Cyprus-Forum.com

[bg_turk]

where did I say I considered it better? I simply stated what the facts.

Concerning your attempts to demote TCs to a minoirty, you know what my opinoin is: the territorial integrity and sovergnity of the TRNC is inviolabe and within these principles GCs must be welcomed back to the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus and their human rights must be restored unconditionally and immediately.

[faruk]

actıually i made a mistake bg_turk.. Turks were used to count as minority in the past now they are not and also Turks have deputies in the parliament

[bg_turk]

actıually i made a mistake bg_turk.. Turks were used to count as minority in the past now they are not and also Turks have deputies in the parliament

You are right. Turks were counted as an official minority until the 60s with full autonomy in their internal affairs such as education and religion. The communists changed all of that, the last 2 constitutions do not mention a word about a minority.

[faruk]

It is obviously written in the Akritas Plan that the persons who avoided helding a referandum wisely for the constitution were Greek Cypriot Leaders. And it said that in the same plan that if the plecibite was helded then people would approve it as well. And you are still not saying who the people of Cyprus are. And you are saying that they enforce us to approve that constitution( G.B, Greece, Turkiye) and you prefer only Greece to be effective in Cyprus Policy. Her intervention into Cyprus policy is not an enforcement but others are. This is maybe not a dilemma but is exactly a double standart. So I am not playing with words i am telling what your ancerstors said.
“Makarios had proposed 13 points for the change of constitution. Turkey used this excuse to instruct TCs to boycott the government and the parliament, which was part of their partition plan. In fact Turkey had rejected those proposals even before TCs. (as always the decision for TCs come directly from Ankara). While part of the blame is with GCs, you can not deny the TCs part of blame who have also never believed in independence and they were still trying to find excuses to achieve partition as has always been their aim.” In the Akritas Plan it was pre-conceived that the Turks would launch boykotts because those thirteen amendments were undermining and dissolving the constitution also the proposed amendments would have deprived the Turkish Cypriots People of all their basic rights and the safeguards entrenched in the constitution. And Arkbishop Makarios stated in the london times on 9 April 1963 that “ the union of Cyprus with Greece is an aspiration always cherished within the hearts of all Greek Cypriots. It is impossible to put an end to this aspiration by establishing a republic.” So, you think that the Greeks who always believed in independence by uniting the island with another Country.
Oh dear piratis if there is a person who is confused is yourself… in your previous post you blamed Turks to put the Kurds into the minority position and I said that they were not minority then now you are triying tho show them as minority. But I can understand you because you are used to see environment as minorty… You are very amusing.. so is there any official code or something else what shows Kurds as minority who are living in Turkiye. And you are not aware of the incidents which happens in Turkiye as well. Because if you were aware then you would know that the paty which was formed by PKK terrorist organization could not even take the esatisfactory vote rate in order to be in the parliament.
We are still on the same point. The blacks, the Afro-Americans are not minortiy in the United State and Kurds are not is Turkiye as well. Are you minority fetish? And once before your ancestors gave some guarantees even by constitution and then they started to onslaught Turks. So, it proved that two communities can not live together. Turks were in higher positions in the government but they were dismissed and forced to quit their duties by Greek coup. So no thanks, no need to new reliable guarantees.
Yes you are right we are Turkish Cypriots and You are Greek Cypriots and we have our own constitution, the TRNC’s constitution and you have your own constitution,the South Cyprus’ flag. The constitution of RoC was obliterated by Greek coup in 1963 as everybody know. And in that match it was understand that the aspiration of uniting Cyprus with Greece is still being cherished.

[rolo]

What is wrong with the Akritas Plan?............


1) Its is signed by "The Chief" "Akritas"

Who is this Chief?

Under which Good Office does this Chief have the power to evoke such a plan?

2) Who elected this chief on bahalf of all Cypriots?

[Agios Amvrosios]

I still have difficulty recognizing the idea of "political equality" with only one ethnic minority when Cyprus is multicultural . I also found the fact that the constitution was unable to be amended by a straight referendum which did not discriminate against an ethnic majority or bestow undemocratic privileges on one of many ethnic minorities.

This is a problem I also had with the procedure invovled in the Annan Plan. Why were there two separate referenda divided on ethnicicty.-That is simply racists.In order the procedure to be democratic there could only have been a single referendum for all citizens of all ethnic groups?

