Cyprus-Forum.com

[Piratis]

No, that is how you choose to see us. We are not your enemies. At best your neighbours. With more love, trust and respect, your friends

what kind of friend violates your basic human rights and does not allow you to return to your own home? I am all for love, trust and friendship.
I want you to have the 100% of what every EU citizen has as long as you allow us the same as well.
Why don't you agree that all violations against every Cypriot should end immediately?

Of course there is a third way. If you were my enemy I would seek to disable or destroy you. That is not my intention. It is to find way to share our common homeland of Cyprus. Your ‘black and white’ approach is unrealistic and extreme. There are many other ways, as the many posts (from many quarters) on this forum testify.

Not only you seek to destroy us, you are already occupying part of our country, you have performed ethnic cleansing over 1/3rd of Cyprus and not only you do not regret for this actions you insist on keep doing them as we speak.

No they are here by right. Treaty of Gurantee. Even the Greek Supreme Court upheld that!

The Security Council,



Having considered the report of the Secretary-General, at its 1779th meeting, about the recent developments in Cyprus,



Having heard the statement of the President of the Republic of Cyprus and the statements of the representatives of Cyprus, Turkey, Greece and other Member States,



Having considered at its present meeting further developments in the island,

Deeply deploring the outbreak of violence and the continuing bloodshed,



Gravely concerned about the situation which has led to a serious threat to international peace and security, and which has created a most explosive situation in the whole Eastern Mediterranean area,



Equally concerned about the necessity to restore the constitutional structure of the Republic of Cyprus, established and guaranteed by international agreements,



Recalling its resolution 186 (1964) of 4 March 1964 and its subsequent resolutions on this matter,



Conscious of its primary responsibility for the maintenance of international peace and security in accordance with Article 24 of the Charter of the United Nations,



1. Calls upon all States to respect the sovereignty, independence and territorial integrity of Cyprus.



2. Calls upon all parties to the present fighting as a first step to cease all firing and requests all States to exercise the utmost restraint and to refrain from any action which might further aggravate the situation;



3. Demands an immediate end to foreign military intervention in the Republic of Cyprus that is in contravention of the provisions of paragraph 1 above;


4. Requests the withdrawal without delay from the Republic of Cyprus of foreign military personnel present otherwise than under the authority of international agreements, including those whose withdrawal was requested by the President of the Republic of Cyprus, Archbishop Makarios, in his letter of 2 July 1974;



5. Calls upon Greece, Turkey and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to enter into negotiations without delay for the restoration of peace in the area and constitutional government of Cyprus and to keep the Secretary-General informed;



6. Calls upon all parties to co-operate fully with the United Nations Peace-keeping Force in Cyprus to enable it to carry out its mandate;



7. Decides to keep the situation under constant review and asks the Secretary-General to report as appropriate with a view to adopting further measures in order to ensure that peaceful conditions are restored as soon as possible.

No, and neither is it for Greek Cypriots. Yet they have and (through the inhumane embargoes) continue to violate our rights. Even now, your people refused to name Turkish as an official language in the “RoC” for the EU (against 1960 Constitution), it refuses to provide the provision of Turkish in its sole school in Limassol where Turkish Cypriots remain, Greek Cypriots like you and your official education system continues to preach hatred against Turks.

I asked you if you agreed for legality to return and for the human rights of everybody to be respected you rejected it, didn't you? When you are illegally occupying our country and you reject return to legality why do you expect from us to treat you in a friendly way?

No. The embargoes started in 1955 and were increased by March 1964 to affect all aspects of life. You would do well to check the UN archives and many other sources that testify to the inhumane hardships Turkish Cypriots endured way before 1974. Your selective version of history kids no one informed…and many more people are finding about just how Greek Cypriots have & continue to treat Turkish Cypriots. And of course, for the last 31 years, the world has a pretty good understanding of the Greek Cypriot trauma (they were just misinformed about the whole picture)

You are the one who insists on selective history. I never claimed that GCs are the virgin maries that now require to be rewarded on the expense of the human rights of Turkish Cypriots. You did that.
You only remember what suits you. Personally I am more than willing to take the whole history of Cyprus were the two communities coexisted since 1571 and leave nothing out.
However you insist on a selective part of history of 10-20 years forgetting everything that happened before and after that, or even the events within those 10-20 years that do not suit you. You are the one who has a selective version of history and not me.

