Cyprus-Forum.com

[Maximus]

its the random crap that appears on my screen.

Come again....

What ever you are smoking I would like to have too. Being in so much denial must be fuckin comforting for your tiny fuckin brain cell.

Do you even know what your point is? because I dont.

Why am I not surprised. Of course you do not understand. Minimum two brain cells required of which you oly have one half of.

You dont have a point, otherwise you would clearly and simply make it.

[Paphitis]

Has there every been any doubt over who would "win"?

In that case, why does the criminal West not advise the Ukraine to surrender so as to save lives and infrastructure?

Hasn’t it become obvious to you that the prolongation of the conflict is seemingly the West’s only objective?

And what do we call this type of behavior?

Schadenfreude!

Can you at least agree to that?

Oh right!

So if China invades Australia, we must surrender to save our lives and infrastructure.

You've lost the plot!

We fight to the last man, and we will leave them no infrastructure at all.

So when Turkey invades Cyprus, Cypriots must surrender to save lives. Just like that. Hand over the country and surrender.

Ukraine will not surrender. Russia has a fight on its hands and Ukraine will fight to defend their country and freedom.

You fight of course but when there's no hope left, you just accept the terms. The Turks after taking 37% threatened us to stop firing at them or they would go ahead and take the whole of Cyprus. Clerides did exactly what they demanded. One year tater they threatened us once again about letting the remaining 60K of TCs (out of 120K) to flee to the North escorted by the UN. Clerides also accepted that.

Point is Ukraine is hopeless. The Russian terms is the absolute minimum they would ever expect. They better accept them the soonest possible or else I am afraid, there won't be any Ukrainians left in Ukraine. I suspect Russia's own mistake of thinking it would ever be possible to control 40 Million hostile Ukrainians after this war is going to be paid by the Ukrainians been ethnically cleansed and replaced by settlers.

You don't deserve a country. You can just accept Turkey's terms and become a Turk yourself. You do not deserve freedom.

Ukraine is a country of 44 million people, and its land size is massive.

There will be Ukrainians left. All 44 million of them. If there are not, then Russia has committed genocide and that leaves the West with no other option but to have a direct conflict with Rissia and a Nuclear War.

Don't kid yourself taht the West can just sit and watch 44 million people being killed. If Russia does anything of that sort then the chances of Nuclear holocaust are very high.

The Ukrainian people will fight and they will fight. The bad thing here for Russia now is that they have entered into a war that will bog them down for many years and they still will not be able to control the country and crush the resitence. Then, the violence will spill into their homeland as well, with IRA style terrorism and sanctions.

[Paphitis]

And another thing:
There's a lot of propaganda going on, and I really expected the CF members to use their own logic to work out some easy stuff.
There have been 3 agreements so far, to cease fire in certain areas creating a safe corridor for civilians escorted by the Red Cross to evacuate some seized cities. All 3 so far failed, and the Western media accused the Russians for not abiding to the cease fire.

Spin up your brains guys. Could it ever be the fault of Russia? Russia WANTS the civilians to get out to minimize human live losses after she unleashes a full scale attack. Ukrainian forces DON'T want the civilians to leave, because knowing Russia's current Kid-glove approach, they need the civilians as a human shield.
So who violated the agreements the Russians or the Ukrainians? Like I said use your brains...

There is no Russian kid glove approach here. Where have you been?

The Russian approach is Grozny/Aleppo. It's war crimes.

[Paphitis]

Putin’s concern is and has always been, SOVIET territory, not other nations in the vicinity who may want to join NATO.

Respect his TURF... that's all he's asking.

Russia has already lost swaths of soviet territory thanks to incompetent Russian clowns from the past like Yeltsin… after an enormous effort Putin has picked up the pieces and wants no more of that, and I understand it.

No one invaded Russia or had any intention of invading Russia.

The West's concerns are Russian invasion. Respect our turf. That's all we are asking.

Those territories were never Russian. Lithuanians, Latvians, Estonians are not Russia and don't want anything to do with Russia.

They hate Russia and embrace the west. Is it that hard to understand why?

[Paphitis]

Ukraine has been invaded by over 100,000 Russian troops. Currently, their major cities are effectively under siege, with a decision clearly having now been taken to flatten them. Much like Grozny and Aleppo. In the fog of war the number of dead is a matter of conjecture. Given the scale of the conflict though it will be quite significant.

I completely agree. Unfortunately Putin is currently ordering full scale attack because his military is getting too slow with this Kid-Glove approach. It's clear the next step will be something like Aleppo, so I only hope the Ukrainians let the civilians get out.

Yet - you talk about "the criminal west" and express contempt at the Ukrainians choosing to fight for their country. You perversely avoid the plain facts and - I find this mental contortion fascinating - act as though absolutely none of this is the fault of Russia at all. In fact, you sympathise with them. Certainly they have your full-blooded support. Plus, on several occasions you've shown a gleeful lust for this to escalate to the use of nuclear weapons.

On multiple forums, over many years, I've never come across somebody with a mind like yours. A rare treasure.

Many of the civilians don't want to get out and choose to stay.

Women and children included. In fact, many of them are armed and fighting for their country. Those who want to leave, like the old, frail and weak can do so if Russia allows them.

[Paphitis]

Putin’s concern is and has always been, SOVIET territory, not other nations in the vicinity who may want to join NATO.

Respect his TURF... that's all he's asking.

It isn't his turf. Anymore than any other sovereign country.

The Soviet Union collapsed in 1989. Countries which had been under the Russian boot for 50 years couldn't wait to joint NATO, in order to ensure they would never find themselves in that position again. Who could blame them? Current events prove what a good idea it was.

