Cyprus-Forum.com

[growuptcs]

We gotta baby step first to show everyone that we dont need them and we can get along, without jumping on the property issue because thats what sparks everyone. When its time for that, everyone has to NOT be on an empty stomach, gotten laid, and it will help them think and negotiate with a clear head.

[andri_cy]

Hang on Andri, I'll stand up for him. Yes he was wrong to lose it, but he did the right thing and stepped away from the forum until he has cooled down. I hope he comes back. We are dealing with humans here – and humans are all fallable. There are exceptions: Mandela, Gandhi, Christ (although they all lost their rag from time to time). But that's what makes them exceptions, they are exceptional. The VAST majority of us are grunts who are only a few slaps away from picking up a rock and hurling it – and that's why the Cyprus problem exists in the first bloody place.

Well thats good he has someone standing up for him , so as frog's musketeer you wont mind me standing up for malaka and GCG. Malaka has the right to be frustrated and angry. Maybe he went a little bit too far, but someone like frog who claims he wants peace and lots of other bullshit and then tell us how he really feels, well there is no excuse for that. I dont care if he walked away for a minute or not. I still havent seen an apology coming from him.

I will defend Frog's actions because he was provoked into letting the animal inside him out by other members never taking any steps to restrain their animal inside. I have not once witnessed GCG attempting to restrain her animal inside, so I will afford her no respect until she demonstrates such restraint. Then I will leap right in there.

Yes maybe he was provoked but I can argue the same for Malaka. Someone threw his family out and killed a bunch of his relatives and friends. How about him being provoked and defending him? Frog is an adult with children probably the age of Malaka. Always on a high horse and people makign excuses for him and defending him. Malaka suffered and maybe suffers to this day.

Andri, would you prefer us to believe that you are looking down on the rest of us from some glowing white cloud, thinking to yourself "Ah. my poor, struggling children – one day they too will be like unto me?"

Actually I would not care how you think of me. I never thought I was better than any of you or anyone else. I am what my parents raised me to be and I am proud of it. I sure am not going around telling people that they have a god complex when I do not know them.

And to answer your question, everyone in my family including me swears from frustration, that doesnt make us right

No, it makes us HUMAN.

Now, everybody, time for a group hug. Come on, group hug! Andri? You too Malaka. Malaka? You know you want too...

The fact that we all get frustrated and swear at each other every now and then does make us human. But we shouldnt use that as an excuse so we can get a free pass. We should always try be better.

[kalahari]

Now let's get one thing quite clear – just because I am defending Frog's little outburst, this does not mean I am not sympathising with Malaka's past, at any rate sympathising with it as much as somebody who has not lived through genocide can sympathise with it.

I do not wish to dilute in any way the horror that Malaka has lived through. In fact I would truly appreciate a serious documentary account of precsiely what Malaka did live through, so that we have some definitions to look at. I think that would be good for all us multi-national self-opinionated bastards who feel the need to sound off at complete strangers about something we know very little about. I would love for malaka and GCG et al to educate me about what exactly they feel so incensed about.

We can all read the history books, but they will never give us an true dimension of what these people have personally experienced.

And then, maybe, just maybe, Malaka and GCG will feel less inclined to bang on about how we are all Turk appeasers and gits and dogs and anything else they can think up to insult us with.

Because the main reason we all come to this forum is to discuss, to communicate, to understand. So let's do that.

Nowhere on this forum do I see "Cyprus-slageverybodyelseoff.com"
"Cyprus-getreallyangrywithtotalstrangers.com" "cyprus-insultawayyourblues.com"

As for apologies from frog – yup, I agree with you. He should have the good grace to apologise to everybody for his outburst.

And to show him exactly how a heartfelt apology sounds, let's empty the floor boys and girls for malaka and GCG to apologise to everybody that they've insulted over the past 100 or so posts.

(Just the one apology will do.)

And Andri...

Actually I would not care how you think of me. I never thought I was better than any of you or anyone else. I am what my parents raised me to be and I am proud of it.

No, I made it quite clear I was mucking about when I said the white cloud thing. I know you don't have a God complex, I was making a rather clumsy point about how we are ALL human, and therefore not angels anyone of us. I am sure that your parents did a bloody fine job on you, your posts are testamant to that.

Please don't start saying things like

I sure am not going around telling people that they have a god complex when I do not know them.

Because you sure as eggs don't come to this forum just to tell every body not to judge one another and point out that they know nothing about each other, do you?

