Cyprus-Forum.com

[2fan]

Well said Lala.

[Agios Amvrosios]

There is a problem lately with some forum members failing to stick to the topics and just posting random irrelevant crap.

[2fan]

It would be easy to stick to a topic that made sense. How do you propose to solve the Cyprioy problem by taking out the Greeks and the Turks? Do you not agree that both entities are major players as far as the problem is concerned? Let's stick to realistic solutions.

[cypezokyli]

to be honest i can remember not a single thread that stayed on topic

[Admin]

If you wish to discus the Turkish history please open a thread dedicated to this topic in the "Politics and Elections" section.

The "Cyprus Problem" section is about the Cyprus problem and directly related issues.

[kalamaras74]

Now as you have little love for Turks, it wouldnt matter if 1 or 10 million were slaughtered.

It would matter to me that they were slaughtered, not that they were Turks.

But that is the whole point in you shouting about only the Turkish casualties of this conflict. You wish for us to ignore the Greek Cypriots who have died as a result of of intercommunal violence, the coup, and the invasion. I could just substitute 'Greeks' for 'Turks' in the line above, couldn't I?

I do not agree with your narrative of the Cyprus Conflict. If we are talking about the suffering of Turkish and Greek Cypriots during 1963-64, I prefer the version below as the author is a scholar who is the least biased of anyone.

http://www.cyprus-conflict.net/Patrick-chp%203.htm

[maewing]

Now we're getting somewhere! 2fan, I guess you are really good at this name-calling aren't you? Don't let this upset you--I don't. LALA I would take your indication that I am ignorant and uneducated much better if you did not spell Chinese "Chinease". In any case, I get your point. No one (at least not me accused you of being ignorant and uneducated), I merely asked you to cite sources for your assertions.

Regarding WWI, violent expansion and genocide. Please see:

Not Even My Name : From a Death March in Turkey to a New Home in America, a Young Girl's True Story of Genocide and Survival (Hardcover)

My point once again was that Germany created an opportunity see this in:

The First World War: A Complete History (Martin Gilbert)

Regarding the so called annexing of Cyprus "willingly" (you were forced after losing the war) you may see Gilbert above and read your own reference again: "Ataturk" by Lord Kinross.

Regarding the "caves" comment, at the height of the Greek empire and prior to that, the Egyptian, yes, indeed, were the prehistoric times of Turkey. You can reject Holland's book but it has one all of the coveted prizes for history and is well-regarded.

Regarding the Turkic tribes, I concede your point, if the evidence (as you suggest) is that the placement of the tribes within China was historic--a point which I never raised but only asked if you knew more of it. I WAS WRONG TO SAY THAT IT WAS AGGRESSIVE. However, that fact that they were not Ottoman (that is, part of the empire) remains, which makes the point of them being persecuted by the Chinese--in our discussion--irrelevant. Here we are discussing Ottoman movements in Asia-Minor and the eventual spread to Cyprus.

Furthermore, I am not Chinese but I think what seems to bother a few of you here is that, not knowing my ethnicity you have no one to lash out at.

Let me say that reading Ataturk when I was a youth led me to greatly admire Turkey's valour and Mustafa Kemal in particular and to learn more. Contrary to having ill feelings for Turks, I have quite a positive feeling for them "as people": since they have most often treated me more warmly even than many Greeks with whom I share religion. However, it is extremists and those unwilling to acknowledge checkered elements of their history that is bothersome to me. and that is what led to this discussion--which concerns Turkish and Greek Cypriots and not Turkish or Greek.

Hence, now that we can reach a common ground in utilizing references, and now that each side has expressed their death and damage statistics, perhaps we can return to that discussion again.

Can the Cyprus problem be resolved without Turkey and Greece being involved? That is, what is necessary for GCs and TCs to agree upon and what steps must be taken in order to end the conflict and have a unified Cyprus?

[Lala_Mustafa_Pasha]

Mae, who lost in the Turkish War of Independance?

Yes

Brittish, French, Russians, Greeks, Armenians..............

So obviously, there was not gonna be alot of Turkish love common from those camps USE YOUR BRAIN, were like a thorn in their back-side, we bought the Brittish back to Earth with a BANG.

Remember, at the time Britain was like todays America, what we achieved was an Incredible feat to say the least.

Now, for almost 80 years, as we embarrased them in revenge they attempted to destroy Turkey in every way that they could.

Asala Terrorism, Armenians Lies, Pkk Terrorism, Anti-Turk propoganda, Economically .......................

However, we defeated them all in the War and were not complete idiots, we played them against each other, built bridges closer to America, weathered the storm.

Today Britain is not as powerfull as it once was, also Britain has DITCHED the Old-European mentallity and joined the Anglo-Saxon Alliance , it has decided, if you cant beat em join em hehe, obviously it was just a waste of time, money and resources trying to exterminate Turks so why not instead do the logical, become an ally of such a sturdy, un-rulable people

That is why ONLY and I say ONLY today you have books such as


Death and Exile: The Ethnic Cleansing of Ottoman Muslims
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/087850 ... e&n=283155

Azerbaijan Diary: A Rogue Reporter's Adventures in an Oil-Rich, War-Torn, Post-Soviet Republic

About the Armenian Genocide against Azeri Turks

Mae
Here we are discussing Ottoman movements in Asia-Minor and the eventual spread to Cyprus.

Quit pretending you have any knowledge, your only embarrasing yourself.

You say the word, Ottoman, as if its some Alien seperate people, the only reason you stress on the word Ottoman is that you think its some seperate entity on its own.

1. Ottoman is a Western term, to Turks it is OSMANLI, meaning of the Osmans. Osmanli's was first founded by Orhaz Ghazi and his son Osman hence the name Osmanli.

2 Osmanli's were from the Kayi branch of the Legendary Oguz



They were also directly linked to the prior, Seljuk Empire in the same region.

Mae
Can the Cyprus problem be resolved without Turkey and Greece being involved? That is, what is necessary for GCs and TCs to agree upon and what steps must be taken in order to end the conflict and have a unified Cyprus?

In the real world, this forum means nothing, Greek Cypriot polliticians are ANTI-TURK, Turkish Cypriot polliticians either through incredible genius or stupidity from which they got pure and utter luck have managed to flip the situation into the Greek Cypriot corner putting the pressure on them for the First time.

If you look at it, Turkish polliticians are being far-more reasonable and open to diplomacy than the Greeks are, making them look bad and thus improving our reputation and improving the status of our people.

[malaka]

Unbelievable everyone here seems to know everything about everything no wonder you lot agree to disagree.
How far back do you want to go. What come first the chicken or the egg. Turkey ruled Cyprus then the Brits then Greeks who cares get over it get a life reconcile. MALAKAS ALL OF YOU

[maewing]

Actually, I agree. I was going to respond to LALA but then gave up trying to beat a dead horse. As I said previously, I think we have established that both sides have suffered, the question remains whether it can be resolved without Turkey and Greece involved. Moreover, LALA, if you find this forum pointless as you suggest here:

LALA--"In the real world, this forum means nothing, Greek Cypriot polliticians are ANTI-TURK, Turkish Cypriot polliticians either through incredible genius or stupidity from which they got pure and utter luck have managed to flip the situation into the Greek Cypriot corner putting the pressure on them for the First time"

Why continue contributing? You are obviously looking for some sympathy or something. Whatever it is, it is not addressing the issue.