Cyprus-Forum.com

[Kikapu]

Who would in their right mind vote for Trump again unless they hate the US constitution and love fascism instead, just as Trump does.

Reading all the posts responding to the above question, I did not hear anyone stating that they love and support the US constitution, because if they had, there's no way anyone could vote or support Trump again as he has constantly violated the US constitution which he swore to protect during his inauguration. Therefore, when the Trump supporters who wave the American flag to demonstrate their patriotism, it is nothing more that pure bullshit. By definition, they are in fact anti-America and what the constitution stands for. When Trump violates the freedom of the press, violates freedom of peaceful assembly with violence, separations of State and Church with his photo op, then he can only be viewed as a fascist, which some of his generals have openly spoken against him. There's yet hope for America once Trump is gone!

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I love and support the US Constitution. In my opinion, it's the best constitution in the world.

I also support Trump however, i am not a US Citizen. So that's matter of for the American people who also support the US Constitution.

You are creating a massive straw man. But that seems to be the tactic of the anti Trump forces, much like it was for the remainers during the long 4 years of BREXIT hell and which was so well described in LR's post above.

Trump has done none of that. The demonstrations were violent from the very beginning. people in the US have the right to demonstrate all they like, but assaulting police, throwing rocks at them, and burning cars and shops is illegal. There is no provision in the US Constitution to allow any of that.

So yes, the police have every right to arrest any protester who breaks the law.

No, no creation of a straw man, just Trump, who may well be a straw-man without a brain!

So you do not have a problem with peaceful demonstrators protected under the constitution being tear gassed, beaten by police batons as they are pushed back, journalist assaulted, other crowd disbursement weapons used to clear Lafayette Park on orders from Trump so that he can walk and make his photo op with a bible in his hand at the church. Really?

Does that then not qualify you as being a "fair weather" US constitution supporter?

[erolz66]

I have said over and over and over I do not know if lockdown measure will turn out to be net negative or neg positive in the long run and nor do I think anyone else can know this with certainty yet.

Isn't it bizarre then that every post and every link you post here supports your (obvious) view that Lockdown is appropriate...

Your frequent negative posts about Sweden being just one example...

Have you realised that you have fucked-up bigly and are attempting to row back from your original position...?

It is not rocket science and no conspiracy theories are needed. Occam's razor applies. They have overwhelmingly been reactions to the constant flood of pro active posts from those claiming that they know lock down was a bad response.

Still a useful to you diversion and distraction from the question / point I raised about how I can repeatedly and explicitly say X and yet still be accused of presenting a view of Y. Something is going on with that and it is not something you want to or can afford to consider imo. Hence the above nonsense and speculation. I do not need to row back anything. What I said and when I said it, unlike your 'interpretation' is a simple matter of fact and record.

[cyprusgrump]

What I said and when I said it, unlike your 'interpretation' is a simple matter of fact and record.

It is....

And you are going to be proved wrong big time... Like Bordo....

...and CoCo - are we mid-month yet....?

[Londonrake]

I have said over and over and over I do not know if lockdown measure will turn out to be net negative or neg positive in the long run and nor do I think anyone else can know this with certainty yet.

Isn't it bizarre then that every post and every link you post here supports your (obvious) view that Lockdown is appropriate...

Your frequent negative posts about Sweden being just one example...

Have you realised that you have fucked-up bigly and are attempting to row back from your original position...?

You obviously still don’t understand. Erolz Doesn’t really have any “positions”. He simply enjoys arguing (with anybody, about anything, endlessly) but it has to be on the understanding that he’s never doing it from a substantial standpoint and as such can’t be expected to be called to account on any issue. His principal concern (aka how he get’s off) is to point out how others are wrong. It goes without saying that everyone, apart from Erolz, (who never commits to anything that could be considered a solid viewpoint) is of course always going to be wrong. Putting it more succinctly - it’s a waste of time.

[Paphitis]

Who would in their right mind vote for Trump again unless they hate the US constitution and love fascism instead, just as Trump does.

Reading all the posts responding to the above question, I did not hear anyone stating that they love and support the US constitution, because if they had, there's no way anyone could vote or support Trump again as he has constantly violated the US constitution which he swore to protect during his inauguration. Therefore, when the Trump supporters who wave the American flag to demonstrate their patriotism, it is nothing more that pure bullshit. By definition, they are in fact anti-America and what the constitution stands for. When Trump violates the freedom of the press, violates freedom of peaceful assembly with violence, separations of State and Church with his photo op, then he can only be viewed as a fascist, which some of his generals have openly spoken against him. There's yet hope for America once Trump is gone!

Screen shot 2020-06-14 at 10.35.35.png

I love and support the US Constitution. In my opinion, it's the best constitution in the world.