Life and times. The Ottoman empire was neither the first nor the last empire. It was certainly one of the most tolerant (as empires go that is) – as I wrote to you in an earlier posting, Greek Cypriots were liberated by the Ottomans from their slave-like existence under their Catholic Venetian masters, so they could practice their faith freely (with a tax – but everyone had that) and own/administer their lands/business. I don’t expected gratitude, but this perpetual misrepresentation of history…

Oh is it so? So if it was OK for us to live under the Ottomans for 300 years, why it was not OK for you to live as part of Greece since this was also the democratic demand of the great majority of the population?

Your racism knows no bounds. I take it you live somewhere in the EU? If so, you should be aware that we do not tolerate such incitement to racial hatred. Your labeling of all people of ethnic Turkish/Turkish Cypriot origin is at best distasteful and totally unacceptable. Please alter your language or else I will be forced to make a formal complaint.

Your racist actions of ethnic cleansing and human rights violations and your support for this actions have no bounds. I simply stated a fact. The ancestors of everybody have been barbarians at some point. However most people became civilized at some point. Unfortunately you insist on the barbarian tradition of stealing what others created, ethnic cleansing, human rights violations etc. Instead of blaming me, correct yourself from your racism and reform yourselves and your "motherland".
Don't you think is time for you to accept universal values such as democracy and human rights?

I do believe in human rights and democracy. But my view of those terms are different to yours. As I said it an earlier post, one man’s terrorist is another’s freedom fighter.

Today there are no terrorists and freedom fighters. Today there are people that you deny their human rights as well as an illegal occupation of Cyprus. Instead of creating your own versions of human rights, which is basically "human rights is only for Turks", why don't you accept the rulings of the European Court of Human Rights that demand from Turkey to return the land to our refugees? Why don't you accept democracy and human rights for all Cypriots without racist discriminations?

I say again, you are in no position to judge the exact number of Turkish Cypriots living in North Cyprus. There will be a census in early 2006 and we will know then.

If you count the illegal settlers then you can come up with any number you want. Turkey brought those settlers intentionally in order to change the demographics in Cyprus. This is why those settlers are illegal and not Cyprus citizens.

Also, I do not care who comes to North Cyprus and settles there, respects the laws and enhances the well-being of its people. All are welcome - as I believe they are in South? A lot of Russians, EU citizens, etc have located there. We are not demanding they leave. That really isn’t how the Global Village/open societies work. It would be an abhorrent suggestion in UK – some would say racist – to suggest all immigrants returned to their homeland. I don’t know where in the world you are based Piratis, but I’d say you are out of touch with modern world societies.

The EU citizens, Russians etc that live in Cyprus are here as foreign citizens. They were not given the Cyprus citizenship and they do not vote. They also came here in a legal way.
The settlers on the other hand have voted in the recent referendum in the occupied areas and came here illegally in huge numbers in order to change the demographics of Cyprus. There presence here not only it is illegal but it is against the Geneva Convention.

Prove it! My understanding is that we have 36% of title deeds. Since neither of us probably can, we need to agree to disagree.

Here is a post by Kifeas on this: http://www.cyprus-forum.com/post-66043. ... land#66043

If you want to insist on the ridiculous argument that TCs have been the great landlords of Cyprus owning twice as much as their population percentage you can continue to do so. One more ridiculous claim from you will not make a difference. We are used to them.

[Piratis]

Piratis, you should have visited last year's Turks exhibition at the Royal Academy of Arts (the staff said it was their busiest in years) when it showed the immense wealth and cultural contributions of this race. It showed up the bigotry that exists around Turks. At its height, it far exceeded anything medieval Europe had to offer.

Well, medieval Europe and even Byzantium were crap compared to ancient Greece. When religious fundamentalism begins, progress ends. Thats why they called them the "dark ages".

And I again ask you to refrain from calling all Turks "barbarians". It is offensive and unnecessary.

