Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

Ancient Greeks are a mythology and the LACK of such genes is testament to that.
Scientific measurements don't lie...

Science might not lie, but you certainly do.

The presence or absence of genetic heterogeneity in Sicily has long been debated. Through the analysis of the variation of Y-chromosome lineages, using the combination of haplogroups and short tandem repeats from several areas of Sicily, we show that traces of genetic flows occurred in the island, due to ancient Greek colonization and to northern African contributions, are still visible on the basis of the distribution of some lineages. The genetic contribution of Greek chromosomes to the Sicilian gene pool is estimated to be about 37% whereas the contribution of North African populations is estimated to be around 6%.

In particular, the presence of a modal haplotype coming from the southern Balkan Peninsula and of its one-step derivates associated to E3b1a2-V13, supports a common genetic heritage between Sicilians and Greeks. The estimate of Time to Most Recent Common Ancestor is about 2380 years before present, which broadly agrees with the archaeological traces of the Greek classic era.

http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v17/ ... 8120a.html

No genes from ancient Greeks, huh?

The PCA analysis also highlights the high affinity of the Minoans to the current inhabitants of the Lassithi plateau as well as Greece. Among the top 10 nearest neighbours to our Minoan population sample, four are Greek populations and two of these from Lassithi prefecture (Fig. 5). The close relationship of the Minoans to modern Cretans is also apparent, when analysis is restricted to populations originating from Greece (Fig. 6b). Particularly in respect to the first PCA (capturing 92% of the variance of this particular subset of the data), the Minoans are extremely close to the modern Lassithi population, the populations from the islands of Chios and Euboea, as well as the populations of Argolis and Lakonia (Southern Greece ) (Fig. 6b). Thus, the modern inhabitants of the Lassithi plateau still carry the maternal genetic signatures of their ancient predecessors of the Minoan population.

http://www.nature.com/ncomms/journal/v4 ... s2871.html

I think you might have your wires crossed! The Minoans are also from the Levant and certainly not Greek!

http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-22527821

All you have proven is that the Minoans spread their genes to other islands like Chios and Euboia!

[DrCyprus]

My only disappointment is that Cypriots don't have any Germanic DNA.

If Hitler was correct about one thing, it was his notion that Germans are of a higher order too. Proven so many times.

Greeks have some slight Germanic traces, but tthose DNA Markers must have been corrupted and overpowered by some other crap.

This is the kind of defeatist racist thinking that really grinds my gears.

Germans and Germanics are not of a higher order to anyone in regards to DNA. In fact noone is.

What set the Germans and Germanics apart as peoples is that: The early protestants among them believed that hard work and contributing to their community would allow them to enter heaven and they truly based their lives around that belief. (Unlike the idiot catholics who thought they could buy their way to heaven through heaven certificates issued by the Vatican and the enslaved Orthodox who didn't really get to own anything and in fact had their children and women stolen from them regularly by swarthy people wearing funny hats.) This is the basis of their social democratic governments today.

The Germans made money to fight World War 2 by stealing, plain good old stealing and killing and abusing their minorities and the peoples of other countries. After the end of the war the western - allied occupied - part of Germany recovered fast (also known as the German economic miracle) because the U.S.A drowned them in money because they wanted a strong ally to function as a buffer country between the Soviet Union and the rest of Europe.

In fact, what was once Eastern Germany is still, after so many years, backwards culturally and politically. Western Germans still, to this day, pay a solidarity tax with the aim of building up East Germany.

Scientific racism was a 19th century fairy tale that fat old white Americans funded to better control their negro cotton pickers. Racial segregation is as much based on fairy tale as the Religion based millet system our beloved Ottoman Sultan Pashas imposed on us during the Ottoman period.

[Get Real!]

My only disappointment is that Cypriots don't have any Germanic DNA.

If Hitler was correct about one thing, it was his notion that Germans are of a higher order too. Proven so many times.

Greeks have some slight Germanic traces, but tthose DNA Markers must have been corrupted and overpowered by some other crap.

This is the kind of defeatist racist thinking that really grinds my gears.

You take the Koala too seriously!

Yesterday he was Greek, today Cypriot, tomorrow Australian, and the following day American or Venezuelan!

Nobody knows which of the 4 sides of the bed he’ll come out each day.

[Paphitis]

My only disappointment is that Cypriots don't have any Germanic DNA.

If Hitler was correct about one thing, it was his notion that Germans are of a higher order too. Proven so many times.

Greeks have some slight Germanic traces, but tthose DNA Markers must have been corrupted and overpowered by some other crap.

This is the kind of defeatist racist thinking that really grinds my gears.

Germans and Germanics are not of a higher order to anyone in regards to DNA. In fact noone is.

What set the Germans and Germanics apart as peoples is that: The early protestants among them believed that hard work and contributing to their community would allow them to enter heaven and they truly based their lives around that belief. (Unlike the idiot catholics who thought they could buy their way to heaven through heaven certificates issued by the Vatican and the enslaved Orthodox who didn't really get to own anything and in fact had their children and women stolen from them regularly by swarthy people wearing funny hats.) This is the basis of their social democratic governments today.

The Germans made money to fight World War 2 by stealing, plain good old stealing and killing and abusing their minorities and the peoples of other countries. After the end of the war the western - allied occupied - part of Germany recovered fast (also known as the German economic miracle) because the U.S.A drowned them in money because they wanted a strong ally to function as a buffer country between the Soviet Union and the rest of Europe.

