Cyprus-Forum.com

[Robin Hood]

Paphitis:

Oh and money can't be free. I don't believe so anyway. Money will always have a cost to it. How else will the Bank pay for the wages and electricity bill and other overhead

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The creation of money is free, as it is simply a number in a computer. It is created on demand so therefore the creator has no liability to repay it to anyone. Boils down to zero cost to the creator but do they make money out of it? Not directly, they have to charge interest or transaction charges to pay for the wages and other overheads.

If money is free, then you need to tax depositors. That would include pensioners and the most vulnerable. Don't see that working.

Absolutely, but it is coming anyway .......... Note the advent of the newest bank scam ...... NEGATIVE INTEREST! They will now charge you for putting your money into their bank. i.e. they will charge you for lending them your money!!!! That will apply to pensioners or any individual or business. Add to that the enthusiasm by the banks are showing for a cashless society (Only electronic transactions .... no cash at all) and you will have only two options; a) pay the banks to look after your money ........ or b) spend it. So you will not have the option to withdraw it and hide it under the bed .......... as there will not be any paper currency! Nowhere to hide?

[Paphitis]

Oh and money can't be free. I don't believe so anyway. Money will always have a cost to it. How else will the Bank pay for the wages and electricity bill and other overhead

.

The creation of money is free, as it is simply a number in a computer. It is created on demand so therefore the creator has no liability to repay it to anyone. Boils down to zero cost to the creator but do they make money out of it? Not directly, they have to charge interest or transaction charges to pay for the wages and other overheads.

First of all, I don't believe our banks are able to create it just with a data entry. The money has to be backed up with something, at least fractionally. So Banks can only go so far.

Imagine each State had just 1 Bank. Now imagine what a monstrosity it would be, and how many people they will need to employ.

Someone will need to Guarantee the deposits as well. Can the USA Guarantee the deposits of 320 million citizens?

Also, banks have running costs, and even if they can create money, the products they sell have a financial cost in some way which they need to pass on, and add their mark up.

I don't believe you have thought everything through.

If money is free, then you need to tax depositors. That would include pensioners and the most vulnerable. Don't see that working.

Absolutely, but it is coming anyway .......... Note the advent of the newest bank scam ...... NEGATIVE INTEREST! They will now charge you for putting your money into their bank. i.e. they will charge you for lending them your money!!!! That will apply to pensioners or any individual or business. Add to that the enthusiasm by the banks are showing for a cashless society (Only electronic transactions .... no cash at all) and you will have only two options; a) pay the banks to look after your money ........ or b) spend it. So you will not have the option to withdraw it and hide it under the bed .......... as there will not be any paper currency! Nowhere to hide?

Oh yes, but I am not going to be a customer of such a bank. Imagine that.

I haven't heard of such a thing, but people are not that stupid.

Banks are always going to charge interest, unless the Federal Reserve reduce interest below 0% which is the case in Japan. It's only temporary though.

Banks will always pay interest, because for them, that is cheap money too.

[Robin Hood]

Paphitis:

First of all, I don't believe our banks are able to create it just with a data entry. The money has to be backed up with something, at least fractionally. So Banks can only go so far.

That is completely wrong thinking! Private commercial Banks do exactly that .......... proved beyond argument as previously stated. Sources: Bank of England, The FED and the German Central Bank ..... I also provided an explanation by Prof, Werner as expert confirmation. So creating it as a data entry is EXACTLY what they do. There are limitations but in the UK there are none ..... I don't know about Australia.

Imagine each State had just 1 Bank. Now imagine what a monstrosity it would be, and how many people they will need to employ.

Why, if all you use is a plastic card? All the purchasing outlets have little gizmos that you plug your card into, you punch in your 4 digit pin and hey presto transaction completed, down a telephone line ........ by a server doing thousands of such transactions a second. Staff? Who needs staff?

Also, banks have running costs, and even if they can create money, the products they sell have a financial cost in some way which they need to pass on, and add their mark up.

I have previously explained that interest and charges will pay for that.

I don't believe you have thought everything through.

Quite the contrary! You doubt the fundamental proven fact that commercial banks create money out of nothing. Once you work out how ..... which is not difficult and I have given you links to the explanations, which are 100% correct,..... then you will see the logic and validity of the argument!

