plus 20 TCs) and decisions are taken on simple majority, it means that at least any 51 members out of the above 100 members will have to approve it. However, in order to qualify as simple majority, at least 4 (or 6) of the votes must come (included in the 51 votes needed) from the 20 TCs (20% or 30% of the TC members,) and at least 16 (or 24) of the votes must come from (included in the 51votes needed) from the 80 GCs.

For example we can have the following combination for simple majority to qualify.
I take a special case example that needs 30% minimum from each side.

Case 1:
6 TCs plus 45 GCs equals 51 /100. (Qualifies)

Case 2:
20 TCs plus 31 GCs equals 51 /100. (Qualifies)

Case 3:
5 TCs plus 46 GCs equals 51 /100 (it doesn’t qualify)

Case 4:
1 TC plus 80 GCs equals 81 /100 (it doesn’t qualify)

.

There were almost no response to these "power sharing" proposals made by Kifeas last week. With the right safety guards in place, I can support these proposal, so I would like to ask those who would NOT support it, to give their reasons. I'm I missing something here, or can this actually work.??

[andri_cy]

I completely agree with you Kikapu I think this can make things possible.

[Kikapu]

I think what I said is quite simple.
If we have a house of 100 members (80 GCs plus 20 TCs) and decisions are taken on simple majority, it means that at least any 51 members out of the above 100 members will have to approve it. However, in order to qualify as simple majority, at least 4 (or 6) of the votes must come (included in the 51 votes needed) from the 20 TCs (20% or 30% of the TC members,) and at least 16 (or 24) of the votes must come from (included in the 51votes needed) from the 80 GCs.

For example we can have the following combination for simple majority to qualify.
I take a special case example that needs 30% minimum from each side.

Case 1:
6 TCs plus 45 GCs equals 51 /100. (Qualifies)

Case 2:
20 TCs plus 31 GCs equals 51 /100. (Qualifies)

Case 3:
5 TCs plus 46 GCs equals 51 /100 (it doesn’t qualify)

Case 4:
1 TC plus 80 GCs equals 81 /100 (it doesn’t qualify)

.

There were almost no response to these "power sharing" proposals made by Kifeas last week. With the right safety guards in place, I can support these proposal, so I would like to ask those who would NOT support it, to give their reasons. I'm I missing something here, or can this actually work.??

OK, I have given you all plenty of time to object to Kifeas's "power sharing" solution proposals, and since no one is objecting to it, I think we should give Kifeas a big hand for working towards a solution to the Cyprus problem. Now, we need to find a method for each side to trust each other to actually make the whole thing work.

[miltiades]

LETS HAVE A GAME OF TAVLI , WINNER TAKES ALL !!!

[Natty]

I'm up for that!! Although brace yourselves for a hard game, because I am rather good...

Lets just say, It won't be a walk in the park....

[Kikapu]

LETS HAVE A GAME OF TAVLI , WINNER TAKES ALL !!!

Miltiades,

My 11 year old and the 8 year old twin nephews came to visit me last week from London, so I thought I'll teach them the game of "Tavla". The 11 year old, the little bastard beat me with his first game, as well as driving the fastest lap by .5 seconds on the Go-Cart circuit. I just barely beat the twins on the track. Did not want to face humiliation on the "Tavla" by the twins, so we did not play, so now you're asking me to play Tavla with you, so that I can lose Cyprus to you.!! Are you crazy or what.?? Or to reverse the question, am I crazy or what.??

[miltiades]

My late father used to play tavli in the village cafenes , but he would get to 4 and never quite managed to get to the final 5 th game, and win the match .To this day there is a saying in the village as well as surrounding villages , that goes like this. Two guys playing Tavli one gets to win 4 games and the other one says " Epien tsio mastre Mirtis osta tessera "
meaning " Mastre Mirtis also reached 4 "
Well I inherited lots of traits from my father but loosing at Tavli is not one of them , so you are on Kikapu.!!