Cyprus-Forum.com

[mehmet]

the point is that individuals that create problems for Turkish Cypriots did so (some of them in the uniforms given to them by RoC or Greece) with the knowledge that no one was going to stop them at the time. Now you we talk about justice? only after Turkish invasion. Sampson was a criminal before 1974, go read about it. Only when his actions (he was not alone) lead to present situation he get brought to justice.

Now if you are going to level all accusations at Turkey rather than individual soldiers, politicians etc. at least have the same standard and admit that the RoC and Greece cause suffering and should pay a price also.

[brother]

Now thats a fair statement is it not.

[Bananiot]

Mikkie, you claim that "It is obvious that now that it is not possibe to move away from the bizonal federal state".

I agree, again, but you need to make up your mind. If the above is your last word then, like me, you disagree with the dangerous game Papadopoulos is playing, which you stated and I agreed, that all he is after is for the TC's to come back to the RoC.

You also sited another important issue. "I think that many of you don't realise the implications of disolving the RoC and to create something else in its place. The consequences of doing that means that we would be in limbo ..." Nobody wants this. However, since a new state of affairs will be employed, the RoC will need to evolve into something else. I do not like this tyrrany of words but in a banana republic and with a President who has a head only for legalistic issues, one cannot avoid it. So, lets agree on this one too. Lets allow Cyprus to evolve, in a natural way, into a bicommunal, bizonal federation.

I support this as the only way to save our country. Simply, there is no other way. To expect a "european solution" is a fallacy. Such a thing does not exist. We have been told this by the europeans, by the UN, by Greece itself.

Yet, we do not want to listen. May be, we have other things in our mind. This is what worries me most.

[brother]

Cypriots were never good listeners and also have hot tempers and a love for the dramatic, but one day we will all have to stop be calm and listen to each other then you will see how easily we will agree.

[-mikkie2-]

Bananiot,

I think that is what Papadopoulos wants to do. He wants to modify the RoC without disolving it, so therefore I do not see a contradiction! I have thought about this and this is what I conclude.

He uses legalistic means, but to be frank that is the only weapon we have at our disposal and Papadopoulos is using it to effect. What we need is to nullify Turkey in her attempts to resolve the Cyprus problem ON HER TERMS. That is what we are fighting for. Had we voted yes to the plan everything from then on would be out of our hands.

I do not think for one minute that Papadopoulos is stupid enough to lead us into another misadveture. I trully think that he has the interests of all Cypriots 1st and foremost in his mind. I was very sceptical when he was elected. I thought it was a bad thing for us but in hindsight I think we have done the right thing.

You obviously think that we have gone backwards. I think that is better to take a step back and then make a leap forward. People need to be patient and people need to be rational.

[brother]

hi mikkie,

i think you are wrong, taking steps back is no good for anyone and also makes processes already agreed go back to square one yet taking a leap of faith(do not bring up annan plan) forward would help show the enlightened people you are capable of being.

[-mikkie2-]

Brother,

I don't believe in taking leaps of faith!

I think quite a few people in this forum believe that we have gone backwards. That is a subjective view in my opinion. But if that is the impression people have then all I am saying is perhaps taking a perceived step back and reassessing things, we can then take big steps forward.

As far as dealings with Turkey is concerned, I do not believe in taking leaps of faith, just on the off chance they may be being sincere! History has proved otherwise.

[brother]

STOP LIVING IN THE PAST AND ASSES SITUATIONS WITH CURRENT PERFORMANCE.

We need to develope trust to be able to go forward.

[metecyp]

I think that is what Papadopoulos wants to do. He wants to modify the RoC without disolving it, so therefore I do not see a contradiction! I have thought about this and this is what I conclude.

Can someone explain me what's the difference between "transforming the RoC into a bizonal federation" and "disolving the RoC and creating a new bizonal federation"? At the end we'll have a bizonal bicommunal federation, correct? So why does it matter if we got that federation through dissolving the RoC or transforming it? At the end, the RoC will be gone, won't it?

[brother]

that is true but mant gc do not want to let go of the power they hold with the ROC.