Oh yes, but I am not going to be a customer of such a bank. Imagine that.

You will have no option! That will be the way banks will work within the next 10-12 years!

I haven't heard of such a thing, but people are not that stupid.

Unfortunately they are! Well that is unkind, let’s say they are not very well informed. So you haven’t heard of this? That is not surprising as, like the creation of currency from nothing by banks, it is not something the MSM wants people to get a grasp of.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sweden-cashless-society-negative-interest-rates-2015-10

.....Denmark and Norway are going the same route. The banks are very keen on this and that alone should be warning that it will not work in our interest.

Banks are always going to charge interest, unless the Federal Reserve reduce interest below 0% which is the case in Japan. It's only temporary though.

I think that will prove to be permanent, especially when all you have is electronic currency!

Banks will always pay interest, because for them, that is cheap money too.

Again you are assuming that banks NEED your money? They don’t ..... it is loans that create deposits not the other way round. Why pay someone to borrow their money when you don't need it anyway? Your deposit is a liability for the bank. It is not an asset. In short .... our money is really a pain in the ass for banks ..... they need borrowers not savers!

[Paphitis]

Paphitis:

First of all, I don't believe our banks are able to create it just with a data entry. The money has to be backed up with something, at least fractionally. So Banks can only go so far.

That is completely wrong thinking! Private commercial Banks do exactly that .......... proved beyond argument as previously stated. Sources: Bank of England, The FED and the German Central Bank ..... I also provided an explanation by Prof, Werner as expert confirmation. So creating it as a data entry is EXACTLY what they do. There are limitations but in the UK there are none ..... I don't know about Australia.

Imagine each State had just 1 Bank. Now imagine what a monstrosity it would be, and how many people they will need to employ.

Why, if all you use is a plastic card? All the purchasing outlets have little gizmos that you plug your card into, you punch in your 4 digit pin and hey presto transaction completed, down a telephone line ........ by a server doing thousands of such transactions a second. Staff? Who needs staff?

Also, banks have running costs, and even if they can create money, the products they sell have a financial cost in some way which they need to pass on, and add their mark up.

I have previously explained that interest and charges will pay for that.

I don't believe you have thought everything through.

Quite the contrary! You doubt the fundamental proven fact that commercial banks create money out of nothing. Once you work out how ..... which is not difficult and I have given you links to the explanations, which are 100% correct,..... then you will see the logic and validity of the argument!

Oh yes, but I am not going to be a customer of such a bank. Imagine that.

You will have no option! That will be the way banks will work within the next 10-12 years!

I haven't heard of such a thing, but people are not that stupid.

Unfortunately they are! Well that is unkind, let’s say they are not very well informed. So you haven’t heard of this? That is not surprising as, like the creation of currency from nothing by banks, it is not something the MSM wants people to get a grasp of.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sweden-cashless-society-negative-interest-rates-2015-10

.....Denmark and Norway are going the same route. The banks are very keen on this and that alone should be warning that it will not work in our interest.

Banks are always going to charge interest, unless the Federal Reserve reduce interest below 0% which is the case in Japan. It's only temporary though.

I think that will prove to be permanent, especially when all you have is electronic currency!

Banks will always pay interest, because for them, that is cheap money too.

Again you are assuming that banks NEED your money? They don’t ..... it is loans that create deposits not the other way round. Why pay someone to borrow their money when you don't need it anyway? Your deposit is a liability for the bank. It is not an asset. In short .... our money is really a pain in the ass for banks ..... they need borrowers not savers!

RH,

all you guys, especially on the Left side of politics, just really don't know how things work or operate. You come up with weird and wonderful Socialist policies thinking you're all fair. You keep saying you want a fair and equitable society that has compassion without even understanding the fact that there is no such thing.

