Cyprus-Forum.com

[Tim Drayton]

No .... it is you that misses the point. You made a totally unsubstantiated claim ......... so I put it to the test .........

I could easily produce a list of articles whose titles all suggest that the EU will survive and prosper should I so wish. I am not going to do so, because, as I am trying to demonstrate (e.g. with my 'proof' that Google is run by aliens), it is a futile exercise that actually proves nothing.

[Robin Hood]

No .... it is you that misses the point. You made a totally unsubstantiated claim ......... so I put it to the test .........

I could easily produce a list of articles whose titles all suggest that the EU will survive and prosper should I so wish. I am not going to do so, because, as I am trying to demonstrate (e.g. with my 'proof' that Google is run by aliens), it is a futile exercise that actually proves nothing.

Selective with your 'quotes' as usual ..... you just don't understand anything do you? What you actually said referring to your link was:

No, I didn't read it. You don't understand anything, do you? That was not the point. The point of the exercise was to show that I could easily find an article with a headline purporting to show that the EU will survive and prosper. If need, be I could find another ten or even one hundred.

I put it to a very simple empirical test , the result proved you were talking a load of rubbish. You failed miserably! Grow up.

[Robin Hood]

There we have it. Look! The title of an article on the internet proves my point:

Google is run by Aliens
https://applejuicematt.wordpress.com/20 ... by-aliens/

Proof positive beyond doubt.

PS - For those incapable of noticing, irony is involved in this post.

How childish.

What it does prove however, is the simple fact that if you type rubbish into Google you will get rubbish out!

[Robin Hood]

Still waiting for the links to these survey you quoted!

Paul already gave them, I think you will find.

So he is your 'reliable' source? That explains a lot!

[Tim Drayton]

There we have it. Look! The title of an article on the internet proves my point:

Google is run by Aliens
https://applejuicematt.wordpress.com/20 ... by-aliens/

Proof positive beyond doubt.

PS - For those incapable of noticing, irony is involved in this post.

How childish.

What it does prove however, is the simple fact that if you type rubbish into Google you will get rubbish out!

Exactly! You have finally got my point. I am glad we agree on something at last.

Of course the same argument (if you type rubbish into Google you will get rubbish out) applies to a claim such as:

"Just a few of the 461,000 articles available that do NOT think the EU is as strong as you suggest your many ‘surveys’ have suggested. Surveys which you have not yet provided links to? I won’t post all of them but even you should manage to get the gist ........."

[Tim Drayton]

Incidentally, yet another man of straw fallacy warning. What I claimed was that "surveys have shown increased support for the EU elsewhere in Europe following the UK referendum," not that surveys have shown that the EU is strong (implied in "Just a few of the 461,000 articles available that do NOT think the EU is as strong as you suggest your many ‘surveys’ have suggested"). I said that recent surveys have shown that:

there is increased support for the EU elsewhere in Europe

and NOT

the EU is strong.

For one thing, a survey can only gauge public opinion, such as sentiment towards the EU; a survey cannot by its nature determine whether a body is weak or strong. You need a different tool for that.

That was either another example of a straw man, or simply shows poor reading skills in English. If so, that's pretty rich for somebody who has criticised foreigners in the UK for their poor English, and is especially rich coming from somebody who has lived here for years and doesn't speak a word of Greek. Outright hypocrisy I would call it.

[Tim Drayton]

Sorry, I see I slipped up above. I was supposed to be proving from the internet that Microsoft, and not Google, is run by aliens. Just to correct that error, I have found the following quote:

"OMG! microsoft is run by aliens!"
http://www.eeggs.com/items/47814.html

So, that 'proves' it because it is written on the Internet.

[Tim Drayton]

[

I apologise if you did not know what MSM refers to, I thought it was commonly known as being ..... Main Stream Media. The handful of news outlets run by huge corporations that have a monopoly of TV, Newspaper and popular news stories, that is widely available without having to go look for it.

They are often fed the by Reuters or Associated Press and a few other news agencies, who collect from 'sources' around the world and the MSM then runs with the story with there angle added. If that is the only source you use to collect information on anything ..... from Syria to Gaza ....... from Finance to Politics ..... you will only ever read one side of the story. If the MSM prints a load of rubbish, which the independents show to be so a few days later, the Media never apologies for their errors or reprints the article with corrections, but to the mindless hoards that use that as there single source .... it is set in stone for ever. Anything that then gives an alternative and detailed story that refutes the original MSM version gets shouted down ........... as you often do!

