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GC Leader storms out of meeting.

How can we solve it? (keep it civilized)

Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Viewpoint » Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:25 pm

Oceanside50 wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:
the north


..occupied territories


True we occupy them, so this "occupied" label is to us very funny.


Illegally occupy a part of Cyprus...as this TC has admitted by wanting to give back property that he illegally occupies to its rightful Greek Cypriot owner..

http://cyprus-mail.com/2014/07/31/turki ... ossession/

“Eray Ozer is looking for the real owners of these lands, the title deeds of which were given to him in 2004, in order to give them back without waiting for absolutely anything in return,” wrote the paper.

Ozer reportedly visited the Turkish Cypriot daily on Wednesday holding the title deeds in his hands and saying: “This property is not mine. It was taken by force from its real owners. I cannot reconcile with my honour leaving this property as inheritance to my children.”


The GC can go to the IPC to get his property back or compensation thousands of GCs have done this.
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Viewpoint » Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:37 pm

Nikitas wrote:VP asked:

"Please provide an example, everyone appears to be just making sweeping statements. There will be cases where the EU will have to accept derrogations or transition periods."

OK let us take a mundane and concrete example, the management of garbage. Here in Greece some communities are notoriously slow in implementing EU regulations regarding the burial of garbage. The result is a fine amounting to several hundred thousand Euros per day. One such rebel community is Kouroupitos in Hania in Crete, you can look it up.

The fine is paid by the NATION not the community causing the problem. So let us put this in context of BBF, where one community decides to veto an EU regulation and the fine is levied on the whole nation, ie both communities in our case, then what?

It cannot happen is the usual response. If it can happen in a centralised unitary state like Greece and others in the EU it can happen in Cyprus. We might need a local EU compliance arbitration office to determine which community is responsible for which infractions and pass the fines along.

Then there is the envirionmental bit. Holland had refused to commit certain areas as bird protection areas under EU 409/79 Directive. It was taken to the EU court by its own nationals, and the court found that it had no discretion as to which areas it would devote to environmental protection. If an area fulfilled the criteria it was bound to be so declared, and Holland was fined.

Can you hear the clamour: it is our country, we do what we want, etc etc that will reverberate after such a decision?

You do not need to jump to high end constitutional stuff and derogations from the basics. The EU usually gets you on the little things. Just think, 80 per cent of legislation passing in EU nations originates in Brussels. Are you ready to deal with this reality? The GCs are, and are moving along just fine, but they eliminated their nationalist complexes long ago. I wonder about the TCs.


Now Nikitas we TCs never agreed to joining the EU, the GCs took this step not because they needed all this red tape and beaurocracy but because they wanted the weight of the EU behind which they later found was all hot air, 10 years is enough time to see this. But lets just say arguements sake we looked positively the points will have to be adhered to after transitional periods and funding to raise the standard to those expected by the EU. If after this adaptation period the North state does not abide by the rules then any fines should be directed at the state in question, I and I am sure many TCs have no problems with this, the South state should not pay for our incompetencies of running the North state and the same should go for the South state.

Its the major issues such as governance, residency, voting, security, trade, international relations and consititutional amendments plus adherence that are more important, now do you understand my concerns?
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Viewpoint » Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:39 pm

boulio wrote:If you want to yield 50 % you must go back to 1960 agreements with the veto,that means completely going back.all refugees to there homes.if not we go to a federation with a 75-25 % split in land you run your affairs that are allocated to the states and ithe majority decides on issues left to the federal govt.


hello are you aware thats whats been on the table for 40 years? its the GCs that keep rejecting it, which proposal have they actually said yes to?
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby boulio » Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:02 pm

No it is not what's been negotiated for 40 years,what's been the turkish thesis for 40 years first was that the cyprus problem was solved in 1974 and then when the geniuses in Ankara realized that cyprus was joining the EU they have been trying to negotiate a confederation.
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Lordo » Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:37 pm

mavro laoman what have they been negotiating since 1974 then
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Viewpoint » Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:38 pm

boulio wrote:No it is not what's been negotiated for 40 years,what's been the turkish thesis for 40 years first was that the cyprus problem was solved in 1974 and then when the geniuses in Ankara realized that cyprus was joining the EU they have been trying to negotiate a confederation.


So you disagree with the World.
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Oceanside50 » Fri Aug 01, 2014 7:32 pm

Viewpoint wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
Oceanside50 wrote:
the north


..occupied territories


True we occupy them, so this "occupied" label is to us very funny.


Illegally occupy a part of Cyprus...as this TC has admitted by wanting to give back property that he illegally occupies to its rightful Greek Cypriot owner..

http://cyprus-mail.com/2014/07/31/turki ... ossession/

“Eray Ozer is looking for the real owners of these lands, the title deeds of which were given to him in 2004, in order to give them back without waiting for absolutely anything in return,” wrote the paper.

Ozer reportedly visited the Turkish Cypriot daily on Wednesday holding the title deeds in his hands and saying: “This property is not mine. It was taken by force from its real owners. I cannot reconcile with my honour leaving this property as inheritance to my children.”


The GC can go to the IPC to get his property back or compensation thousands of GCs have done

That's not the issue here Vp the issue is giving up living on stolen properties and your leaders accepting the fact that if there will be a solution human/civil rights have to be honored...you on the other hand want apartheid ...
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Kikapu » Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:16 pm

Oceanside50 wrote:
Viewpoint wrote:
The GC can go to the IPC to get his property back or compensation thousands of GCs have done

That's not the issue here Vp the issue is giving up living on stolen properties and your leaders accepting the fact that if there will be a solution human/civil rights have to be honored...you on the other hand want apartheid ...


Only with an Apartheid system VP can keep "his" stolen GC properties in the north. "Good luck" to him doing that in the EU.

There are many honourable TCs in the north. Many even refused to take any stolen GC properties when they could have, like my mother, instead they took points against their own properties in the south, which was a mistake on it's own, but they were scared into accepting such worthless offer. They were to give the titles of their own properties in the south to the regime in the north for in return to receive stolen GC properties in the north. The only hope these people with points would have now, is that there is a settlement so that they can get their properties back in the south, since the points they have has very little monetary value these days.
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Nikitas » Fri Aug 01, 2014 10:48 pm

The properties issue is just not going to vanish in an EU context. No matter what derogations anyone gives. It is too fundamental to be politically manipulated and the EU are careful about setting precedents that might backfire on them in the future.

Then there is the other side of the coin. GCs are being led to assume that there will be a a Quid Pro Quo. Those losing properties in the north will be compensated from TC properties in the south. Well, think again! Eroglu last year proposed a joint Property Development Corporation to develop TC properties in the south.

In other words the GCs lost their properties because one of the "new realities" we must recognise in Cyprus is the "nationalisation" of GC land in the north, therefore those GC properties are deemed irretrievable. However, the GCs had the naivete to create the Office of Trustee for TC properties, and this somehow retained the rights of TCs to their properties in the south to the extent that they are not subject to a property exchange. Like they say, no good deed goes unpunished!

If you do not believe it check up on Eroglu's statements regarding properties from the last couple of years.

The amazing thing is that he said with a straight face. The guy deserves an Oscar for comedy.
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Re: GC Leader storms out of meeting.

Postby Viewpoint » Fri Aug 01, 2014 11:32 pm

Oceanside Why do you not lead by example we have property in the South we cannot get back until there is a solution.

Please explain how it is that you consider our demands apathied give exact examples.
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