All we can do is protect people and legislate. There will always be unscrupulous people, and "businessmen" around taking the piss. But they are the minority because the responsible businessman knows he can't have his cake and eat it too. Even huge corporations like Apple and Microsoft primarily comprise of middle class families just trying to get ahead and which are probably even leveraged trying to achieve a particular lifestyle. You look at the Super Rich with envy. People like Bill gates and Putin I guess. Which brings me to your hypocrisy, because you admire Putin without even asking how on earth he amassed his obscene wealth as a KGB Agent and as President of Russia. That is really the evil you are against, and I agree, that there are dodgy things occurring in our Capitalist system. Unfortunately, there is nothing we can do about it, because Bill gates and Putin are completely untouchable and completely immune. The Super super wealthy will just get richer just like the super wealthy in Greece are still getting wealthier while the lower end is getting poorer. What is happening in Greece can happen in USA, any EU country and everywhere else and no one here is immune to poverty. There are many twists and turns and roundabouts, but the Trumps of this world are still gonna be super wealthy.

The problem with you guys is that in your quest or vendetta against the Super Wealthy, you are going to stuff things up for the Middle Class and those who operate Small and Medium Businesses and which employ more people than the biggest multi nationals do on the planet. Businesses which employ only a few people. You see their houses in the leafy suburbs of of New York, or Sydney and think God Damn with beading green eyes, but you don't understand the trials and tribulations of running a business. There are a ton of pitfalls and many of these people are often very Cash Poor. For instance, you can run a transport business, with 10 Kenworth trucks wirth 1 million each. that's 10 million dollars right? You employ 20 truckers and have contracts with Multi National chains. Sweet hey? Yeh well this dude could still owe 7 million to the Banks and on top of that is a CREDITOR to those chains because his terms are 30 days. When Diesel was through the roof a few years ago, they were struggling with their 7 day term Shell Fuel Bills. 150,000 in Diesal costs per month. Sometimes, they have CASHFLOW issues and need to see the Bank to get an overdraft so that they can pay everyone's wages.

To you, this man is rich because of his comfy house and his nice cars, but you don't understand he almost lost his cars, trucks and house. And if that hapenned, his employees lose their jobs, and they probably got mortgages on their house too.

Sorry, but I am not participating in such bitter lemons, because you guys bloody have no clue what you're talking about and you also are in your comfort zones whiles others are taking risks and just trying to have a go. And the Banks, they can be ruthless, but without them our economies would just die. The Middle Class will friggin die and even the lower end will lose their houses, while Trump, Putin, Gates and the mega rich arseholes will just keep going on.

You Socialists are just POVERTY generators, and just want everyone to be poor and have no dreams for a better future. Poverty is the Capitalist System's biggest enemy.

[Paphitis]

When I was young, I had a different view of the world. I remember the first time I voted thinking I'm having my say in the wonderfully free and liberal society.

Yes we are a liberal society and a good society overall. Walk down the street and experience every culture on the planet and Cypriots have no idea how really special that is. One of my favorite cultures ever, the Arabs. Yes those Muslums. I love them so much.

Now I know, voting is a waste of time. We do not have any say whatsoever!

The only say we have in the West is on who we are and what we can do for a career, and yes in business and in Capitalism, we can actually have our say and take what should belong to all of us. That is where we are all equal because a Fifiri like me can achieve a lot of things but I still won't have much of a say.

That is literally the best thing we have going in the West. It's a bueatiful thing.

But I love reading the Guardian, especially the comment section. Why? Because it reminds me how STUPID people really are and I find it funny. All these arty farty Apple sound bytes from people who fancy themselves as academics telling everyone what they should be doing, how they should behave, and people that are so self loathing they think society is all wrong.

PC gone mad. Marriage equality. Migration. And those who speak out are bigots, racist, or some right wing arsehole because they are responsible for all the ills of the world. A Capitalist is a demon! Who said that? Some unemployed arsehole who thinks the world owes them a living? They still won't wash dishes or pick fruit, but happy to complain and throw insults. But no matter their inanity, I still support their right to have their say and demonstrate their stupidity. It's entertaining after all.

Just go and watch more sound bites and reality TV. No worries! Let's all sit around a camp fire, smoke pot and sing some songs.

If the Anti Capitalists really are who they say they are, then fine! It's a free and liberal society. Free for you to be content and free enough to be a Capitalist. But if you don't like that people are actually going to try, and have a go, then you're also free to buy a one way ticket to North Korea where I am sure you would feel more at home watching State TV.