In fact, what was once Eastern Germany is still, after so many years, backwards culturally and politically. Western Germans still, to this day, pay a solidarity tax with the aim of building up East Germany.

Scientific racism was a 19th century fairy tale that fat old white Americans funded to better control their negro cotton pickers. Racial segregation is as much based on fairy tale as the Religion based millet system our beloved Ottoman Sultan Pashas imposed on us during the Ottoman period.

Really DrCyprus? Really?

You took all that seriously. I was saying the Germanics are superior and I purely base that on their achievements and not so much on race or religion.

Yes well the Greeks are also Orthodox and they must have not believed in making a contribution.

Now once again, that was said with tongue in cheek, but please entertain me some more with your accusations of racism.

And yes I am racist, I got to admit that. I am a racist Cypriot and clearly feel superior and more intelligent!

[Paphitis]

My only disappointment is that Cypriots don't have any Germanic DNA.

If Hitler was correct about one thing, it was his notion that Germans are of a higher order too. Proven so many times.

Greeks have some slight Germanic traces, but tthose DNA Markers must have been corrupted and overpowered by some other crap.

This is the kind of defeatist racist thinking that really grinds my gears.

You take the Koala too seriously!

Yesterday he was Greek, today Cypriot, tomorrow Australian, and the following day American or Venezuelan!

Nobody knows which of the 4 sides of the bed he’ll come out each day.

Always a Cypriot Australian snot face who lives in neither. Either that or Australian Cypriot. But I can be just Cypriot or just Australian. Take your pick.

But I like all peoples of all races generally speaking and of all religions, including Greeks. But I don't like those who want to deny Cypriots and they are generally Greeks and Turks of questionable genetics.

[supporttheunderdog]

nice article in today CM on a dig in pre-Hellenic remains, showing there was civil society in Cyprus at a time when nothing Greek existed.

http://cyprus-mail.com/2015/09/04/first-dig-at-chlorakas-copper-age-site-ends/

something which I have posted before but which is possibly related
ftp://ftp.cordis.europa.eu/pub/inco2/docs/coe_3rd_agm_annex_3_aphrodite.pdf

two of the conclusions of this article are

Clear signals of the Levantine influence can be detected in Cyprus mtDNA
pool, possibly dating back to Ugarit and Phoenician times

and

Cypriote mtDNA pool does contain mtDNA variants that are native to subSaharan
Africans but are very rare in Anatolia, Greece, Crete, though
relatively frequent in Egypt, in the Mediterranean Africa in general and also
present in Arab-speaking Near Eastern populations, including in Syrians,
Jordanians, Palestinians and, least frequently, in Lebanese populations.
Interestingly, the lineages found belong to the “most ancient” variant of the
maternal lineages – to L1.

There is therefore at least an attested near or middle eastern influence in Cyprus ancestry, so no argument with GR on this oned.

[repulsewarrior]

...what is a "Greek"? Interesting question, big difference between Greek, and "Greek", it seems.

...if of Greek is "Greek", it naturally follows that "Greeks" come from Greeks. Add to it modern Greece, it is easy to get your "Greeks", and your Greeks, confused.

[supporttheunderdog]

...what is a "Greek"? Interesting question, big difference between Greek, and "Greek", it seems.

...if of Greek is "Greek", it naturally follows that "Greeks" come from Greeks. Add to it modern Greece, it is easy to get your "Greeks", and your Greeks, confused.

From what I have read, all the best evidence tends to suggest that the Greeks as a recognisable ethnicity and culture developed in what is now modern day Greece in about 2000 -1900 bc following a fusion between on the one hand, the Neolithic peoples who came west out if the levant and And Anatolia, starting about 9000 bc, settling Crete and Cyprus in the process. and who probably did not speak an Indo-European language and thought to be more matralineal with female (earth mother) Deities and on the other hand peoples who came into the Balkans from the Southern Russian/Ukranian Steppes, starting sometime after 6500 bc, known as the Kurgan or Yamana people, thought to be IndoEuropean speakers, possibly in 3 waves, the last of which headed for what is now called Greece . They are thought to be a male dominated warrior based society.,

The theory has it they brought the Indo-European elements of the language along with male deities into the area, and it was the modification of their language with the adoption of loan words for eg places, and the combination of their deity system with the female based deity system of the earlier settlers that lead to the creation of what we know call Greeks. As i understand it about 2000bc, possibly a bit later. There are other theories, lots of them, but this one apparently best fits the evidence.

They were the Mycenaeans. They began to expand their sphere of influence into the minoan areas in about 1400 bc, then after that was expansion to Cyprus , initially trade from about 1400 bc. Then one had the Collapse of local civilsations all over the east med about 1200 bc leaving increasing Hellenic influences once things settled. That may not even have been Mycenaean but Dorian.

The theory of how Cyprus became Hellenized through peacefu settlement is a factoid that was only developed in late 17th century Europe and after, influenced by politics etc. This factiod nature of the theory had been extensively discussed by Natasha Leriou of Athens University. She mentions other theories but shies away from discusing them. However then It was politically desireable to have a theory of peaceful absorbtion even though that does not make sense as the actual number of Greek incomers was probably small, and they would likely have been subsumed by the existing local popultion, unless they were in Authority and coukd impose their language and culture. Why would an established society suddenly change so much, in particular when the incomers were likely illiterate and for the second time in Greek history had an alphabet modified for them? First Was non-greek linear B to Greek linear B . Howeverb That is the theory of Jennings for which see http://www.albany.edu/Jennings_thesis.doc.

I am aware of the contraversial nature of that Thesis.