We all have barbarian ancestors at some point. For me barbarians are the ones who in the 21st century they can not understand the concepts of democracy, human rights and international law, and they think they can continue to just go in a grab what others created because this used to be the norm before.
I can forgive the ones who were acting in barbarian ways 1000 or 500 years ago. We all have some barbarian acts in our histories. What I can not forgive is when some people insist on these barbarian acts today in the 21st century.

[Main_Source]

Zam, I see ATCA bullsh!t did not waste anytime after New Years Day to update their propaganda efforts.

No they are here by right. Treaty of Gurantee. Even the Greek Supreme Court upheld that!

If you bothered to read the Treaty of Gurantee, you would see that Turkey had no right to permanently occupy any part of the island or take out an act of ethnic cleansing. Infact, the treaty of guarantee states that neither Greek or Turkish military could step foot on Cyprus untill 30 years after the gurantee was signed. The Treat of Guarantee has been totally violated by Turkey.

No, and neither is it for Greek Cypriots. Yet they have and (through the inhumane embargoes) continue to violate our rights. Even now, your people refused to name Turkish as an official language in the “RoC” for the EU (against 1960 Constitution), it refuses to provide the provision of Turkish in its sole school in Limassol where Turkish Cypriots remain, Greek Cypriots like you and your official education system continues to preach hatred against Turks.

You make no sense...are you sayin the Turkish school does not teach in Turkish? lol

I’m not saying Turkish Cypriots have got it bang on. But at least Talat & co are trying

By holding Greek Cypriots to ransome? Or by slating Papadapolous in the press at every chance and then wondering why they havent met?

Life and times. The Ottoman empire was neither the first nor the last empire. It was certainly one of the most tolerant (as empires go that is) – as I wrote to you in an earlier posting, Greek Cypriots were liberated by the Ottomans from their slave-like existence under their Catholic Venetian masters, so they could practice their faith freely (with a tax – but everyone had that) and own/administer their lands/business. I don’t expected gratitude, but this perpetual misrepresentation of history…

For 300 years you stole our children and made them whores or soldiers who would come back and kill us, you taxed us to poverty and you did not hesitate to massacre thousands of us on certain occasions...and after THAT...you still do not admit to any wrong doing! You wondeer why Greek Cypriots hold any kind of resentment against Turks!!!! lol...at least White people have condone what their ancestors did to Black slaves...but with Turks its just bigotry.

No. The embargoes started in 1955 and were increased by March 1964 to affect all aspects of life. You would do well to check the UN archives and many other sources that testify to the inhumane hardships Turkish Cypriots endured way before 1974. Your selective version of history kids no one informed…and many more people are finding about just how Greek Cypriots have & continue to treat Turkish Cypriots. And of course, for the last 31 years, the world has a pretty good understanding of the Greek Cypriot trauma (they were just misinformed about the whole picture

Could you be a bit more elaborate with the term 'embargo' then, so i know your not just picking random words fromt he sky. How was their a Turkish Cypriot embrago way back in the 1950's? You DO KNOW that in 1955, there was still British colonial rule on the island?

I do believe in human rights and democracy. But my view of those terms are different to yours. As I said it an earlier post, one man’s terrorist is another’s freedom fighter.

It seems that your view on a lot of things is totally different from the rest of the world, not just Greek Cypriots.

[zan]

HISTORY OF CHIOS MASSACRE
One of history's most tragic and comprehensive acts of genocide takes place on the island of Chios in 1821. The Greek Rebellion begins in 1821. During the Massacres, around 30,000 islanders are hanged, butchered, starved or tortured to death. Untold thousands more are raped, deported and enslaved. The Greek word katastrofi – also meaning 'destruction' and 'ruin' – is usually used to describe these events. The island itself is devastated and the few survivors disperse throughout Europe in what is now known as the Chios Diaspora.

The insurrection that led to Greek Rebellion was mounting throughout what was soon to become the new state of Greece. But the relatively large and fabulously prosperous island of Chios, lying just off the Turkish coast, was a prize the Ottomans could under no circumstances afford to lose. Chios and its Greek population was arguably the richest shipping and trading centre in the eastern Mediterranean. For 2000 years its merchants and ship-owners had dominated trade and diplomacy throughout the Black Sea, the Aegean and the Mediterranean. Wisely, the Ottomans had allowed Chios unique and almost complete control over its own affairs. Chian trade and the curious fact that the immensely valuable 'mastic' plant was harvested only in Chios, were of great value to the Sultan. The cosmopolitan Chians were also in any case very prominent in Constantinople.

