Cyprus-Forum.com

[fideld]

Nations are not created.
But most important I do not think that you can ask me or all the grek cypriots that cried for the win of Greece foot ball team, and Pagdatis, holding a Greek flag, to change. We are not players to move to another team, we cannot be bought. That is why most of us Greek voted no, as we are not willing to forget our origin. Always there are exceptions. The rule in Cyprus is that we are and want to remain Greek. The RoC has nothing to do with being Greeks or not. The RoC consists of Greeks (majority) and Turks (minority).

[cypezokyli]

i was also happy that greece won the european championship.
but you see the greeks carry no other flag other than their own when their nationaly team plays...unlike us
i am not trying to denny the links we have with greece, or the ones the tc have with turkey.
all i am saying to will help if we would help us move in the future if we were less stuck on symbols.
so we voted NO bc we are greeks?!!
yet another one who has found the reason of the NO. we should start collecting all those people who know THE reason gc voted NO, and see with how many we will come up with.

and nations and nationalism are no more than 200 years old, with exception perhaps the english and the french.

[Simon]

but you see the greeks carry no other flag other than their own when their nationaly team plays...unlike us

What a stupid thing to say. Greeks from Greece do not carry the Cypriot flag because they are not from Cyprus. We carry both because we are Greek and Cypriot (i.e. we originate from Greece, and are from Cyprus). This is very simple.


In my opinion, Greece and Cyprus are no different. We are Greeks in Cyprus and they are Greeks from Greece. If I had my way, the first flag would be the Greek one, because we are all Greek. The Cypriot flag should be secondary, especially when such a notion of just 'Cypriot' doesn't even seem to exist. By the way, it is not symbols we are stuck on, but our identity and no matter how much people like you try, you cannot change our fondness of our identity.

[cypezokyli]

first stupid now idiot....whats wrong today?
"originate" . which means what ?
we also originate from the monkeys, should we carry a monkey flag as well
so the french speaking blegians should curry two flags, and the swiss the same, and the americans as well, not to mention the austrians.
future simona, future. we move forward not backwards.

the greek flag is just a symbol less than two hundred years old (ours is over 40 btw). it represents christianity (the main reason of the loss of the ancient greek spirit) and a specific revolution.
i dont see the association with our identity.
we learned to accept that flag, and the same way we will learn to accept the cypriot one.
.........
put the greek flag over the cypriot one, and you will guarantee that you will always keep watching those flags on pendadaktylos mountain. how many times do i have to explain it to you that the greek flag is just a symbol. and a symbol that doesnot help us to convince anyone.

[Cov]

See now this is something i just never understand.

Now simon don't get all defensive,as this is not just about your view.I see this kind of attitude from lots of different nationalities hear in England.

People are born in a country but CONSTANTLY go on about a different "Homeland" just because there father/mother/grandparents/distant ancestors came from there.Sometimes its just because they have a religion that stems from a particular country,and so they feel that this is there "true" home.......even though they have never set foot there.

Why cant people just accept where they are from???Simon if you was born in Greece then your attitude should be correct.If,on the other hand ,you was born in Cyprus then surely it should be your first priority.

Take my position.I am English.I don't care if your white ,black,yellow or green with pink spots.I don't care if your Greek,Turkish,Muslim,catholic or what ever.If your born in England YOUR English.Of course you can honour your past traditions/culture etc......but first off your English.Its your country and you make it what it is.

Now that being said.If you then want to move abroad to better your life for what ever reason,fine.As long as you embrace the country you go to and abide by that lands rules.For example i wish to move to Cyprus .I love its culture,people and life stile.When i get there i will place my children into local schooling as i wish to integrate as much as possible with the local community.I will endeavour to contribute to my adoptive country as much as possible.This will (for all intent and purpose) then be my country.

Cyprus IS a country in its own right.A language doesn't make a country

[Piratis]

I will have to agree with cypezokyli on this.

We are Greek Cypriots but we are not citizens of Greece.

We are citizens of Cyprus and the flag of RoC is our flag.

[Simon]

Well, we are never going to agree on this because our views are just too different. Firstly, your analogies are once again pathetic. Are we called monkey-cypriots? Are americans called british-americans, are the belgians called french-belgian. NO!!

The difference is, we are GREEK-Cypriots. We recognise our Greekness. So therefore the Greek flag is how we express our Greek identity in my view and not anything else.

Cov and Piratis, the only thing I can say to you is, just over 30 years ago, Cyprus wanted to become a part of Greece. In a poll, 96.5% of people in Cyprus wanted it, so therefore, believing in democracy like I do, I think it should have been granted, and I still believe that the 'Cypriot' people today should choose. Cyprus is different from what you were saying Cov, because Cyprus desparately wanted to join Greece, and were never given the chance. Cyprus was no different to Creta, the only difference was they won, and we didn't. But that does not mean I'm not going to fight for a democratic right to choose in the future.