[Paphitis]

An American tourist goes to the bar. He asks for a Fosters! The bar man laughs at him saying you must be a tourist.

The American learns his lesson because the next time he goes to the Bar he asks for 50 lashes!

50 lashes pale ale. A business started by a Convict who came to Australia with 50 lashes because he stole a loaf of bread in London. A billion dollar firm selling some of the finest beer on the planet.

Same with all the Greek, Italian, Syrian and Afghani migrants. Who is going to have their Billion dollar company next? Steve Jobs is Syrian.

[Paphitis]

In Australia, the biggest debate at the moment is about "The Safe Schools" curiculla. Yes the left brigade want to introduce a program where they teach 7 year old children that gender is fluid. No worries!

Whereas, a politician by the name of Corey Bernardi, an Olympic Gold Medalist is a Right wing pig and bigot. No worries!

Asiktir malakides for telling my son it's ok to wear a dress.

You're all fucked up. Now, I am calling my good mate fascist Corey Bernardi so he can join me for some 50 lashes.

Malakides.

No wonder people want to spen 30000 per year to send their kids to a Christian School.

Asiktir!

[Robin Hood]

Boy ..... do you have a chip on your shoulder. You must have had a deprived childhood and are euphoric that it is now you sitting at the top table! How sad ..... but never mind, if you are happy that's fine with me. But please don't spout complete rubbish ............ it upsets my cat!

[Paphitis]

Oh yes, typical Leftist rubbish that the other side is talking nonsense and that they are at the top of the table.

No, Putin is at the top of the tables abd he is probably a true criminal but that is ok with you. I'm just a try hard wannabe trying to have a go.

Never mind, let's have the homosexual Guardian "academics" socially enginneer our society and tell us it is ok to tell my boy that his gender is fluid and that he can use the female toilets just in case he wants to neck himself. No worries.

News flash! Suicide is rampant for males, not transsexual, homosexuals or women. It's the male who is most likely to neck themselves idiots. But that's ok because now I am a woman hating mysogynist!

But excuse me for seeing my Bank Manager so I can buy an option so that I can afford to send my boy to a Christian Ivy League Tie school. If I couldn't afford that, I would send him to a Jewish or Islamic school because all of you are fucked and they're not!

And I'm not religious either but I do know fucked when I see it.

But that's ok, because I'm a right wing arsehole. I'm a racist mysogynist. I'm racist bigot. A capitalist bully. No worries!

I apologize to society and Guardian readers worldwide.

Asiktir malakides and off to North Korea you go! You know you want to!

[Paphitis]

Boy ..... do you have a chip on your shoulder. You must have had a deprived childhood and are euphoric that it is now you sitting at the top table! How sad ..... but never mind, if you are happy that's fine with me. But please don't spout complete rubbish ............ it upsets my cat!

And btw brother, I'm feeling a little guilty right now.

I love you to death man because you fight your corner and you are switched on and I respect you for it. Definitely want to meet you because I think you're an ethical man, a well meaning man. And I don't give a stuff that we appear to be polar opposites. It's certainly ok to have alternate views of society. And I am no supporter of Banks, but just consider to try and have a pragmatic view. Not dismissing your view of the Goverent having control of the Banks but as long as it would work for all involved, from Businesses and of course the working class. Don't ever like seeing anyone on the streets. Everyone deserves a fair go. It's just that our economy is such a juggling act and probably just a false house of cards that can crash down at any time. Then the 99.9% will suffer but not the 0.1%. Even those in the leafy suburbs will suffer.

I want to meet you one day. You're a friggin good bloke!

And I'm not making fun of anyone like I was accused of. I used to be on a recruitment panel for 12 months at a previous workplace. Yeh, experience and degrees count, being a captain of a Football team counts, serving definitely counts, but what catches my eye is the individual with the required qualifications and who has included in their CC that they were a fruit picker, dish washer, courier or taxi driver at one time. That to me indicates something extra than all the university degrees combined.

Moral of the story is that, I would make my own kids work at McDonalds, KFC, or pick fruit and wash dishes!

I remember one applicant who included in that in their CV. My immediate thought was, he deserves a friggin job. It's something that stands out from the pile.