Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

What’s that propeller driven shit meant to do s. when it gets close to China?

The one in the middle is an Orion.

They are also very up to date with the latest Israeli Gear. They are top shelf. Worth about 50 million each.

In fact, we are not even allowed to sell them and a lot of countries have asked to buy them - including Greece. They can't be sold to Greece na katalaveis.

The far one is what Australia use to operate post WW2 and in the 1950s. It is a Lockheed Neptune. Same manufacturer as the Orion and the P-8A Poseidon in collaboration with Boeing. They are part of our history and heritage.

The Orions are getting pulled apart and will go to Museums and parks for children to play.

The Australian P-8A Poseidons are also top shelf. I saw an American (USN) one when I visited Edinburgh a few weeks ago. Had a look inside of that too. They come every year to exercise with the RAAF.

There is a forum member who was a tech on the Aussie Orions as well. It is a small world.

[Get Real!]

The Orions are getting pulled apart and will go to Museums and parks for children to play.

Oh right... so you're sending a couple of gifts for little chinks to play with!

[Paphitis]

The Orions are getting pulled apart and will go to Museums and parks for children to play.

Oh right... so you're sending a couple of gifts for little chinks to play with!

Yes they are getting gutted and the shells are going into parks around Australia. 3 or 4 are going to Museums, and 1 or 2 will be flying just like the Neptune, at Airshows and stuff like that.

All the electronic gear inside is coming out and will be going back to Israel and the USA. The P-8A Poseidon has better equipment but the gear inside the Orion is not obsolete. it will probably be installed on Israeli platforms.

Israel has more of a use for it than Australia and the USA because all they have to deal with are some Turkish, Syrian, and Iranian peshenvengithes, and their theater is mainly the Mediterranean and Red Sea.

[Paphitis]

Chinaese National Debt to GDP is 49%

Australian National Debt to GDP is 19%

Who owns who DT? I think you will find that Australia has several Trillion invested in China.

Even Boomerang had a factory over there.

Paphitis, I am sorry but this cannot lead to any meaningful discussion.
Forget about the National Debt. That's money owned internally usually to boost growth.

What matters is the external Debt. ALL countries in the world have external debt.Why? Because everyone owes money to other nations.
What matters is not what you owe. Is what other's owe to you minus what you owe to others plus the assets you have abroad minus the assets others have in your country.**
China is a NET investor. Australia is a NET debtor at about the same level as Turkey! Putin is a net investor!

**Now if we sum up values from below we get the following:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... ernal_debt
External Debt:

Australia 1,487,720
China 1,843,500


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Net_inter ... t_position
Net Foreign Investment
Australia: -738,897
China: +1,747,082

**Summing up:
Australia: about -2.2 trillion ---> 160% of your GDP
China: about -96 billion ---> 0.1% of their GDP

BTW, external debt includes personal debt.

Australian society is one of the most affluent and rich on the planet. Hence, Australians are creditworthy.

We therefore have a lot of loans. I for instance Pyro, owe 7 figures. I am higher than the average. I am happy and comfortable with it because I use the money for buying investments - usually land and property. I am also highly liquid too, because I have some money in the bank and I have shares I can sell and have access to instant funds. You would freak out when you see my "debt".

I owe several mortgages right now. I claim all the interest from my tax as well.

The Australian is one of the biggest utilizers of credit. Households in Australia carry debt - such as credit cards and mortgages.

This is an indication of a strong and healthy country. It has nothing to do with the Government.

Australia as a State only has a debt equivalent to about 19% of GDP. This is Government Debt. One of the lowest in the world.

For crying out loud Pyro, Australians carry a lot more debt than the Chinese because they are wealthier and have more assets and income per capita. China has many rich billionaire's but the average Chinese Citizen is only a fraction of the average Australian in terms of wealth.

Yeh I am aware about Household debt being high. Because our private debt is high. But if I go bankrupt, the Government isn't going to bail me out.

As long as we don't do what you do, and have a lot of NPLs all is good. Our NPLs are extremely low.

And the vast majority of these loans are to Australian Banks and Credit Providers. Got nothing to do with China.

The average wage in Australia is 85K today. The minimum wage for a toilet cleaner is like 42K - about 30K Euros. 2,500 Euros per month.

[Pyrpolizer]

Ok Paphitis, feel free to continue talking to yourself comparing your internal Debt with that of China's. I admit I just wasted my time.
For CS go back and read CAREFULLY what DT said to you. He never talked about about your National Debt (internal Debt). He was very specific and talked about your EXTERNAL DEBT. You misunderstood what he said, but he didn't bother to correct you.
And as a result you opened this topic ...
Which like I said is meaningless, so I am out of it.

[Paphitis]

Ok Paphitis, feel free to continue talking to yourself comparing your internal Debt with that of China's. I admit I just wasted my time.
For CS go back and read CAREFULLY what DT said to you. He never talked about about your National Debt (internal Debt). He was very specific and talked about your EXTERNAL DEBT. You misunderstood what he said, but he didn't bother to correct you.
And as a result you opened this topic ...
Which like I said is meaningless, so I am out of it.

First of all you can't compare Australia's Personal Debt to China. Australia is OECD or a developed first rate economy. China is not.

Australia has far higher levels of personal debt than China. Australian families borrow a lot more, and the finance industry is more developed than in China too.

We borrow more to buy homes, cars and of course virtually everyone has a credit card. But having said this as well, debt levels in Australia are also very low because we have a high debt serviceability or a AAA creditworthiness.

We are not talking about personal debt. We are talking about State Debt or National Debt or borrowings from our Government. This is what is important.

