Cyprus-Forum.com

[Demonax]

So you are imagining that there is this thing called "trnc" which is now part of RoC but that it will leave in the future? Scotland is something real that existed for centuries and the Scottish people are a native population. The "trnc" is just a label that the Turks give to the land that they illegally occupy and which doesn't belong to them.

True. The only parallel would be if Scotland had invaded the north of England and ethnically cleansed the local population then sent in troops and colonists and declared the Scottish Republic of Northern England which it then tried to get recognised throughout the world as an independent state! Only for the whole world to laugh at them!

It's lamentable that some Turkish Cypriots could actually think that a real nation like Scotland with a real history and culture has anything in common with a stupid joke like the 'trnc'.

Your posts show your complete arrogance.

the referendum shows that the Brits are willing to go a step further and have a "2 State Solution".

Also, they did not divide any states. The States do it to themselves. that is what happened in Cyprus right? We divided the island when we asked for ENOSIS?

you can't blame the Brits for stupidity now can you? You might have had the right, but it wasn't very bright. you admit this right?

Sorry Paphitis! But what a really ignorant post! What on earth are you talking about? States dividing themselves? I don't know where to begin. How about the most obvious? Ireland? You don't know that the British partitioned Ireland through an act of Parliament? That they partitioned Palestine? That by failing to give India self-rule after the First World War they lay the ground for future partition? What about the Sykes Picot line which partitioned the Middle East?

And what on earth are you on about regarding Cyprus? Has the Australian sun finally scrambled your brain? In 1960 the British government told the people of Cyprus that they must accept a conditional postcolonial independence or face an outright division of their island between Greece and Turkey!

Makarios reluctantly signed the flawed 1960 treaty, handing over a chunk of Cyprus to permanent and sovereign British bases, which made it a potentially tripartite partition but also lay the foundation for all the future intercommunal misery in one treaty!

Just go forward a bit more. It was Lords Carrington and Owen of the British Foreign Office who advanced the ethnic partition of Bosnia. The same British Foreign Office which drafted the Annan Plan to partition Cyprus in 2004!

It was Lord Carrington who (just before Nelson Mandela was released from prison) proposed that South Africa be split into a white Afrikaner reservation, a Zulu area, and a free-for-all among various other peoples. You see how they were still trying it on? Go back. It was Sir Anthony Eden who helpfully suggested in 1954 that the United States might consider a division of Vietnam into "North" and "South" at the close of the French colonial fiasco.

There's tons I missed out. Belize and Guatemala? Sri Lanka from India? Gibraltar?

All these states divided themselves? Come on, mate. There' s a pattern here. And you have to be really blind not to see it. As for blaming the Cypriots for the partition of Cyprus you have some bloody nerve. Really surprised you could post such lazy crap!

[Paphitis]

Oh dear! Ireland!

Sure it wasn't sectarian based?

Really?

And did we really have to sign the 1960 agreement? did we really have to start killing British soldiers? we couldn't wait a few measly years.

It's not a question of blaming Cypriots. hindsight is a powerful tool.

But you need to be pulled into line because you seem quite amused at the referendum. You hope the Scots vote Yes, because you THINK that this is their (Brits) just deserts. I wish that the Scots just make the right decision they would be happy with.

I don't hold on to this personal mambo jumbo and I guarantee you I have more reason to do so, than you do.

[miltiades]

My prediction : The NO vote by more than 54%. Scotland will remain in the UK, it makes sense.

[GreekIslandGirl]

Most probably the "Nos" will just sneak through to continue the Union for just a bit longer.

But, as Alex Salmond has pointed out, a "No" vote now is just a deferred "Yes" for the future. We all know Cameron chose this point in time because of the great instability that his banker friends have caused and so he banked on feeding off the fears of the wavering voters and secure a big fat "No".

What no one in Parliament expected was how strong the "YES" leaning would be.

Honestly, why give the Scots the choice and then spend so much taxpayers money trying to persuade them to say No?

Perhaps if Scots say "No" they will continue to be enslaved to London and treated even more like second-class subjects, who have shown themselves to need the Union. London loves the needy ...

[kurupetos]

My prediction : The NO vote by more than 54%. Scotland will remain in the UK, it makes sense.

Does it, old boy? Why?

[Paphitis]

My prediction : The NO vote by more than 54%. Scotland will remain in the UK, it makes sense.

Does it, old boy? Why?

Isn't it amazing that there are nearly 50% ultra nationalistic Scots, whereas in Cyprus we have 90% who are just Greek idiots rather than Cypriot nationalists just like it should be?

It just goes to show that the Scots are smarter and more confident as a race.

[Demonax]

Oh dear! Ireland!

Sure it wasn't sectarian based?

Really?

And did we really have to sign the 1960 agreement? did we really have to start killing British soldiers? we couldn't wait a few measly years.

It's not a question of blaming Cypriots. hindsight is a powerful tool.

