Cyprus-Forum.com

[Svetlana]

Can we stick to the topic, please, otherwise this will end in CYProb..

Lana

[complexity]

To begin with I would like to express that I am not a racist of any kind eventhough being racist or not is something on the lines of majority judgement of aspect. Indeed Piratis your words are correct. "What if turkey decides NOT to acknowledge the whole world tomorrow?" Does that make the whole world a disputed area for territorial ownership? I Think NOT!. In the meanwhile I would like to express that turkey has always been devious , cunniving , unstrategic and unthruthfull as a nation. The mission was clearly a monitoring/spy mission which turkey would never admit but the world is definately not stupid.

For all I care the turkish government will not be able to host a part of the EU apple pie in their country or diplomacy OR even democracy. For all I care all they can host is an atom bomb , a really big one , that turns them into a big desert. Perhaps that way they will be able to dispute over sand plots

I am not a bad person of any kind. I just think that looking back into turkish history they seem to play it with low blows and deviance.

Deep condolanses to all who mourn for the greek pilot and deep condolanses to the turkish people that have to live with the scars from their nation's leaders - It makes you look like murderers while its not the people but the government that should be hanged.


Mario

[cypezokyli]

Turkey has offered to open a bilateral dialogue with Greece to resolve
these issues. However, Greece has rejected a broad-based bilateral dialogue, arguing that there is only one issue that needs to be resolved—the continental shelf. This issue, Greece argues, should be
submitted to the ICJ at the Hague for adjudication. However, Turkey
has refused to submit the issue to the ICJ, preferring instead to resolve
the issue through bilateral negotiations, where it feels it has
more leverage.

Same attitude like Armenians, Greece determines something and rejects all dialogues so what is next a self-claimed genocide of pontus whereas you need an international court decision to sentence some acction as genocide...
I wont be surpsided if that happend we are talking about my dear tiny mini superNAtional Greece

I wish Greece learned a lesson and would not try to convert all Aegean Sea a GREEK LAKE by all means anymore

common akiner the above has two important lines and you chose to underline only one of the two.

if greece stupiditly rejects dialogue why does turkey reject the ICJ ?

its a typical greco-turkish stupidity imo.

[sadik]

You know nothing about being a pilot in the airforce. This is not about nationalism or something. This is only about adrenaline. These pilots do that all the time just for adrenaline and sometimes they have these kind of accidents.

The question is why the Turkish military command allows/encourages their pilots to exercise their adrenaline in Greek airspace.
If a strict command was coming from the Turkish airforce commander ordering pilots to stay out of the Greek airspace, do you think the pilots would not obey?

The Turkish military not only allows or encourages, they order their pilots to violate the "airspace". This is not a secret. This has many reasons, one of which is that with thousands of islands and pieces of rocks in the Aegean, if Greece extends its airspace and the territorial waters as it wishes, the Aegean will completely be inaccessible to Turkish planes and ships. In a somewhat similar situation, Turkey is providing access to its straits into the Black sea for Russia and other countries, even risking major disasters in the case of oil tankers, even though these places are completely enclosed by Turkish soil. So this issue is not an arbitrary one.

Turkish planes flying in the Aegean always fly unarmed by the way. This incident is an accident.

[akiner]

Akiner , are you a Cypriot ?

no miltiades, should i be one to express my opinions?!

[sadik]

To begin with I would like to express that I am not a racist of any kind eventhough being racist or not is something on the lines of majority judgement of aspect. Indeed Piratis your words are correct. "What if turkey decides NOT to acknowledge the whole world tomorrow?" Does that make the whole world a disputed area for territorial ownership? I Think NOT!. In the meanwhile I would like to express that turkey has always been devious , cunniving , unstrategic and unthruthfull as a nation. The mission was clearly a monitoring/spy mission which turkey would never admit but the world is definately not stupid.

For all I care the turkish government will not be able to host a part of the EU apple pie in their country or diplomacy OR even democracy. For all I care all they can host is an atom bomb , a really big one , that turns them into a big desert. Perhaps that way they will be able to dispute over sand plots

I am not a bad person of any kind. I just think that looking back into turkish history they seem to play it with low blows and deviance.

Deep condolanses to all who mourn for the greek pilot and deep condolanses to the turkish people that have to live with the scars from their nation's leaders - It makes you look like murderers while its not the people but the government that should be hanged.