This isn't about competing political systems, like the good old days. It's pure and simple 19th century imperialism. "The Great Game" stuff.

The Black sea and ports are as important as Florida’s bay… you don’t violate that and get away with it.

Who violated the Black sea ports?

Ask the Americans…

Florida's a US state. Sevastopol was in Crimea, which once upon a time was part of the country called Ukraine. What's your point?

Ukraine is NOT and never will be a “sovereign country”, I don’t know where you go that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian%E2%80%93Ukrainian_Friendship_Treaty#:~:text=The%20Treaty%20on%20Friendship%2C%20Cooperation,for%20territorial%20integrity%20and%20mutual

"The Treaty on Friendship, Cooperation, and Partnership between Ukraine and the Russian Federation was an agreement between Ukraine and Russia, signed in 1997, which fixed the principle of strategic partnership, the recognition of the inviolability of existing borders, and respect for territorial integrity and mutual commitment not to use its territory to harm the security of each other. The treaty prevents Ukraine and Russia from invading one another's country respectively, and declaring war........................."

From the man who recently brought you (several times actually) "We have no plans to invade Ukraine".

But, I should warn… those of you who want to argue the alleged “sovereignty” of the Ukraine had better start a new thread for it because we're gonna get into the deep shit. Thanks.

I think you will find that those who most want to argue about that are the 40 odd million population of Ukraine. You're welcome.

That's exactly right. 40 million Ukrainians who will fight Russia, even under occupation.

Hence why, these 40 million will defeat Russia.

[Paphitis]

that is no justification to continue fighting, that will waste more billions and shed tons more blood.

No justification for Russia to keep fighting.

For as long as the Russian military remain in Ukraine, the Ukrainian people have all the justification in the world to defend their country

[Paphitis]

As much as I agree that power should have checks and balances,

China's and Russia's human rights records are not impressive and the Ukrainians shouldn't pay the price for you.

The West has proven that too much freedom leads to too many other serious problems such as the abuse to kids, the constant prostitution of women, phenomenal corruption, death and destruction to other nations, etc… the list of sins just goes on and on.

The world needs change desperately. I see nothing but pain and misery all over the West.

Speak for yourself.

there is no pain and misery in the west. we are very happy with things just the way they are and our lives are far more richer and happy then the average in Russia and China.

We are many countries too, and you are too few because no one wants a bar of it.

[Paphitis]

I think you are mistaking things for something else.

Russia and China are corrupt, they have prostitutes and all sorts of other crime.

Russia and China don’t shove depravity down citizen’s throats like in the EU and US.

And neither do they attack their children with gender questioning and similar disgusting abuses.

They are a more God-fearing and family oriented people with a much more balanced approach to life.

The West has gotten too much… we’ve crossed all red lines pretty bad and are in deep shit.

The west does not attack their children. The west simply allows people the freedom to self identify with their own pronouns, whatever they be.

It's about supporting people and their decisions, and ttreating them with respect in a non-discriminatory society.

[Lordo]

Its time to take a step back to see the real events of Ukraine back in 2014.

Ukraine's deadliest day: The battle of Ilovaisk, August 2014

It was the biggest loss of life in Ukraine's war against Russian-backed separatists.

Hundreds of soldiers died as the Ukrainian army and volunteers retreated in a column from the eastern town of Ilovaisk on 29 August 2014.

Ukrainian veterans are adamant the Russian army was there, even though Moscow has always denied claims that regular Russian forces took part in the battle.

President Vladimir Putin has said merely that any Russians involved were volunteers following "a call of the heart".

How the battle was lost
At first it seemed like any other operation against Russian-backed separatists, says Roman Zinenko, 45, a former soldier who served in the Dnipro-1 volunteer police battalion that fought in the battle of Ilovaisk.
The Ukrainian army had surrounded the town and their battalion had been ordered to "wipe out" the Russian-backed force.

But on 24 August, Ukraine's independence day, they began receiving calls from relatives.

Ilovaisk was surrounded, Ukrainian media were reporting.

"We did not feel that, because the [Ukrainian] army held positions around the city," he told the BBC. "On August 24, we even captured the enemy's fortified area."

But the next day, heavy mortar shelling began and the school they were using as a base was raided.
Ukrainian forces had initially surrounded Ilovaisk but then they themselves became trapped
"We realised the enemy had reinforcements," he says.

"At the time we could not imagine the scale of this entrapment. Our troops had surrounded Ilovaisk but all our troops were surrounded by the enemy".

Negotiations were going on and a humanitarian corridor was being prepared for them to leave, they were told, and yet their withdrawal was repeatedly postponed.

How soldiers became trapped in 'bloody corridor'
Then, on the morning of 29 August 2014, came the command to gather and leave Ilovaisk in two columns.

"Nobody knew the routes," said Roman Zinenko.

They began to move, they passed the first ring of encirclement smoothly but within a few kilometres their column came under fire.

"It was just a shooting range and we were the targets," he said.

Roman and his fellow soldiers had set out in a security van because of a lack of equipment. But its wheels and motor were shot up so they switched to a light-armoured vehicle and kept going under constant fire.

Behind them, an infantry fighting vehicle carrying more than 10 soldiers was hit by a shell.

Bodies were thrown everywhere by the force of the blast.

"I can still see it. This body flying high, turning in the air and ending up hanging from a power line."

Total casualties of conflict 2014-19: Some 13,000 dead, including 3,331 civilians, and 30,000 wounded (OHCR 2019)