Cyprus-Forum.com

[sadik]

* Talat-Papadopoulos have confirmed the basis of a solution will be a bizonal,bicommunal federation based on political equality.

You forgot to add "...as it was defined in the UN SC resolutions."

Thanks for the addition.

* Technical commities will be formed to discuss issues of substance as well as issues related to the daily lives of both communities

This was true only until last Sunday. On Monday (yesterday,) Turkish foreign ministry expressed their position that they are against the handling of the substantive issues on the Cyprus problem within the context of technical committees. Instead, the FM spokesman said, Turkey wants these issues to be negotiated within the framework of the Annan Plan.

Kifeas, I just re-read the Turkish Foreign ministers and his spoke persons statement a few times. They did not say anywhere that the substantive issues will not be discussed in the commitees. They said that they they support Talat, who says the issues of substance will be discussed together with daily matters. They also say that the issue of troop withdrawal and return of Varosha (before a solution) will not be discussed in these commitees. I understand that they have already accepted to discuss the rest of the issues in commitees. The Turkish side is still making references to the Annan plan for various reasons, but it's clear that individual issues will be discussed.

Then I wonder what they are willing to discuss in the committees, if they exclude the above two in advance, especially the return of Varosha. Perhaps only the issue of direct trade? Do you know?

That basically means we will have a stalemate and a halt of the whole process, as soon as the committees are formed by the end of the month, since the two sides will not be able to agree which substantial issues they should negotiate on, and therefore also the discussion on non-sentential issues will not proceed.

Discussing the return of Varosha *immediately*, and the return of Varosha as part of a comprehensive settlement are different things. They say that they will not discuss the former in these commitees, but I understand that the latter may be discussed. It's the same with troop withdrawals. So, it appears that the whole package for a comprehensive settlement will be open for discussion. If it goes forward, this is will be something very significant. This is not a negotiation on the basis of the Annan Plan, this is the process for the preparation of a whole new plan. I hope that we don't have the type of crisis at the end of the month that you mention.

[Kifeas]

I hope not as well, but ...!

[Socrates]

The European solution.

This article speaks with reason (unfortunately in Greek).

http://www.politis.com.cy/cgibin/hweb?- ... V=articles

It says what Europeans are thinking a new line for a solution about the protocol issue.

They will push Turkey for an accommodation and they will leave the problem to be solved by UN. According to this article, Europeans are thinking to offer to Turkey a partial acceptance of the protocol to help the negotiations and not to destroy them.

This will be an evolvement in the relations between Turkey and Europe and in exchange our side will give them the right to open the Famagusta harbor under European authority.

The European commissioner Oli Ren saying what he is supporting the UN efforts in a solution as fast as possible based on bizonal bicommunal federation.

I don’t believe what UN or Europe will let to start negotiations from zero point.

To establish a new constitution we will need at least 10 years so everyone is supporting a solution based on the Anan plan constitution when they are speaking for a solution us soon as possible.

And as the Greek says idou I rodos idou kai to pidima.

This is the only scenarios:

1)Bizonal Bicommunal Federation.
2)Division, two separate states or confederation
3)Turkey blocks the negotiations and save us from the number 2.

The only reason are this movement is made by UN is to open the European door to Turkey so I don’t believe what there is chance for the 3 scenario.

[sadik]

The European solution.

This article speaks with reason (unfortunately in Greek).

http://www.politis.com.cy/cgibin/hweb?- ... V=articles

It says what Europeans are thinking a new line for a solution about the protocol issue.

They will push Turkey for an accommodation and they will leave the problem to be solved by UN. According to this article, Europeans are thinking to offer to Turkey a partial acceptance of the protocol to help the negotiations and not to destroy them.

This will be an evolvement in the relations between Turkey and Europe and in exchange our side will give them the right to open the Famagusta harbor under European authority.

The European commissioner Oli Ren saying what he is supporting the UN efforts in a solution as fast as possible based on bizonal bicommunal federation.

I don’t believe what UN or Europe will let to start negotiations from zero point.

