I am sure you all know what happened at Grans Montana and how the negotiations ended in July 2017.
Soon after, our sorry President Mr Anastasiades sent an official letter to the UN secretary General,as well as to the permanent members of the UN security council and foreign governments saying he is ready to continue the negotiations based on the Guterres framework.
http://cyprus-mail.com/2017/09/08/anast ... -guterres/
So what was that Guterres framework?
Here it is. It was dated 30 June 2017.
https://cyprus-mail.com/2017/07/05/deta ... y-general/
After a whole 9 month pregnancy period the other sorry leader Mr Akinci finally delivered a statement saying he accepts the Guterres framework and he furthermore wants to turn it into a strategic agreement!
https://cyprus-mail.com/2018/04/30/akin ... framework/
Anastasiades then remembered that the 30th June document was rejected by both sides and presumably Guterres reverted with a new document on 4th of July which the Turkish side also rejected and abandoned the negotiations.
Here's Anastasiades reply to Akinci
https://www.pio.gov.cy/en/press-release ... =1548#flat
Akinci then accused Anastasiades of pulling out documents out of his fantasy. In short that Guterres did not issue any framework at the 4th July 2017.
Akinci says 4th July document doesn't exist:
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/greek-c ... k-/1134700
The truth is there is nowhere any such official 4th of July Guterres framework. I searched the whole internet and the only thing I found is this from facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/Gibrahayer/pos ... 51883391:0
Question is:
a) when you have a sorry President who cannot even write a proper letter to the UN specifying the date of the document he referred to, and b)a sorry TC leader who is constantly pulled by the nose from Ankara who needed 9 months to order him to accept the original Guterres framework , because it was damn good for them, and it was a mistake to turn it down on the first place
Do you really expect to ever get a solution from those Dotards?
And if you ever get one, are you sure they won't forget to include the most important details that will mark your future.
Oi mana mou, oi- f*ck them all.
The Guterres framework and our sorry Leaders
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• Page 1 of 1
The Guterres framework and our sorry Leaders
by Pyrpolizer » Thu May 31, 2018 4:11 pm
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Pyrpolizer - Leading Contributor
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Re: The Guterres framework and our sorry Leaders
by repulsewarrior » Thu May 31, 2018 9:14 pm
...on the 30 June Eide presents a written "statement", which were his notes on what Guterres said.
...on 4 July, a revised "statement" was presented; which was not agreed upon.
...while Mr Akinci may have made his offer, it was by twitter?
...Mr. Anastasiades' reply suggests something more (or different) was agreed to, given that a second ''statement'' was awaited and read.
Clarity is needed.
...you may have read this thread,
cyprus46251.html#p868577
...there are very subtle indications of the bigger conflict Akinci has with Turkey; that decisive moments will come soon.
As politicians go, i have more confidence in Anastasiades, than any other potential leader in Cyprus. No sellout, he stands for the Republic of Cyprus, not "Greeks''. He gave everything to the "Turks" that they asked for at Crans Montana, no blame, no restitution, a BBF, and a map which changes very little, but the so called negotiations ''failed'', his "fault", standing alone as the President of Cyprus defending the one thing he would not give away, Sovereignty.
...beyond the Guterres framework, if it is agreed, Mr. Akinci may make clearer his intentions (talk about guts) by standing for a photograph with Mr. Anastasiades shaking hands with the Flag of Cyprus behind them. Would Mr. Anastasiades refuse? Can Erdogan stop them? It will be the "Greeks" and "Turks" who will refute its significance with their outrage, exposing themselves in this unity as the same and no different as adversaries to a Cypriot identity.
It is up to Akinci, is he Cypriot, or not? What is his Legacy as a builder, an architect, a leader, and as a man? He must have the courage to actually stand up and represent the electorate that voted for him. In simple terms if he seeks for his "community'' recognition as a Constituency, the "new" Cyprus that is put to him is not the way, it does not matter which ''statement'', June or July. He must demonstrate that he recognises, that his ideal is possible as Cypriots through constitutional reform; as Cypriots, not as "Turks", and that which is not "Turkish". In short, he can demand that the Communal Chamber is opened, (or perhaps Mr. Anastasiades should offer to do this first, another "dinner" could iron that out), that there are Greek Cypriot representatives there waiting for them (this time) in their seats. He can represent his support for what undeniably exists as a starting point, a Cypriot People. He can prepare his Constituency for the next elections in Cyprus' Legislature (in three years) with Candidates and Platforms that make a better Cyprus, for Cyprus, with this intention returning to the seats that remain empty, there. New thinking is needed indeed; new perspectives too. "Being" Cypriot is not insignificant.
