Cyprus-Forum.com

[GreekIslandGirl]

Leaving aside the issue that the comment about moving Israel to the USA was clearly tongue in cheek ...

I disagree it was tongue in cheek other than perhaps it hid some deeper anti-Semitic sentiments.

Perhaps she thought she would get away with the comment if she made it seem *outrageous* and so can be taken as 'tongue in cheek'. But, she is /was a politician and there's no tongue in cheek about threats of ethnic cleansing!

It was an anti-Zionist, not an anti-Semitic comment.

Oh, so you're saying she wanted to reassign the country called Israel to somewhere in the USA but leave the Israeli people behind ?

[Tim Drayton]

Leaving aside the issue that the comment about moving Israel to the USA was clearly tongue in cheek ...

I disagree it was tongue in cheek other than perhaps it hid some deeper anti-Semitic sentiments.

Perhaps she thought she would get away with the comment if she made it seem *outrageous* and so can be taken as 'tongue in cheek'. But, she is /was a politician and there's no tongue in cheek about threats of ethnic cleansing!

It was an anti-Zionist, not an anti-Semitic comment.

Oh, so you're saying she wanted to reassign the country called Israel to somewhere in the USA but leave the Israeli people behind ?

I have already addressed that point. Although it is hardly a matter that is in my power, any of the Israeli people (25% of whom are not Jewish anyway) who wish to do so should in my opinion have the option of remaining in Palestine as equal citizens.

[Tim Drayton]

... however, the illegal settlements in the West Bank should stop as well as the siege against Gaza.

Pie in the sky! That just shows that you don't have a clue what Zionism is about and how it works. Get your new Saudi buddies to explain it to you.

[Tim Drayton]

Well then, Falun Gong may deserve their own artificial creation within China. Practitioners of Falun Gong are persecuted.

Thank you. My point exactly. It is ludicrous to suggest that every persecuted group in the world should get its own state, on land that has been ethnically cleansed for the purpose.

[Robin Hood]

Paphitis:

And then they attacked Israel in 1967 and got done over like a roast dinner. They thought they were about to deal Israel a decisive blow, but it was not the case.

Rubbish! Try to get the facts right before making wild and totally inaccurate statements. Israel attacked Egypt read the following historical facts by those involved:

Quote:

Did the Egyptians actually start the 1967 war, as Israel originally claimed?

“The former Commander of the Air Force, General Ezer Weitzman, regarded as a hawk, stated that there was ‘no threat of destruction’ but that the attack on Egypt, Jordan and Syria was nevertheless justified so that Israel could ‘exist according the scale, spirit, and quality she now embodies.’...Menahem Begin had the following remarks to make: ‘In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian Army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.’“ Noam Chomsky, “The Fateful Triangle.”

Was the 1967 war defenisve? — continued

“I do not think Nasser wanted war. The two divisions he sent to The Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it.” Yitzhak Rabin, Israel’s Chief of Staff in 1967, in Le Monde, 2/28/68

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/history/origin.html#1967

[supporttheunderdog]

I am saying uncuddly Ken was completely incorrect from any historical perspective.
Hitler was promoting antisemitic views by the mid 1920's. They were set out in "Mine Kampf" written I think in 1923. He was probably well on the way to insanity by then.

The agreement to send Jews to Palestine was a political expedient of the 1930's designed to get the Jews out of Germany, leaving their property behind and to get sales of German goods in the face of developing Jewish boycott, which was in response to increasing anti-semitism a s a oart of government policy. It was not because Hitler wanted a Jewish state. He did not. Bearing in mind Hitler's anti semtic views were already well formed, just not carried to the logical conclusion of his sick philosophy, It therefore cannot represent an early political view before Hitler went mad.

Whether Ken's views are antisemtic or not, or that he was supporting Hitler, or otherwise justify any suspension, is a separate issue. It was however politically inept to suggest Hitler was a zionist.

[Tim Drayton]

Why, my dear chap? Let us take the example of Balfour, a member of the British ruling class at a time when the latter was by and large riddled with anti-Semitism. Balfour was the architect of the 1905 Aliens Act, a piece of legislation whose main aim was to bar entry to the UK of Jews who were fleeing for their lives from pogroms in Eastern Europe, so he could hardly be portrayed as a champion of the interests of Jews undergoing persecution. Yet, in 1917 he was the author of a declaration in support of Zionism. Why? In my view, because in those days in which anti-Semitism was seen to be fairly normal and there was perceived to be a Jewish problem in Europe, it seemed like a good solution for Europe to get rid of the Jews in its midst by packing them off to some obscure, far away place called Palestine. In other words, anti-Semitism quite probably informed Balfour's support of Zionism. In the same way, I find it totally plausible that a racist and anti-Semite like Hitler would at some time have supported Zionism as a means for ridding Austria of its Jews. What is the big issue. For years and years the Zionist lobby has been branding as anti-Semitic anybody who opens their mouths and criticises the expansive killing machine known as Israel. Now it seems that if a known opponent of the racist ideology known as Zionism utters a sentence containing the word Hitler, they will be branded anti-Semitic by the same lobby. What nonsense!