But you need to be pulled into line because you seem quite amused at the referendum. You hope the Scots vote Yes, because you THINK that this is their (Brits) just deserts. I wish that the Scots just make the right decision they would be happy with.

I don't hold on to this personal mambo jumbo and I guarantee you I have more reason to do so, than you do.

Ireland was partitioned by a British Act of Parliament in 1920. The legacy of division in India, Cyprus, Palestine and all the other places that bear the hallmarks of a British policy of divide and rule are a lesson in how not to discharge responsibility.

The fact that the UK faces the prospect of break up is ironic given the UKs own history. Nowhere do I say that this should be the reason why Scotland should leave the UK. The Scots were after all the most enthusiastic administers of British colonialism.

The question of Scottish independence is about democracy. Whether Scotland would be better governed by running its own affairs. It looks like the Scottish people are divided on the issue and that a narrow no vote will prevail. But this is a remarkable jump in support for Scottish independence. The issue isn't going to go away and next time they will likely vote Yes.

The British state is going to have to give more federal powers to Scotland which the English Tory MPs don't want to give them. They want to stop Scottish MPs voting on English affairs in future. The UK is breaking up into its constituent parts and there is little they can do to stop it except by going down a federal route. Even that won't be enough.

The reasons for why the UK has survived for so long just don't exist anymore. Empire has gone, the sense of Britishness has gone. The big British industries, coal, shipbuilding, steel have all gone. The Scots don't trust Westminster, the Tories or Labour. Rightly or wrongly they feel fed up with London imposing policies on them. If they want to leave the UK then good luck to them. It's their choice.

[Paphitis]

Oh dear! Ireland!

Sure it wasn't sectarian based?

Really?

And did we really have to sign the 1960 agreement? did we really have to start killing British soldiers? we couldn't wait a few measly years.

It's not a question of blaming Cypriots. hindsight is a powerful tool.

But you need to be pulled into line because you seem quite amused at the referendum. You hope the Scots vote Yes, because you THINK that this is their (Brits) just deserts. I wish that the Scots just make the right decision they would be happy with.

I don't hold on to this personal mambo jumbo and I guarantee you I have more reason to do so, than you do.

Ireland was partitioned by a British Act of Parliament in 1920. The legacy of division in India, Cyprus, Palestine and all the other places that bear the hallmarks of a British policy of divide and rule are a lesson in how not to discharge responsibility.

The fact that the UK faces the prospect of break up is ironic given the UKs own history. Nowhere do I say that this should be the reason why Scotland should leave the UK. The Scots were after all the most enthusiastic administers of British colonialism.

The question of Scottish independence is about democracy. Whether Scotland would be better governed by running its own affairs. It looks like the Scottish people are divided on the issue and that a narrow no vote will prevail. But this is a remarkable jump in support for Scottish independence. The issue isn't going to go away and next time they will likely vote Yes.

The British state is going to have to give more federal powers to Scotland which the English Tory MPs don't want to give them. They want to stop Scottish MPs voting on English affairs in future. The UK is breaking up into its constituent parts and there is little they can do to stop it except by going down a federal route. Even that won't be enough.

The reasons for why the UK has survived for so long just don't exist anymore. Empire has gone, the sense of Britishness has gone. The big British industries, coal, shipbuilding, steel have all gone. The Scots don't trust Westminster, the Tories or Labour. Rightly or wrongly they feel fed up with London imposing policies on them. If they want to leave the UK then good luck to them. It's their choice.

It's all hysterical semantics!

Once again, India and Pakistan was sectarian based and they divided themselves on that basis!

[Demonax]

It's all hysterical semantics!

Once again, India and Pakistan was sectarian based and they divided themselves on that basis!

Don't they teach you British Colonial history in Australia? Maybe not!

Now. Sectarian based partition. Yes it was. Pakistan was carved out of what was once India. Several decades after Britain had failed to grant self-rule to India as it did with other colonies after WW1 (including Australia) and which would likely have avoided partition in 1947 and the subsequent bloodbath.

You are bizarrely resistant to the legacy of British colonial rule as one of partition. Ireland, Cyprus, Palestine, India, the Middle East etc. All spontaneously divided themselves according to you without any British involvement. The British were just innocent bystanders trying to rule in the best interests of the ungrateful natives.

It's not just that it's a pretty silly argument, it's also historical nonsense.

[kurupetos]

My prediction : The NO vote by more than 54%. Scotland will remain in the UK, it makes sense.

Does it, old boy? Why?

Isn't it amazing that there are nearly 50% ultra nationalistic Scots, whereas in Cyprus we have 90% who are just Greek idiots rather than Cypriot nationalists just like it should be?

It just goes to show that the Scots are smarter and more confident as a race.

Just because they want independence from the UK, doesn't make them ultra-nationalists. It's their right to do that. If it's the wrong decision, then it will be their problem.

The vast majority of the Cypriots asked for union with Greece, but this right was denied to them by the imperialist Brits (1930, 1950, 1959). Hopefully the Scots will be able to choose without interference...