I don't know, maybe you do. Seems a rather pointless reason to indulge in conversation to me. Not gonna learn much if you don't form judgements. I'm guessing that right now you're forming an opinion on me. You even gave me a little rap across the knuckles (which I deserved) for the God complex shot. Didn't you?

We should always try be better.

Damn right we should. I will do my best.

Let's finish the night on a conundrum.

Which is nobler?

The man who professes to hate and refuses to give in to love

or

The man who professes to love and allows himself to give in to hate?

Me, I prefer love. Feisty love, not that wimpy liberal crap, but love nevertheless. I'm quite burly really.

Kiss kiss, night night.

Kal.

[kalahari]

Hey! growuptcs! No fair! You edited the "trade" out of your post! Why non-profit? Profits are okay you know, Bob Geldof is a very rich man. (And yet, strangely, cannot afford a comb. Bloody beatnik good-for-nothing hippy. Mutter.) Anyway your second post was just as good, and just as valid. The trouble is this property issue just will not seem to lie down. Go on Malaka, tell 'im.

[growuptcs]

hey kalahari, the property issue is why we have differences in the first place. Its hard to just ignore why we're so bitter and why your not about the property issue. I'm not falling for that trap because its useless at this point to argue about getting nowhere. I would just like to talk about steps that we may all agree to, to put everyone in the mood of agreeing on something. Maybe then if we get on the same spirits, it might open up something positive.
Dont take me for using the property issue as a tool for blackmail, take it as if we are business partners and we both took a loss from an investment together, should I pay for the losses out of my pocket without you losing nothing, if we were in it together?

[kalahari]

War creates casualties, losses, deaths. In no way, shape or form is it good. Now, I have no experience of war, but I'm not stupid – you can see the evidence all through history.

I have also met people who survived the holocaust, lost family on a grand scale, fled their home and started again from scratch. They got on with it. I don't know how, but I do know that the ones that just got on with it were the ones that survived, the ones that had new families, new lives, new futures.

Of course the property thing cannot possibly mean the same to me as it does to you, but I too have had things that i have worked hard for taken from me. In the property crash in the UK I had £40,000 of hard work disappear from me within six months. I had no enemy that I could point at, no race of men that I could despise. I worked for a man that treated me like shit and grew rich off of my efforts by giving me promises – then lost it all through his stupidity leaving me with nothing to show for it but ten years of wasted life and bitter experience.

I am not looking for sympathy here, I am merely telling you the bad bits of my story. I moved on, rebuilt, started again. A road accident six years ago nearly killed me, nearly destroyed my business, left me with shattered nerves in my head. That's no fun either. But I got on, I rebuilt, I am doing okay.

You really don't want to hear all of my old shit, I certainly don't want to wallow in it or relive it every waking day. Things have to move on. People have to get on with their lives.

So while I understand the bitterness and why it exists, for Christ's sake guys, don't let it steal your futures.

I am going to move to Cyprus in 2006 to start again, to rebuild my life in a country of opportunity where my head won't hurt every time the temperature drops below 10 degrees, because the temperature doesn't fall below 10 degrees that often. There are other reasons too, and please don't think I'm saying "oh I'm so much braver and better than you guys". I'm not.

I just get so sad when I hear people like Malaka and GCG talking about their futures with so much agony and hate in them. You only get one go round folks, and nobody is goiing to do you any favours. You have to find it in yourself to be positive and get out there and make it happen.

Lots of love, Kal

[malaka]

War creates casualties, losses, deaths. In no way, shape or form is it good. Now, I have no experience of war, but I'm not stupid – you can see the evidence all through history.

I have also met people who survived the holocaust, lost family on a grand scale, fled their home and started again from scratch. They got on with it. I don't know how, but I do know that the ones that just got on with it were the ones that survived, the ones that had new families, new lives, new futures.

Of course the property thing cannot possibly mean the same to me as it does to you, but I too have had things that i have worked hard for taken from me. In the property crash in the UK I had £40,000 of hard work disappear from me within six months. I had no enemy that I could point at, no race of men that I could despise. I worked for a man that treated me like shit and grew rich off of my efforts by giving me promises – then lost it all through his stupidity leaving me with nothing to show for it but ten years of wasted life and bitter experience.

I am not looking for sympathy here, I am merely telling you the bad bits of my story. I moved on, rebuilt, started again. A road accident six years ago nearly killed me, nearly destroyed my business, left me with shattered nerves in my head. That's no fun either. But I got on, I rebuilt, I am doing okay.