[Tim Drayton]

I don’t think this thread will get anywhere until certain people understand what Zionism is, and how it differs from Judaism, and that, therefore, criticism of one is not criticism of the other.

Not all Jews support Zionism. The following shows Jewish people on a pro-Palestine rally in London:



https://www.vice.com/print/kleinfeld-is ... n-2014-138

[Robin Hood]

This is what stared the German reprisals against the Jews The full story is even more interesting and once again driven by Zionists NOT Jews.

Benjamin Freedman was a Zionist/Jew and in a high position in US government circles. He deserted the Zionist movement after WWII but had a lot of background information. If you are interested in the facts rather than convenient propaganda read the transcript of his speech in full. Including the Q&A session.

Benjamin H. Freedman, Germany and the Jews: The Role of the Jews in WWI and WWII

(Introductory Note -- Benjamin H. Freedman was one of the most intriguing and amazing individuals of the 20th century.
Mr. Freedman, born in 1890, was a successful Jewish businessman of New York City who was at one time the principal owner of the Woodbury Soap Company. He broke with organized Jewry after the Judeo-Communist victory of 1945, and spent the remainder of his life and the great preponderance of his considerable fortune, at least 2.5 million dollars, exposing the Jewish tyranny which has enveloped the United States.)

Speech by Benjamin H. Freedman, given at the Willard Hotel in Washington, D. C. in 1961.

Quote:

Now Germany -- not a shot had been fired on the German soil. Not an enemy soldier had crossed the border into Germany. And yet, here was Germany offering England peace terms. They offered England a negotiated peace on what the lawyers call a status quo ante basis. That means: "Let's call the war off, and let everything be as it was before the war started." Well, England, in the summer of 1916 was considering that. Seriously! They had no choice. It was either accepting this negotiated peace that Germany was magnanimously offering them, or going on with the war and being totally defeated.

While that was going on, the Zionists in Germany, who represented the Zionists from Eastern Europe, went to the British War Cabinet and --( I am going to be brief because this is a long story, but I have all the documents to prove any statement that I make if anyone here is curious, or doesn't believe what I'm saying is at all possible) -- the Zionists in London went to the British war cabinet and they said: "Look here. You can yet win this war. You don't have to give up. You don't have to accept the negotiated peace offered to you now by Germany. You can win this war if the United States will come in as your ally."

The United States was not in the war at that time. We were fresh; we were young; we were rich; we were powerful. They [Zionists] told England: "We will guarantee to bring the United States into the war as your ally, to fight with you on your side, if you will promise us Palestine after you win the war."

Now, that is where all the trouble started. The United States went in the war. The United States crushed Germany. We went in there, and it's history. You know what happened. Now, when the war was ended, and the Germans went to Paris, to the Paris Peace Conference in 1919, there were 117 Jews there, as a delegation representing the Jews, headed by Bernard Baruch. I was there: I ought to know. Now what happened? The Jews at that peace conference, when they were cutting up Germany and parceling out Europe to all these nations that claimed a right to a certain part of European territory, the Jews said, "How about Palestine for us?" And they produced, for the first time to the knowledge of the Germans, this Balfour Declaration. So the Germans, for the first time realized, "Oh, that was the game! That's why the United States came into the war." And the Germans for the first time realized that they were defeated, they suffered this terrific reparation that was slapped onto them, because the Zionists wanted Palestine and they were determined to get it at any cost.

http://mailstar.net/freedman.html

Up to this point Jews virtually ran Germany and held many government and civil service appointments. Then eventually the Germans retaliated and fired them from their jobs and they started plotting THEIR revenge.

The Jewish Declaration Of War On Germany - The Economic Boycott of 1933

The war by the international Jewish leadership on Germany not only sparked definite reprisals by the German government but also set the stage for a little-known economic and political alliance between the Hitler government and the leaders of the Zionist movement who hoped that the tension between the Germans and the Jews would lead to massive emigration to Palestine. In short, the result was a tactical alliance between the Nazis and the founders of the modern-day state of Israel - a fact that many today would prefer be forgotten.

http://rense.com/general84/declare.htm

This is when you stared to see the Jewish businesses with Juden and the Star of David, scrawled on shop windows. The Germans started to blockade their businesses as the Jews had done to theirs, their motive being; why should they keep Jewish businesses going when the Jews had bought the country to its knees with their world wide boycott of German goods?

The rest is documented history .............. and the Zionists have not changed one little bit ..... in fact they are worse people now than they have ever been.

[Tim Drayton]

"Up to this point Jews virtually ran Germany and held many government and civil service appointments."

What? Give me a break! This was the anti-Semitic Nazi propaganda line.