...the Problem, is an International issue, and on many levels. Many would like it to be diminished to a problem among a population of Cypriots as though in any outcome Cyprus will continue to exist as a place to live. But Cyprus is not just an island, it is a People who take very seriously their responsibilities as a member of a wider Family of Man. Cyprus divided, invites Turkey's division. While "Turkishness" is as a result very present in Cyprus, after decades, it has failed. Cypriots in the occupied territories (and in Cyprus itself) continue to vote for a Leadership that is for Cypriots, a unity based on Universal Principals, as Individuals and a State, as opposed to the candidates who do(did) not recognise "Cypriotness", if you will. I would say without a doubt that what happens in Cyprus will have a big affect/effect on Turkish politics. A solution will provide in Turkey, Hope to its Turks, or its "Turks". It will have the same affect/effect throughout the region, as a template, in resolving the conflicts with this same Problem.
...on 4 July, a revised "statement" was presented; which was not agreed upon.
...while Mr Akinci may have made his offer, it was by twitter?
...Mr. Anastasiades' reply suggests something more (or different) was agreed to, given that a second ''statement'' was awaited and read.
Clarity is needed.
...you may have read this thread,
cyprus46251.html#p868577
...there are very subtle indications of the bigger conflict Akinci has with Turkey; that decisive moments will come soon.
As politicians go, i have more confidence in Anastasiades, than any other potential leader in Cyprus. No sellout, he stands for the Republic of Cyprus, not "Greeks''. He gave everything to the "Turks" that they asked for at Crans Montana, no blame, no restitution, a BBF, and a map which changes very little, but the so called negotiations ''failed'', his "fault", standing alone as the President of Cyprus defending the one thing he would not give away, Sovereignty.
...beyond the Guterres framework, if it is agreed, Mr. Akinci may make clearer his intentions (talk about guts) by standing for a photograph with Mr. Anastasiades shaking hands with the Flag of Cyprus behind them. Would Mr. Anastasiades refuse? Can Erdogan stop them? It will be the "Greeks" and "Turks" who will refute its significance with their outrage, exposing themselves in this unity as the same and no different as adversaries to a Cypriot identity.
It is up to Akinci, is he Cypriot, or not? What is his Legacy as a builder, an architect, a leader, and as a man? He must have the courage to actually stand up and represent the electorate that voted for him. In simple terms if he seeks for his "community'' recognition as a Constituency, the "new" Cyprus that is put to him is not the way, it does not matter which ''statement'', June or July. He must demonstrate that he recognises, that his ideal is possible as Cypriots through constitutional reform; as Cypriots, not as "Turks", and that which is not "Turkish". In short, he can demand that the Communal Chamber is opened, (or perhaps Mr. Anastasiades should offer to do this first, another "dinner" could iron that out), that there are Greek Cypriot representatives there waiting for them (this time) in their seats. He can represent his support for what undeniably exists as a starting point, a Cypriot People. He can prepare his Constituency for the next elections in Cyprus' Legislature (in three years) with Candidates and Platforms that make a better Cyprus, for Cyprus, with this intention returning to the seats that remain empty, there. New thinking is needed indeed; new perspectives too. "Being" Cypriot is not insignificant.
...the Problem, is an International issue, and on many levels. Many would like it to be diminished to a problem among a population of Cypriots as though in any outcome Cyprus will continue to exist as a place to live. But Cyprus is not just an island, it is a People who take very seriously their responsibilities as a member of a wider Family of Man. Cyprus divided, invites Turkey's division. While "Turkishness" is as a result very present in Cyprus, after decades, it has failed. Cypriots in the occupied territories (and in Cyprus itself) continue to vote for a Leadership that is for Cypriots, a unity based on Universal Principals, as Individuals and a State, as opposed to the candidates who do(did) not recognise "Cypriotness", if you will. I would say without a doubt that what happens in Cyprus will have a big affect/effect on Turkish politics. A solution will provide in Turkey, Hope to its Turks, or its "Turks". It will have the same affect/effect throughout the region, as a template, in resolving the conflicts with this same Problem.
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repulsewarrior - Leading Contributor
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Re: The Guterres framework and our sorry Leaders
by repulsewarrior » Sat Nov 13, 2021 2:00 am
An update on Crans Montana
https://www.ekathimerini.com/news/11716 ... rus-talks/
...could it be that the President did not wreck the conference, just as he said?
https://www.ekathimerini.com/news/11716 ... rus-talks/
...could it be that the President did not wreck the conference, just as he said?
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repulsewarrior - Leading Contributor
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Re: The Guterres framework and our sorry Leaders
by repulsewarrior » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:07 pm
https://politis.com.cy/politis-news/to- ... 5616498269
...about the dinner; more about exactly what was said.
If they were "nearly there" at Crans Montana, it is a credit to Anastasiades; and it was in writing.
...what is also clear is that Turkey was not so forthcoming, refusing to do the same.
...about the dinner; more about exactly what was said.
If they were "nearly there" at Crans Montana, it is a credit to Anastasiades; and it was in writing.
...what is also clear is that Turkey was not so forthcoming, refusing to do the same.
-
repulsewarrior - Leading Contributor
- Posts: 14287
- Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 2:13 am
- Location: homeless in Canada
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