You really don't want to hear all of my old shit, I certainly don't want to wallow in it or relive it every waking day. Things have to move on. People have to get on with their lives.

So while I understand the bitterness and why it exists, for Christ's sake guys, don't let it steal your futures.

I am going to move to Cyprus in 2006 to start again, to rebuild my life in a country of opportunity where my head won't hurt every time the temperature drops below 10 degrees, because the temperature doesn't fall below 10 degrees that often. There are other reasons too, and please don't think I'm saying "oh I'm so much braver and better than you guys". I'm not.

I just get so sad when I hear people like Malaka and GCG talking about their futures with so much agony and hate in them. You only get one go round folks, and nobody is goiing to do you any favours. You have to find it in yourself to be positive and get out there and make it happen.

Lots of love, Kal

My friend there is a big difference from losing something from a bad business decision and been forced out of your house and into a foreign country.

I read in one of your posts that you read somehwere that it wasnt intirely the Turks fault for the invasion ok that might be the case meaning some Greeks were also at fault.

So I and 200 000 other GC that had nothing to do with it have to suffer as a result.

Tell me how would you feel honestly if the IRA forced you out of your house and country killed familly members then brought over all the Irish



You then hear the Irish shouting you provoked us altough you were just probably just waking up in the morning like any other to hear sirens and wonder what the hell is going on.

30 odd years later the Irish want to negotiate with you We want to join UK but we do not want to give you your house back because an Irish settler now lives in it sorry but we will negotiate with you.

That is not negotiable forgivable forgettable in any language.

I for one even if it did not happen to me would say tell them to go to hell.
I want back what is mine I am the leggall owner I will move back if I want or I can burn it to the ground dont tell me you will compensate me for it.
Call that racists, call it hatred, call it what you want ABOVE ALL CALL IT FACT CAUSE THATS WHAT IT IS


PS When you do tell them to go to hell they come back and say WE FUCKED YOU OVER PISS ON U HOPE YOU NEVER GET ANYTHING BACK
Then you stand up for them

PPS By the way I will apologise to any one that I have offended that had nothing to do with what happenned to me and my family But to the ones that did THEY CAN ROT IN HELL

[kalahari]

Malaka, thank you. This is the first true glimpse into what happened to you that you have given me. You have started to humanise it for me. Please, my friend, tell us more. It is the only way we can hope to understand.

I can also now see how Frog's outburst was not just churlish name calling, which has been happening so much in this forum, but deeply insensitive gloating. The toruble with all the name calling is that it smothers your argument so that people like me cannot see anything other than rude, bitter, intransigent insults. In this, Andri was completely right.

You have called me your friend, and I am flattered by that. There is no irony here – I want to learn. I want to undestand. Please do me the honour of educating me by telling me what happened. If you can spare the time, give us the minutiae – don't be tempted into making big accusations. It's the detail that humanises the experience:

you were just probably just waking up in the morning like any other to hear sirens and wonder what the hell is going on.

IN that one small sentence you have given me a greater insight into your history than in any one of your previous tirades.

Please, my friend, tell us your story.

Love, Kal

[malaka]

Malaka, thank you. This is the first true glimpse into what happened to you that you have given me. You have started to humanise it for me. Please, my friend, tell us more. It is the only way we can hope to understand.

I can also now see how Frog's outburst was not just churlish name calling, which has been happening so much in this forum, but deeply insensitive gloating. The toruble with all the name calling is that it smothers your argument so that people like me cannot see anything other than rude, bitter, intransigent insults. In this, Andri was completely right.

You have called me your friend, and I am flattered by that. There is no irony here – I want to learn. I want to undestand. Please do me the honour of educating me by telling me what happened. If you can spare the time, give us the minutiae – don't be tempted into making big accusations. It's the detail that humanises the experience:

you were just probably just waking up in the morning like any other to hear sirens and wonder what the hell is going on.

IN that one small sentence you have given me a greater insight into your history than in any one of your previous tirades.

Please, my friend, tell us your story.

Love, Kal

I think my post summarises what happenned.

When time permitts I will give you a detailed story of what happenned to me and my familly and I think you will find that what happenned to us is what happeenned to the majority of people GC and TC

In the mean time I noticed you did not reply to any of my quetions/scenarios Why is that?

[andri_cy]

I think it is because you have made him think and he might be bothered by it but he agrees with you a bit. Maybe give him some time to think about everything you said. And I have to congratulate you malaka because you have got your point across without lowering yourself with cursing and name calling. Maybe people just need to hear youe story in detail.