I do not see Cyprus as a separate country. I mean, Greece already has a joint defence doctrine with Cyprus, saying an attack on Cyprus will be treated as an attack on Greece itself. What two other so called 'separate' countries do you know that has such agreements. I am not saying we should give up the Cypriot flag, but with the situation as it is at the moment, and listening to people like Zan, Lala etc, how can you even say that such a thing as 'cypriot' even exists. I think it is a loose term that only some GCs and very few TCs are holding onto. The Cypriot flag however should remain because it represents the island, but it should be similar to a situation in Scotland for example. They keep their Scottish flag, but it seems that the British one comes first. But this is going back to the enosis argument, so lets not go there.......

Lets just say we disagree and that is it.

[cypezokyli]

Firstly, your analogies are once again pathetic.

what??!!

my analogies are always the extention to yours
i just extent them a bit, using exactly the same arguments ! and then you dont like them. perhaps i am trying to tell you sth about those arguments you are using

Are americans called british-americans, are the belgians called french-belgian. NO!!

it takes a while.
its one of those things that people learn in schools

just over 30 years ago, Cyprus wanted to become a part of Greece.

i take it you meant just over 50 years ago...
or you calendar shows 1986. that would explain a lot actually. even though those arguments actually seized after 1974...
what year do you have down there ?

I do not see Cyprus as a separate country

we should tell to our fellow europeans to forget about the 25th country. in reality there are just 24.

Greece already has a joint defence doctrine with Cyprus

if i am not mistaken,it was the greek defence minister who questioned if that docrtine can be realistically applied. do we still do those military exercises together? i thought nikiforos is on a pension.

What two other so called 'separate' countries do you know that has such agreements

how was that insignificant organization called...??
was it NATO?

I am not saying we should give up the Cypriot flag, but with the situation as it is at the moment, and listening to people like Zan, Lala etc, how can you even say that such a thing as 'cypriot' even exists.

how about listening to you ?

The Cypriot flag however should remain because it represents the island,

not just the island. the Republic of Cyprus. for way over 40 years now!!

but it should be similar to a situation in Scotland for example. They keep their Scottish flag, but it seems that the British one comes first. But this is going back to the enosis argument, so lets not go there.......

true.
the less you mention enosis, the better.

[Simon]

I might just stop replying to your posts soon because your arguments are not worth a response most of the time.

my analogies are always the extention to yours
i just extent them a bit, using exactly the same arguments ! and then you dont like them. perhaps i am trying to tell you sth about those arguments you are using

This is all crap. Your analogies are completely different to mine. Again, another illusion.

it takes a while.
its one of those things that people learn in schools

LOL, how long is a while. LOL. We have seen ourselves as Greek ever since the concept was invented. So how much longer do you think it will take?

i take it you meant just over 50 years ago...
or you calendar shows 1986. that would explain a lot actually. even though those arguments actually seized after 1974...
what year do you have down there ?

WHAT??? Do you think Greek-Cypriots stopped wanting enosis in the 50s?? I think you are highly mistaken there. Cyprus and Makarios still wanted enosis in the 70s, he was just trying to play the political game and failed. Indeed, I still speak to a lot of GCs who would want it now, if they were given a choice.

we should tell to our fellow europeans to forget about the 25th country. in reality there are just 24.

I know that we are a separate country, but I am saying that in my OWN view, I do not see the Greeks from Greece and the Greeks from Cyprus as separate. We are the same. Nothing would make me happier than telling the EU the above.

if i am not mistaken,it was the greek defence minister who questioned if that docrtine can be realistically applied. do we still do those military exercises together? i thought nikiforos is on a pension.

Legally, Greece is obliged to protect Cyprus from future attacks and it will.

how was that insignificant organization called...??
was it NATO?

What, NATO actually uses that wording. 'It shall be seen as an attack on [country's name] itself.' I don't think so. This emphasises a closeness.

how about listening to you ?

Yes you can if you like. It does not exist. TCs don't even want to live with GCs, if the TCs on here are anything to go by. So I'm not going to be like you and beg them, trying to make them believe in this 'Cypriot' thing. They are not buying it, and neither am I.

not just the island. the Republic of Cyprus. for way over 40 years now!!

What, the same Republic that isn't even united.

true.
the less you mention enosis, the better.

For you maybe, but do you think that will stop me?

[Strahd]

Do you people have any idea how many Cypruses Greece has? Let us begin

Kerkyra(Corfu)
Occuppied by the Venezians the Turks the English and then finally joined Greece on 1864
Crete
Occuppied by Ottomans then declared a separate country and joined Greece on 1900
Rhodes(together with the rest of the Dodecanese)
Occuppied by the Italians then given to the Germans and joined Greece on 1947!

to name only a few

Why Cypriots should be different than Cretans, Rhodians or Kerkyraious they are all greeks, they speak the same language, the share the same history and 2000 years culture, all feel and are greeks because their mother and father was greek? Is it because there is a minority of muslims on the island that defines a Cypriot nation?

This is how the modern Country of Greece was formed... Cyprus was just a case were the Greeks lost and is not because the Greeks do not like the Cypriots it is because it was not allowed by the powers of the time...