You should also look at independent news outlets that are run as non-profit organisations and are not part of the MSM. Often run as one-man-bands and are used to carry the same news story. These are very frequently well know journalists who do not/will not fall into line and follow the MSM's editorial guide lines as their detailed stories often clash with their editorial policies. The articles provide many links to there sources from Govt. papers to UN Reports.


Post Brexit I think you will find, or though incorrect in terminology, refers to after the vote for a Brexit. As I pointed out and you have repeated, there is no 'Post-Brexit' yet, it's all speculation ..... so everything else you have said above is just that, speculation because it can only be your opinion. Just your views as to what YOU think ..... and I note you don't link to any credible source either. If you do not look at other sources for information and make your own assessment of the credibility of an argument and the degree of probability of it being 'true' .........you will never know the full story.

Thanks for the above explanation. I just have my doubts as to whether you really understand it. If you did, you would surely realise that the right-wing media in the UK and especially the right-wing tabloids have for the past three decades been running a campaign using cherry-picked news stories that are slanted and taken out of context to vilify the EU (to quote your words "you will only ever read one side of the story"). That is why the minds of the masses in the UK have been poisoned against the EU. It was this branch of the MSM, as you call it, that has engineered the rise of the far-right UKIP and brought the far right to such a state ascendancy that thugs are now murdering people in the street because they are heard speaking a foreign language. All par for the course for a rag like the Mail, which supported the fascist Nazis in Germany in the 1930's. Do you never stop to ask what the real agenda behind this is; what interests of which interest groups it is all serving? It is a sad fact that Rupert Murdoch, who is not even a British citizen and does not live in Britian, has through his position of control of what you call the MSM in the UK, been able to call the result of every poll in the country since the 1980's, including the EU referendum. This makes my blood boil. If you really believe that you have written above, it should make yours boil, too. Have you never stopped to ponder as to the real motive why a man who doesn't live in the country and is not a citizen wants the country to leave the bloc? Has it not occured to that the reason you keep coming up with quotes from such vile examples of the right wing-gutter press as the Daily Mail and the Daily Express (such as the gem about a so-called post-Brexit boom when Britian has not left the EU!) in your endeavour to cherry pick europhobic news items and post them here is that those two newspapers, prime examples of what you call the MSM, are at the forefront of a campaign to vilify the EU through distorted reporting - and how distorted can you get as using the term 'post-Brexit' to describe a situation in which the UK is still in the union. In my eyes, anybody who constantly uses quotes from the Mail and Express to support their views forfeits the moral authority to use the term 'MSM'.

[Tim Drayton]

Still waiting for the links to these survey you quoted!

Paul already gave them, I think you will find.

So he is your 'reliable' source? That explains a lot!

Another inanely stupid comment. If Paul quoted the source, he is the messenger and not the message. Are you saying that a source becomes more or less reliable depending on who quotes it?

[Tim Drayton]

Anyway, here are a couple of sources that back the claim I made, actually something that received wide media coverage a few weeks ago:

Support for the EU surged in Nordic countries, as the impact of Brexit begins to set in. In Denmark, the percentage of people backing EU membership jumped from 59.8% before Brexit to 69% after the referendum, according to a Voxmeter poll by Ritzau. Support for a Brexit-style referendum among Danes dropped from 40.7% to 32%.
There was a similar trend in Finland (link in Finnish), where 69% said they were not interested in a referendum on EU membership following Brexit. If a referendum did go ahead, 68% said they would vote to stay. In a separate poll conducted by a different organization, only 56% wanted to stay in March.

http://qz.com/723813/after-brexit-peopl ... -european/

The latest survey of European attitudes from YouGov shows a significant uptick in support for staying in the EU, compared to just a few weeks ago.
Germany — Stay 54% / Leave 29% (May 24th) >> Stay 61% / Leave 24% (July 27th)
France — Stay 42% / Leave 31% (May 24th) >> Stay 47% / Leave 32% (July 27th)
Denmark — Stay 54% / Leave 29% (May 24th) >> Stay 55% / Leave 35% (July 27th)
Sweden — Stay 45% / Leave 38% (May 24th) >> Stay 54% / Leave 31% (July 27th)
Finland — Stay 45% / Leave 30% (May 24th) >> Stay 50% / Leave 30% (July 27th)

https://politicalscrapbook.net/2016/08/ ... -not-less/

In future, pay attention there at the back and stop daydreaming, because I won't repeat things for your benefit again, do you hear?