[Simon]

You Turks (from Turkey and elsewhere) and TCs really do make me laugh. I have never known people who play on words so much, who twist and turn to try to make it look as if they are right, who make up their own definitions for certain words, who call legal things illegal and illegal things legal. You are so slippery and are like snakes. I think I have heard it all on this website now so I do not think I will be replying to another post, because you people are beyond reasoning with.

1) Some people seem to no know what a ethnic minority means.

In fact the Bulgarian constituion does not mention the existance of a minority, so officially we are not a minority either but part of the bulgarian nation.

My god...... You can be a part of an minority and participate in government or do anything else that anybody else can do. It does not make you one inch less in any way as an individual. Indeed, you can be Bulgarian, Cypriot, Greek etc but still be an ethnic minority. I mean, haven't you ever heard of Afro-Americans or British-Indians or indeed Turkish-Cypriots. These are all minorities ethnically, but they are still American, British, Cypriot etc.

When we call TCs a minority, this is not an opinion. It is not even debatable. It is a simple fact. Only a TC could have the balls to try to deny this!

Concerning your attempts to demote TCs to a minoirty,

The last time I checked the official legal stats - The Republic of Cyprus is one nation. TCs make up 18% of the population. So how the hell can GCs demote you to a minority? You are a minority in Cyprus, why is this such a terrible thing to you that you cannot accept. It does not mean GCs are better, or have more rights individually, it just means that GCs are a bigger demographic community and they always have been.

actıually i made a mistake bg_turk.. Turks were used to count as minority in the past now they are not and also Turks have deputies in the parliament

This is laughable. Do you know what minority means?

By the way isn't political equality code for, the US is allowing us to take everything we can.

My one last point is this. Why do you think enosis was such a bad thing. Can someone explain this to me. And I am not talking about the crimes, or anything like that, I'm just talking about the idea alone of enosis. 82% of Cyprus at the time wanted enosis. If you are saying enosis is wrong on this basis, then you are saying that a democratic right for a country to choose its future is wrong also. If the whole of Cyprus would have been given one simple democratic vote on their future, Cyprus today would be a part of Greece in my opinion without any doubt, just like Crete is today. Indeed, on Crete, there was a bigger Turkish minority, but the island is now free, unlike Cyprus. What about the Kurdish situation. They do not get a guaranteed 30, 40 or 50% say in the Turkish executive do they? No, because you would rather suppress them than negotiate with them. That is why they are blowing up Istanbul, because they are too being suppressed. There language isn't even recognised by Turkey is it? And they make up 20% of the population!

Its all crap at the end of the day. You keep rambling your nonsensical rubbish on here, it won't make any difference. I mean, how the hell can common ground ever be found when you won't even accept that you are a minority, one of the most basic facts. Papadopoulos has got it spot on, because he won't be taken for a mug by anybody. He is a strong character who will stand up for GCs all the way, and that it what we need. Like I have said before, I will be happy for a 82/18 split, because I cannot see, especially after being a part of this website, how the two communities can power-share. The ideologies are a million miles apart. And do you want to risk another war, because if things do not move on this year, I fear that is where we are heading.

[rolo]

the thread is

whats wrong with the akritas plan?


Simon then describes what a minority is and that by democratic protocol Cyprus coulld now be living in peace, as a part of Greece.

so is Akritas something to do with overcoming minority objections to Enosis?

[Agios Amvrosios]

The "akritas plan' did not anyway seek to "wipe out' the ethnic minorities as some propagandists allege it sought to implement a more democratic system through a proportionate division of political power. I have to admit that it was probably abit fuzzy legally but it was the only option since the 1960 constitution did not allow for democratic amendments.

The truth is the 1960 constitution should not have been signed no matter what- as a stepping stone or whatever.

So the difference between the Annan Plan and 1960 Agreements is that the Greeks Cypriots should never have signed the 1960 Agreements making huge concessions no matter.


At least we have learned from the 1960 debacle. I aint signing shit!

[rolo]

You Turks (from Turkey and elsewhere) and TCs really do make me laugh. I have never known people who play on words so much, who twist and turn to try to make it look as if they are right, who make up their own definitions for certain words, who call legal things illegal and illegal things legal. You are so slippery and are like snakes

.



Hey Simon, you do a pretty good job of word play yourself, you slippery snake you.