Australia's sovereign Debt is only 19% of GDP. China's sovereign debt is 49%

Once again, extenal debt = Government Debt plus Private Sector Debt (corporate and personal). This isn't a metric to compare with China as all OECD countries have high p[personal debt. We all have credit cards and a huge proportion of families have mortgages in order to buy a home. People like me, who have mortgages. This is private debt not government debt.

DT should know the differences as a financial expert. If he doesn't then I am afraid he is pulling our legs or being an idiot.

And also, if you bring that into it, why wouldn't you bring in the Super Funds Australians own but can't access. These are private savings through the Australian Tax System. 4.5 Trillion invested in Australia and the rest of the world. If you think that private debt is important, then so are personal private savings like Super Funds.

[DT.]

Ok Paphitis, feel free to continue talking to yourself comparing your internal Debt with that of China's. I admit I just wasted my time.
For CS go back and read CAREFULLY what DT said to you. He never talked about about your National Debt (internal Debt). He was very specific and talked about your EXTERNAL DEBT. You misunderstood what he said, but he didn't bother to correct you.
And as a result you opened this topic ...
Which like I said is meaningless, so I am out of it.

First of all you can't compare Australia's Personal Debt to China. Australia is OECD or a developed first rate economy. China is not.

Australia has far higher levels of personal debt than China. Australian families borrow a lot more, and the finance industry is more developed than in China too.

We borrow more to buy homes, cars and of course virtually everyone has a credit card. But having said this as well, debt levels in Australia are also very low because we have a high debt serviceability or a AAA creditworthiness.

We are not talking about personal debt. We are talking about State Debt or National Debt or borrowings from our Government. This is what is important.

Australia's sovereign Debt is only 19% of GDP. China's sovereign debt is 49%

Once again, extenal debt = Government Debt plus Private Sector Debt (corporate and personal). This isn't a metric to compare with China as all OECD countries have high p[personal debt. We all have credit cards and a huge proportion of families have mortgages in order to buy a home. People like me, who have mortgages. This is private debt not government debt.

DT should know the differences as a financial expert. If he doesn't then I am afraid he is pulling our legs or being an idiot.

And also, if you bring that into it, why wouldn't you bring in the Super Funds Australians own but can't access. These are private savings through the Australian Tax System. 4.5 Trillion invested in Australia and the rest of the world. If you think that private debt is important, then so are personal private savings like Super Funds.

ffs mate...its a simple google search. Just search for the definition of external debt or foreign debt and quit guessing.

[Paphitis]

Ok Paphitis, feel free to continue talking to yourself comparing your internal Debt with that of China's. I admit I just wasted my time.
For CS go back and read CAREFULLY what DT said to you. He never talked about about your National Debt (internal Debt). He was very specific and talked about your EXTERNAL DEBT. You misunderstood what he said, but he didn't bother to correct you.
And as a result you opened this topic ...
Which like I said is meaningless, so I am out of it.

First of all you can't compare Australia's Personal Debt to China. Australia is OECD or a developed first rate economy. China is not.

Australia has far higher levels of personal debt than China. Australian families borrow a lot more, and the finance industry is more developed than in China too.

We borrow more to buy homes, cars and of course virtually everyone has a credit card. But having said this as well, debt levels in Australia are also very low because we have a high debt serviceability or a AAA creditworthiness.

We are not talking about personal debt. We are talking about State Debt or National Debt or borrowings from our Government. This is what is important.

Australia's sovereign Debt is only 19% of GDP. China's sovereign debt is 49%

Once again, extenal debt = Government Debt plus Private Sector Debt (corporate and personal). This isn't a metric to compare with China as all OECD countries have high p[personal debt. We all have credit cards and a huge proportion of families have mortgages in order to buy a home. People like me, who have mortgages. This is private debt not government debt.

DT should know the differences as a financial expert. If he doesn't then I am afraid he is pulling our legs or being an idiot.

And also, if you bring that into it, why wouldn't you bring in the Super Funds Australians own but can't access. These are private savings through the Australian Tax System. 4.5 Trillion invested in Australia and the rest of the world. If you think that private debt is important, then so are personal private savings like Super Funds.

ffs mate...its a simple google search. Just search for the definition of external debt or foreign debt and quit guessing.

I did look it up from the very beginning and here it is:

External loan (or foreign debt) is the total debt a country owes to foreign creditors, complemented by internal debt owed to domestic lenders. The debtors can be the government, corporations or citizens of that country. The debt includes money owed to private commercial banks, other governments, or international financial institutions such as the International Monetary Fund (IMF) and World Bank.

So in other words, it is debt owed by a country + internal debt owed to domestic lenders. This is exactly what I said earlier.

So all the Mortgages, Business Loans, Credit Cards are included in that Metric.

Furthermore, Australia is OECD. It's pretty pointless comparing an OECD country to a nn OECD country with this metric, because all OECD countries have more domestic debt.

What is a lot more important is the debt owed by our Government - otherwise known as Sovereign Debt.

Australian Sovereign Debt to GDP is only 19% - very low.
Chinese Sovereign Debt to GDP is 49% - still very low but not as low as Australia.

[Get Real!]

ffs mate...its a simple google search. Just search for the definition of external debt or foreign debt and quit guessing.

Correct me if I’m wrong monsieur but… the only difference I can think of is that foreign debt will fluctuate with currency fluctuations.

Not that it’s insignificant... but is there any other important difference?

[DT.]

ffs mate...its a simple google search. Just search for the definition of external debt or foreign debt and quit guessing.

Correct me if I’m wrong monsieur but… the only difference I can think of is that foreign debt will fluctuate with currency fluctuations.

Not that it’s insignificant... but is there any other important difference?

For starters, debt owed to foreign govt's and or foreign institutions is money flowing out of the country as opposed to money owed to domestic lenders which gets recycled into the economy.