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Cyprus invasion.

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Postby Kifeas » Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:51 am

bakala wrote:The whole purpose of my posts is to suggest that the Turkish landings were a predictable result of the Greek refusal to stop the atrocities
The Turkish landings were justified under the terms of the 1960 agreement

The evidence of one eye witness is not proof enough, but the evidence of so many cannot be ignored,


Which atrocities are you talking about Bakala? In 1974 there were no atrocities that were being carried out against T/Cs before or at the time the Turkish invasion had started, on the 20th of July. There was only a military coup perpetrated by the Junta in Greece against Makarios, the G/C elected president of the RoC, and the only fighting or killings that took place were between the pro-government forces and the coupists, i.e. only between G/Cs from both sides.

As for the Turkish invasion in 1974, it was clearly illegal according to the UN Charter, which predominates and overrules any other international treaty, including the 1960 treaty. The UN charter, which is the pinnacle and the ultimate of international law in the entire planet, stipulates clearly that no country has the right to invade or intervene in the internal affairs or territory of another UN member country, without prior UN Security Council approval, and irrespective of any other side agreements that may exist. Turkey, by invading or if you like it better "intervening" in 1974, it clearly violated international law as per the UN Charter, but it also violated the very treaty itself which she referred to, in order to justify her invasion, and which says that the only purpose for a guarantor power’s intervention is to re-establish the constitutional order. Turkey, by ethnically cleansing the G/C population from the north, dividing and occupying Cyprus for 32 years, did everything else but the re-establishment of the constitutional order in Cyprus.
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Postby tcklim » Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:55 am

From what I understand from the cyprus-conflict website, which I didnt read completely but skimmed through most of it, the initial landings seemed justified. The subsequent expansion of the territories, demands and killings were not.

Whereas I understand TC concerns, I do not and will never support the sale of GC property until after a permanenet solution agreed upon by both sides is found. Those that do buy, and find a solution works against their favour, have only themselves to blame. If you are thinking about moving to the North, do not buy property.... simple

However, it remains clear, that the hate-mongering and bigotry displayed here will never lead to a solution, because niether side can be bothered to listen to the other and lets be honest, theres a lot of hatred displayed around here.

Tassos wanting to meet with Talat and instantly discuss missing persons seems hostile, you should start off on simpler grounds and build a relationship before. If you meet for the first time and start flinging accusations back and forth, it will only cause further harm towards progress. My guess is Paps is doing this for just that reason, but we'll see...
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Postby bakala » Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:56 am

ever heard of bovine excretia ?

The military coup was a clear signal of the impending doom of the Turkish Cypriots
the coupists aim was enosis at all cost
do you think the turks were going to let that happen ?
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Postby bakala » Sat Apr 01, 2006 12:58 am

tcklim
at last someone with an open mind

thank you
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Postby bakala » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:08 am

anyone with common sense can see that once the troops had landed they had to move out of the bridgehead or be defeated its simple tactics

the turkish forces could not have held a small coastal position for very long the greek forces would have been able to concentrate their attack and wipe out the turks. They had no choice but to break out and spread their forces.

Once the first turkish troops landed the wholesale massacre of the enclaves began and the turks subsequently opened the front to encompass the turkish Enclaves,

when the subsequent ceasefire was agreed the Turks refused to withdraw and again place the Turkish Cypriots at the mercy of a goverment that had allready tried to wipe them out and who the hell can blame them .

The greeks who led the coup knew that it would force the turks to land,
every diplomat warned the greeks that any effort to force enosis on an unwilling population would result in the Turks stepping in. the Turks repeatedly appealed for the British to intervene so they wouldnt have to but the British were too slow


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Postby Kifeas » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:11 am

tcklim wrote:From what I understand from the cyprus-conflict website, which I didnt read completely but skimmed through most of it, the initial landings seemed justified. The subsequent expansion of the territories, demands and killings were not.



It will be good to see where this justification is based? Can you provide any quotation and /or a link?
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Postby bakala » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:19 am

Tcklim

its like a law of physics if you don’t agree with him you must be lying.
And you must back up your own feeling of what’s justified with a link as proof?


Nice try Tcklim mate
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Postby bakala » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:25 am

Kifeas

Cyprus is one, indivisible & belongs to its Cypriot people
You have this on every post
Can you tell me who the Cypriot people are please ?

Do you regard the Turkish Cypriots who have been born for generations on the island?
True Cypriots?
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Postby Kifeas » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:27 am

bakala wrote:ever heard of bovine excretia ?


If you translate it, then we will also know what it means.

The military coup was a clear signal of the impending doom of the Turkish Cypriots
the coupists aim was enosis at all cost
do you think the turks were going to let that happen ?


That was an assumption! The coupists could have been made to step down and allow the return of Makarios in very many other ways, and not necessarily through an invasion by Turkey! Let's see the things for what they are my friend. Turkey wanted an excuse (a pre-text) in order to invade and partition Cyprus. It made this objective clear, long before 1974, even since the late 1950's. It tried many times before to exploit such excuses or develop such pre-texts. Turkey was always ready to invade, no matter what! How do you explain the fact that within 5 days from the starting of the coup, it managed to mobilise such a huge force in order to carry out its invasion. If you were to begin from a zero basis, even for a country like the US, you need at least 3-4 weeks of preparation to mobilise such a force of 40,000 troops and 400-500 tanks, and make it ready to lunch such an operation. Turkey was clearly always ready for the moment that the opportunity would arise. If it wasn't the coup, it could have found any other excuse. It could have easily plotted some inter-communal crisis in some area of Cyprus, a very easy thing to do, in which a number of T/Cs would have been killed, so that it would get the excuse served to her in the plate.
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Postby Kifeas » Sat Apr 01, 2006 1:31 am

bakala wrote:Kifeas

Cyprus is one, indivisible & belongs to its Cypriot people
You have this on every post
Can you tell me who the Cypriot people are please ?

Do you regard the Turkish Cypriots who have been born for generations on the island?
True Cypriots?


Aren't they? If they aren't, why the RoC does gives them passports, ids, and so many other benefits, even though they live in the north, and many of them do also support the "TRNC?" What do you think?
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