Mario

The Aegean issue is not an unstrategic issue in any way. Considering the fact that Greece occupied half of Turkey at one point causing hundreds of thousands of deaths, Turkish paranoia against Greece has its historical reasons. Turkey does not want to find itself in a strategically disadvantaged situation. Turkey should not be bullying its neighbors and try to have good relationships with them. However, not everything Turkey does is for an evil reason.

[reeshahn]

You know nothing about being a pilot in the airforce. This is not about nationalism or something. This is only about adrenaline. These pilots do that all the time just for adrenaline and sometimes they have these kind of accidents.

The question is why the Turkish military command allows/encourages their pilots to exercise their adrenaline in Greek airspace.
If a strict command was coming from the Turkish airforce commander ordering pilots to stay out of the Greek airspace, do you think the pilots would not obey?

The point is Greek military is doing the same. This is a game between Greek and Turkish pilots. This game is fun only with Greeks. I mean other neighbours of Turkey have no airforce of have but with so old technology and unskilled pilots. Only Greek pilots are good enough to spend time and it is the same for Greeks, only Turkish pilots are good enough to spend time. Believe me I know much more than you know. I can give you first hand information about it.

[Kikapu]

In the old days the territorial waters and air space use to be 3 miles from the coast, which was reasonable. Now every country want to extend their waters and air space as far out as possible. In the 80's Libya claimed 100 miles and USA only recognised 20 miles, as a result 2 Libyan jets were shot down by the US. UK claimed 200 miles to protect the fish for them selves, and the examples go on. There are so many little islands between Greece and Turkey, it would be very hard to avoid these extended territorial waters and air space, when these jets are flying at high speeds.

What is there of importance for Turkey to spy on, on these little islands anyway? Each side just want to show the other the paint work on their planes and flex their muscles by getting so close to each other, and this time they got too close. I doubt they will ever find out exactly who was where. Everybody wants to be "TOP GUN".

[Kifeas]

You know nothing about being a pilot in the airforce. This is not about nationalism or something. This is only about adrenaline. These pilots do that all the time just for adrenaline and sometimes they have these kind of accidents.

The question is why the Turkish military command allows/encourages their pilots to exercise their adrenaline in Greek airspace.
If a strict command was coming from the Turkish airforce commander ordering pilots to stay out of the Greek airspace, do you think the pilots would not obey?

The point is Greek military is doing the same. This is a game between Greek and Turkish pilots. This game is fun only with Greeks. I mean other neighbours of Turkey have no airforce of have but with so old technology and unskilled pilots. Only Greek pilots are good enough to spend time and it is the same for Greeks, only Turkish pilots are good enough to spend time. Believe me I know much more than you know. I can give you first hand information about it.

Do you mean that Greece is also violating Turkey's airspace so that they can have fun with the Turkish pilots?

[Kifeas]

In the old days the territorial waters and air space use to be 3 miles from the coast, which was reasonable. Now every country want to extend their waters and air space as far out as possible. In the 80's Libya claimed 100 miles and USA only recognised 20 miles, as a result 2 Libyan jets were shot down by the US. UK claimed 200 miles to protect the fish for them selves, and the examples go on. There are so many little islands between Greece and Turkey, it would be very hard to avoid these extended territorial waters and air space, when these jets are flying at high speeds.

What is there of importance for Turkey to spy on, on these little islands anyway? Each side just want to show the other the paint work on their planes and flex their muscles by getting so close to each other, and this time they got too close. I doubt they will ever find out exactly who was where. Everybody wants to be "TOP GUN".

You probably confuse territorial water rights with continental shelf rights. They are two different issues however. Every country, according to international sea marine law, has the right to extent their territorial waters up to 12 miles. This means that the area up to 12 miles from the coast is regarded as territory in which such a country has sovereign control of the waters, surface and airspace above it. In case the distance between two countries is less than that, then the mid point is taken between them. Continental shelf however, is an area beyond the territorial waters, in which case is regarded as international waters, but in which every country has the right up to 200 miles to solely exploit the nelow the sea floor natural resources, such as oil and natural gas reserves. Again, if two countries’ continental shelf distance is less than the maximum permitted 200 miles, then the mid point is taken between them.