To establish a new constitution we will need at least 10 years so everyone is supporting a solution based on the Anan plan constitution when they are speaking for a solution us soon as possible.

And as the Greek says idou I rodos idou kai to pidima.

This is the only scenarios:

1)Bizonal Bicommunal Federation.
2)Division, two separate states or confederation
3)Turkey blocks the negotiations and save us from the number 2.

The only reason are this movement is made by UN is to open the European door to Turkey so I don’t believe what there is chance for the 3 scenario.

Socrates,

As usual, Denktas is trying to do number 3. He is organizing a meeting on the 13th with "all the organizations that support the TRNC" to prepare a common declaration to warn Turkey. In this declaration he is saying that:
* Turkey is being deceived in its EU path and this will lead to unrecoverable consequences in the Cyprus issue.
* TCs have gained nothing by saying "Yes" to the Annan Plan.
* Those who made the TC people say "Yes" to the Annan Plan, have deceived the world that the TC people have given up their right to self determination.
* Turkey is facing additional requirements which are not demanden from other countries in its EU paths
* Because of all these things, Turkey should get out of the EU process and define a new Cyprus policy based on the coexistence of two states in Cyprus.
( http://www.halkinsesi.org/?newsid=11739 )

But Talat is not Denktas, he definitely will not shoot himself on the foot.

[Socrates]

Denktash is psychopath like our own great stupid patriots.

And he want the 3 because he THINKS what he will achieve the 2 he is afraid what his friend Papadopoulos will eventually betrayed him and accept a UN solution.

The most possible scenario is number 1 because the majority of our politician’s are not nationalists stupids that they are living in mythology. Akel and Disi and all the Greek politicians will support dynamically the 1 st scenario and I believe what eventually they will be succeed and our people will wake up this time, because every one knows what there will not be a third chance for us.

The worst scenario is that Papadopoulos and the rest psychopaths will be through again in our(people) back their own mistakes and let us decide again by our emotions and our damaged psychology.

Papadopoulos will not block, Turkey will not block, so the only enemy for a solution is our(TC and GC) psychology.

This is the European solution and I strongly believe what eventually will solve the problem in the one way or in the other.

[Piratis]

BBF does not mean Annan plan which was based on the Swiss Confederation and it was even looser than that.

When a democratic with respect to human rights BBF solution is proposed then it will be accepted. But not "solutions" that were created to solve the problem of Turkey (EU accession) instead of the problems of Cypriots.

[Socrates]

[sadik]

A short Kemalist perspective on Turkish Cypriots by one of the most vocal Kemalist journalists in Turkey, Emin Colasan.

The article is mostly about the wrong Turkish policy on Cyprus. The following is the part that he talks about Turkish Cypriots. I kept the original quotation marks.

(...)
I want to draw your attention to a subject that the Turkish public persistantly avoids to discuss and denies to see.
We have all this sensitivity toward the Cyprus Issue but does the Turkish Cypriot community share the same sensitivity? No!
If we leave it to them, the majority, including Mr. Talat, is thinking of cutting their ties with Turkey, agreeing and uniting with the Greek side and putting the EU passport in their pockets. The same "Turkish" majority is tired of living under the "Turkish rule" and they don't want us. We need to know the realities.
(...)

http://hurarsiv.hurriyet.com.tr/goster/ ... &yazarid=5

[Piratis]

Sadik, I am afraid that the majority of TCs are aligned with Turkey when it comes to the Cyprus problem. It appears that the partition dream is well inside the heads of most Turkish Cypriots and they value this dream higher than legality, higher than respect toward Greek Cypriots, and higher even that their own interests which would have been in a united democratic Cyprus part of EU without racist or other discriminations.

For most TCs "unity" actually means a form of loose association (like Annan plan) that would allow them to end the isolation, become EU members and get richer. I hope they will realize that such kind of "unity" does not exist and in the end they will have to choose between a true unity or to remain under an illegal Turkish puppet state.

[Viewpoint]

True unity GC style or UN style? There are many shades Piratis you just havent discovered them.