A museum in SPETSE island bears the name of Lady Bouboulina, who was one of the leading persons in the Greek Rebellion. The museum has distributed a booklet telling how Greeks massacred 30,000 Turks in Tripoli on 11th September 1821. In the globalizing world, It should be the duty of Human Rights defenders to put that massacre of 30,000 innocent Turks onto agenda.
On the 11th September 1821 Tripoli, which is the capital of Peloponnese and thus the headquarters of the Turkish pasha ruling the area, fell to the surrounding Greek forces. The fall of the city was followed by a massacre that went on for three days and nights. Thirty thousand dead filled streets and lanes, and the blood flowed in rivers.


You’re right. And they tried to do it again in the 21st century until Turkey stepped in and stopped them. Give us back the land you stole from the TCs in cyprus by intimidation and stop your bleeting and propaganda.

[Main_Source]

lol...and the Turkish Cypriot forces like the TMT, who MURDERED prominent Turkish Cypriot's that opposed their ideology of segregation, was not intimidating.

Lets face it, most Turkish Cypriots fell for the Turkish propaganda of segregation and left at their own choice...but you cannot admit to it so you use terms like

Give us back the land you stole from the TCs in cyprus by intimidation

.

[bg_turk]

Greece gave to us democracy, and has contributed to a huge degree in philosophy, science and the arts. Greece had founded some of the greatest cities in the area.

Most of the biggest cities in Turkey were created by Greeks (Constantinople, Smirny, Trapezounta etc). Most of what Turks have now was stolen from Greeks.

Serdika, Philipopolis, Mesambria, etc. were stolen by the Bulgarians too.

Greeks after their liberation from the Ottomans naturally took back part of what has always belonged to them. Soon you will tell us that liberating Athens was part of the Greek expansionism

Expansionism is when a country enlarges its territories at the expense of its neighbours. In view of this it remains an undeniable fact that Greece is the only Balkan country that has continously expanded at the expense of its neighbouring countries. Of course you choose to call it liberation because it gave the right to your greek kin to steal the fertile lands of Aegean Macedonia and Thrace from their turkish and slavic owners.

Expansionism my friend is when you steal what does not belong to you. This is what Turks do. Not when you liberate what was originally yours and was taken from you by force.

Aegean Macedonia was taken from slavs by foce, Western Thrace was taken from turks by force. Greeks are cunning like fox and even when they steal something they make it seem like you are liberating it, while arrogantly accusing others of stealing.

[Piratis]

Of course you choose to call it liberation because it gave the right to your greek kin to steal the fertile lands of Aegean Macedonia and Thrace from their turkish and slavic owners.

Man, even the names of those places are Greek. They have been Greek since the time neither Slavs or Turks existed. When you invade and occupy what others created you should know that at some point you might loose it back to their original owners.

Turkey as well as other countries in the region currently occupy lands and cities that were originally founded by Greeks. Do you deny to Greeks to have their own country when most of Turkey is land stolen from Greeks?

[bg_turk]

The land was not greek, it was inhabiited by makedons, whose greek origins are still disputable. Makedons chose to give it the name Macedonia. Then slavs and turks settled there as well and established their own villages, or created new neighbourhoods of some of the towns that greeks have first settled into and given the names to.

The greek state had no historical or ethnic rights to lay claims on that land, since even if we assume that greece is a successor state of the byzantine empire, Macedonia, apart from a few brief periods never belonged to Byzantium during the medieval ages, it was part of the Serbian and Bulgarian kingdoms.

[Main_Source]

lol...your telling me a name like Phillipopolis has nothing to do with Greek culture. BG Turk, obviously the history you have been taught is as selective as Pick and Mix down Woolworths.

You are really back at your desperete best again here arent you.

[Viewpoint]

MS did you take classes in being rude and sarcastic or is it a natural trait, well done you are very good at it