Cyprus-Forum.com

[Viewpoint]

Viewpoint,
My belief is that NOT ALL GC refugees will want to return to live fully in the North.But they must have the right to return if they want to.Reality will be different.Hence my suggestion that the refugees who want to return must be genuine.They must want to live in the North and participate as equal citizens in the democratic process.If that means they become the majority in 50 years time,fine with me.But you did not comment on my idea.Would you accept not to limit the numbers of GC refugees returning (with the exception of the test above)?will you agree to trade off justice for all refugees who want it,with the risk of becoming a minority in some 40/50 years time?Do you think it will matter by then?
This is not my ideal solution as you know,but I am prepared to compromise to get us out of this mess.Are you?

I would consider compromising on the basis of having safety valves in place as I do not trust the true intentions of GCs today on the basis of their past record and current stance. If over the next 20 30 years they can show their goodwill to accept us as equal partners in a united Cyprus then I would have no problems with GCs out numbering TCs in the Northern State which would be run by TCs under an equal federal structure. But while we are on the route to this ultimate goal I would want a maximum level cap to deter and ensure that GC leaders do not take a decision to become the majority in the north for sole purpose of taking control of the whole island. Those GCs that wish to live in the north could do so but with political rights purely related to their own GC leaders or alternatively they could vote for TCs leaders (although this does have an element of risk) that would represent them and not for GC leaders that would respresent those that reside in the south. The aim is to ensure that TCs have political equality with GCs and that no loop holes are left to allow either side to seek dominance over the other. They should be encouraged to work together as equals positively for the good of a united Cyprus without a need to have hidden agendas for sole political control.

[bg_turk]

There is enough land in Turkey as well. About our country we will decide, not you. Those settlers were brought illegally in Cyprus and they should go back to their own country. Cyprus is not obligated to give citizenship to settlers.

Quote the EU law which will give you the right to expel Cypriots from their homeland just because their parents were settlers, please.
So much for your "european solution"!

[bg_turk]

The difference between you and me is that I insist on human rights, legality and democracy, and you insist on human rights violations, illegality and the racist separation of people.

Does insisting on "human rights" also mean insisting on the expulsion of Cypriots with settler origins?

[Viewpoint]

Birkibrisli while we still have fanatics like Piratis who believe that all GCs refugees can go back how do you expect to negotiate anything? let alone run a country together. This is a perfect example of why the island will not and should not be reunited as it will give way to turning Cyprus into a time bomb. People like Piratis still have venom in their hearts a longing for vegence and to get even with us for 1974. He has no problem about throwing people on the streets or out of the country because this was done to him so others should suffer as well, this mentality is not correct, there are many settlers that have been here for 30 years which is longer than young genreation GCs. Although I accept that as many GCs refugees as possible should be allowed to rights to their properties I cannot see how it is possible that all can return. Satisfactory compensation is the only way forward, many not all properties have been utilized to a point of no return.

But how do you negotiate with the Piratis mentality and cultivate a desire to share a country with people who do not accept you as a partner but as a minority purely based on numbers. When will they wake up to the fact that the numbers game was left back in 1974 we now have a totally different situation we are two equal communities North and South and we want to be treated as such. As long as GCs leaders pursue their dream of reducing us to a political minority then the current status quo will continue well into the future.

Rubbish!

I am sure you will say just about anything in order to keep the spoils of the looting!

COULD YOU KINDLY BE MORE CIVIL AND SPECIFIC.

[Eric dayi]

Birkibrisli while we still have fanatics like Piratis who believe that all GCs refugees can go back how do you expect to negotiate anything? let alone run a country together. This is a perfect example of why the island will not and should not be reunited as it will give way to turning Cyprus into a time bomb. People like Piratis still have venom in their hearts a longing for vegence and to get even with us for 1974. He has no problem about throwing people on the streets or out of the country because this was done to him so others should suffer as well, this mentality is not correct, there are many settlers that have been here for 30 years which is longer than young genreation GCs. Although I accept that as many GCs refugees as possible should be allowed to rights to their properties I cannot see how it is possible that all can return. Satisfactory compensation is the only way forward, many not all properties have been utilized to a point of no return.

