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[Maximus]

Some thing is clearly wrong and it is a mess.

This will go on for more years unless there is a second referendum to put it to bed.

The only thing wrong here is Parliament. It’s time to let go.

The EU are playing hard ball and they are living this. It’s a real big shame.

The people have had their vote so get on with it.

The eu is not going to cut a deal with Britain that would allow her to have a better deal outside of the eu than in it.

It would be ludicrous for them to do so.

WHat this translates to is that Britain will be much worse off if she leaves than the situation she is in today. Taking in to account that she is already worse off since the first referendum.

[Paphitis]

you are misunderstanding.

The second referendum will be to choose how Britain leaves the eu.

The option to remain will be included in case the people don’t like what the real options of leaving would entail.

And there can be no option about remaining because that will kill the country.

This option is no longer an option Max. Remaining as an option is basically throwing mud and ash into the eyes of millions of people. The democratic process in the UK would be compromised and people might as well not vote again because their vote doesn’t count.

You what?

And a damaging brexit won’t kill the country? A hard brexit won’t kill the country?

Britain is already dying since the outcome first referendum.

No way it won’t damage the country. Not like destroying your very democratic institutions would.

Once you have undermined probably the best democratic institution in the world within the world’s oldest democracy, you are literally stuffed. Voters will remember this for a hundred years. Every election and every referendum will be mocked and the people will turn their back on the political class permanently.

Britain might as well become a dictatorship because its democracy isn’t worth the paper it’s written on.

On the other hand life goes on after Brexit and Britain will not be damaged permanently. We are talking about the UK here not some tin pot. Britain has nothing to worry about and it will trade and conduct business with the EU and it will remain a strong country and stand on its 2 feet. I mean friggin hell, we are talking about Britain. It’s almost a superpower pretty much.

[Paphitis]

Some thing is clearly wrong and it is a mess.

This will go on for more years unless there is a second referendum to put it to bed.

The only thing wrong here is Parliament. It’s time to let go.

The EU are playing hard ball and they are living this. It’s a real big shame.

The people have had their vote so get on with it.

The eu is not going to cut a deal with Britain that would allow her to have a better deal outside of the eu than in it.

It would be ludicrous for them to do so.

WHat this translates to is that Britain will be much worse off if she leaves than the situation she is in today. Taking in to account that she is already worse off since the first referendum.

Jesus Christ!

No Britain will not have the same deal as other EU members. All the laws and restrictions no longer apply.

It will however have Free Trade.

I think even the USA, Canada and Australia have Free Trade with the EU and that is the same Free Trade deals as Cyprus or any other EU country have! Why? Because money talks and the bullshit walks. The EU will want Free Trade with Britain so they can export luxury German Cars to the British Market. If no Free Trade then Britain will just tariff European Goods and Services to protect British Industry and Manufacturing. Europe does not want that.

[Maximus]

I doubt that paphitis.

You have basically painted a picture that Britain will get all the financial benefits that she has within the eu, without any of the associated costs and without any of the legal or political aspects of it.

That is a similar ideologue that the brexiteers were promoting before the referendum. Most of it was false.

3 years later, there is no deal accepted by the two main political parties in the uk. No deal brexit is even being considered as an option because the other deal is not to many people’s liking.

If it was as simple, as easy, as profitable as you are trying to make it out to be it is a wonder that the eu even exists. Every member state might as well leave and set up free trade agreements with every other member state.

[Maximus]

if there is no free trade agreement for German luxury cars, people in the uk will, still buy them but they will get pissed off at their own government now that the costs have gone up.

What is their alternative? Buy a ford or pay up....

Very much like what trump is achieving with these trade wars. He tries to put the price up on one thing, they put the price up on something else. The costs will be passed on to the consumer, and that’s it.

[cyprusgrump]

if there is no free trade agreement for German luxury cars, people in the uk will, still buy them but they will get pissed off at their own government now that the costs have gone up.

What is their alternative? Buy a ford or pay up....

Except that the UK is not obliged to apply tariffs to German cars or anything else post Brexit.

At the end of the day, people buy from people, not countries... As you say, people will still buy German cars and washing machines, French wine and cheese, etc. If the EU chooses to impose barriers to trade it will impact on EU suppliers.

Other countries have access to the EU markets without being bound by EU laws, free movement, etc.

[Maximus]

They do but it is selective.

I am not suggesting the eu is going to impose barriers to external buyers of eu products.

But they can or may impose barriers to external sellers to acquire eu buyers.

The eu market place is more lucrative to someone like Britain sitting on the outside.

What this means is that Britain will pay a premium to access those customers in the eu for her products and services.

We are comparing the British market with the eu market as a whole, excluding Britain. The latter is bigger and more lucrative.

[Maximus]

It’s these costs that might be passed on to the uk buyer by the uk government of imported goods from the eu.

[cyprusgrump]

It’s these costs that might be passed on to the uk buyer by the uk government of imported goods from the eu.

The UK government could impose tariffs on EU goods if the EU chooses to impose tariffs on UK goods... See how it works...?

Who do you think has most to lose in this scenario...?

[Maximus]

It’s these costs that might be passed on to the uk buyer by the uk government of imported goods from the eu.

The UK government could impose tariffs on EU goods if the EU chooses to impose tariffs on UK goods... See how it works...?

Who do you think has most to lose in this scenario...?

The uk....

As I have said the eu market place is bigger and more lucrative to Britain. The European consumer will have 27 other member states that they could acquire products and services from, tariffs free. This is what Britain will be competing against. And what does the uk produce that is better or cheaper than other member states?

Furthermore, the pound has lost value compared to the euro. Which means it will be cheaper for eu buyers to import from Britain and Now, more expensive for British buyers to import from the eu... that does not necessarily mean an increase in demand from eu buyers....just, they are better off.