I also support Trump however, i am not a US Citizen. So that's matter of for the American people who also support the US Constitution.

You are creating a massive straw man. But that seems to be the tactic of the anti Trump forces, much like it was for the remainers during the long 4 years of BREXIT hell and which was so well described in LR's post above.

Trump has done none of that. The demonstrations were violent from the very beginning. people in the US have the right to demonstrate all they like, but assaulting police, throwing rocks at them, and burning cars and shops is illegal. There is no provision in the US Constitution to allow any of that.

So yes, the police have every right to arrest any protester who breaks the law.

No, no creation of a straw man, just Trump, who may well be a straw-man without a brain!

So you do not have a problem with peaceful demonstrators protected under the constitution being tear gassed, beaten by police batons as they are pushed back, journalist assaulted, other crowd disbursement weapons used to clear Lafayette Park on orders from Trump so that he can walk and make his photo op with a bible in his hand at the church. Really?

Does that then not qualify you as being a "fair weather" US constitution supporter?

No I don't have any problem with peaceful protesters.

these are not peaceful protesters. they have looted, destroyed shop fronts, assaulted police, burned cars and destroyed private property.

Yes I don't have a problem with tear gassing, batons, or trouble makers being arrested. The police are doing what they are paid to do - protect the safety of the public, protect the peace, and protect private property.

The protesters are even defacing statues and historical monuments.

[erolz66]

I have said over and over and over I do not know if lockdown measure will turn out to be net negative or neg positive in the long run and nor do I think anyone else can know this with certainty yet.

Isn't it bizarre then that every post and every link you post here supports your (obvious) view that Lockdown is appropriate...

Your frequent negative posts about Sweden being just one example...

Have you realised that you have fucked-up bigly and are attempting to row back from your original position...?

You obviously still don’t understand. Erolz Doesn’t really have any “positions”. He simply enjoys arguing (with anybody, about anything, endlessly) but it has to be on the understanding that he’s never doing it from a substantial standpoint and as such can’t be expected to be called to account on any issue. His principal concern (aka how he get’s off) is to point out how others are wrong. It goes without saying that everyone, apart from Erolz, (who never commits to anything that could be considered a solid viewpoint) is of course always going to be wrong. Putting it more succinctly - it’s a waste of time.

I stated what my clear positions were. The scale of this event , as shown by simplest unarguable numbers. Correlation between early action , with or without lock down and better outcomes. I also stated , once again, my position on lock downs which is I , you or anyone else, can not yet know with certainty if they will prove to be net positive or negative or neutral in a given position. All very simple and clear.

I have positions, I state them clearly and directly and you systematically mis state them back to me whilst pretty much ignoring the points I raise and resort to ad hominem attacks more often than not.

I am happy to be called to account on what I have said. I just get frustrated constantly being called to account for things I have NOT said, or things I have not done or not done to any where near the same degree as the accuser. It is not rocket science.

[erolz66]

No I don't have any problem with peaceful protesters.

For that statement to have any meaning it has to go hand in hand with an ability to determine who and what are peaceful protesters. The example of those at Lafayette square when Trump went for his campaigning photo op, shows that you lack such an ability and thus your claims of having no problem with peaceful protesters is worth exactly nothing.

[erolz66]

And you are going to be proved wrong big time... Like Bordo....

About what ? About things I have never said or claimed that you simply say I have anyway ?

In any case this obsession with having to believe you are right about everything is your disease. Some of us have much higher levels of immunity to this illness

[Paphitis]

No I don't have any problem with peaceful protesters.

For that statement to have any meaning it has to go hand in hand with an ability to determine who and what are peaceful protesters. The example of those at Lafayette square when Trump went for his campaigning photo op, shows that you lack such an ability and thus your claims of having no problem with peaceful protesters is worth exactly nothing.

Peaceful protesters mean just that. people marching, with their banners and posters, in the streets, and not harming the public, police, or destroying private property.

[erolz66]

No I don't have any problem with peaceful protesters.

For that statement to have any meaning it has to go hand in hand with an ability to determine who and what are peaceful protesters. The example of those at Lafayette square when Trump went for his campaigning photo op, shows that you lack such an ability and thus your claims of having no problem with peaceful protesters is worth exactly nothing.

Peaceful protesters mean just that. people marching, with their banners and posters, in the streets, and not harming the public, police, or destroying private property.

Which is what and all the protesters at Lafayette square were doing when police , nat guard and USSS (or just SS as Trump referred to them) used force including tear gas to disperse them before curfew had come in to effect so Trump could walk to his photo op.

You just ignore this reality because you like Trump more than the Constitution is the only logical conclusion to be drawn imo.