But how do you negotiate with the Piratis mentality and cultivate a desire to share a country with people who do not accept you as a partner but as a minority purely based on numbers. When will they wake up to the fact that the numbers game was left back in 1974 we now have a totally different situation we are two equal communities North and South and we want to be treated as such. As long as GCs leaders pursue their dream of reducing us to a political minority then the current status quo will continue well into the future.

Rubbish!

I am sure you will say just about anything in order to keep the spoils of the looting!

COULD YOU KINDLY BE MORE CIVIL AND SPECIFIC.

VP, I am sure he would if he could but alas...!

[Eric dayi]

[quote="Birkibrisli"]Have you got it all off your chests,guys and gals,so we can get on with the topic in this thread?quote]

Birkibrisli, "war" is not only an armed conflict.

The war in Cyprus started as an armed conflict in 1963 but since 1974 has turned into a political war. If the person who started this thread ment an armed conflict he should have made it more clear. As it is, it is opened to all sorts of war topics.

The embargoes, opening (or not) of the gates, renaming Turkish Delight to Cypriot Delight but calling hallumi Greek style Hallumi and loads of other things are all a political war and if an armed conflict does not start (I hope not) the political war will be what decides the future of Cyprus. If the GC's win then the island will become a Greek island and ENOSIS will be achieved but if the TC's win it'll be partition for ever.

The only thing I am worried about is that the GC's seem to be getting a little impatient because they have not managed to get the TC's to surrender so they are now thinking of starting a war against a much stronger force in order to get more world sympathy than they already have.

I hope and pray for everyones sake that it will stay as a political war untill a solution is found and does not turn into an armed conflict.

[Piratis]

Quote the EU law which will give you the right to expel Cypriots from their homeland just because their parents were settlers, please.

According to the forth Geneva Convention:

The Occupying Power shall not deport or transfer parts of its own civilian population into the territory it occupies.

The settlers are illegal in Cyprus and they are not Cypriots. If their human rights are violated this is done by Turkey, and not us. Therefore Turkey is responsible for their human rights. They are Turkish, and not Cypriot citizens.

So much for your "european solution"!

Nothing in EU requires Cyprus to give citizenship to people that were brought illegality in violation of the Geneva Convention. If you disagree, please quote me the part that says that illegal settlers or their children are supposed to be given citizenship.

[zan]

Perhaps we should deport you as well because you were not on the island in 1960.

[Eric dayi]

i dont know for which delights you refer to eric dayi.... but it is true, most of our delicasies are indeed turkish. the most words we have in common - even with bulgarians - concern food, and are turkish . i wont fight with you over the origin of delights... i prefer to eat them

Are you taking the mickey cypezokyli? Willst du mich auf'n arm nehemen?

Or maybe you didn't understand the question? It has nothing to do with the "origin" of the Turkish Delight, but then again I think you know what I am talking about, nicht war?

if you refer to the turkish coffee, that in greece is called greek coffee, and in cyprus cypriot coffee...well... big deal. we got it from the ottomans if thats what you want me to admit.

Nope, that's not what I am after either. And I have not mentioned Turkish coffee anywhere in my posting but as you have brought it up yourself ok, lets take that in to our disscission as well if you like.

I am talking about why the GC's insist on renaming Turkish Delight to Cyprus Delight (plus all other Turkish products) and will not but anything in the South that has "Turkish" written on them. I think you know the answers to these but maybe you do not want to talk about them?

[bg_turk]

The settlers are illegal in Cyprus and they are not Cypriots. If their human rights are violated this is done by Turkey, and not us. Therefore Turkey is responsible for their human rights. They are Turkish, and not Cypriot citizens.

Anybody born on the soil of Cyprus is cypriot by definition.
Why should they be expelled? Because they were born "illegally" maybe?
Your statements sound as absurd as usual, when you talk about the rights of cypriots with settler origin violated by Turkey. Those people are citizens of the Turkish Republic of NOrthern Cyprus and if unification is achieved their rights will be violated by the people that demand their expulsion, not Turkey.