Cyprus-Forum.com

[Sotos]

We have been Greeks long before you invaded us. Turks occupied Cyprus just like they occupied Crete and Athens and any other territory which was the homeland of Greeks. Trying to force people to abandon their ethnic identity should be classified as a crime. It is what the Turks tried to do to the Kurds also. It is not my fault that we Greeks are foreign to you - your ancestors choose to invade an island inhabited by Greeks and bring their settlers here, how is that our fault? I have no problem to respect every singe human right of yours as long as you respect ours, and also minority rights as they are applied elsewhere. But you don't get to tell to me what my identity should be, neither our identity can be an excuse for you to deny to Cyprus its freedom and democracy. It doesn't mean that because we are of different ethnicities that we can't live peacefully together in a normal democracy. And realistically you can't get rid of the Greek and Turkish identities anyway... so even discussing it is pointless. Your case and the case of some others in here who were raised abroad is an exception... you are nothing like most Cypriots.

[erolz66]

...it would not surprise me if erolz would agree, ...

For me RW any settlement that meant that GC could never decide to give away my country to a foreign nation without agreement from my community to do so would be OK with me. Bi communal, not bi communal, bi zonal, multi zonal not zonal at all, federal, unitary, con federal, separate constituencies - as simple or as complex as you like as long as it recognises my (communities) RIGHT to not have my homeland given away to a foreign power against my will, I am willing to accept it. For the likes of Sotos this is just an example of 'my fanatical support for the Turkish side' I suppose.

[Sotos]

...it would not surprise me if erolz would agree, ...

For me RW any settlement that meant that GC could never decide to give away my country to a foreign nation without agreement from my community to do so would be OK with me. Bi communal, not bi communal, bi zonal, multi zonal not zonal at all, federal, unitary, con federal, separate constituencies - as simple or as complex as you like as long as it recognises my (communities) RIGHT to not have my homeland given away to a foreign power against my will, I am willing to accept it. For the likes of Sotos this is just an example of 'my fanatical support for the Turkish side' I suppose.

My problem in what you say is that you define Greece as "foreign nation" to our "homeland". Please talk for yourself. I have no problem if you say "foreign nation to me", or "foreign nation to my community", but you can't speak for the whole Cyprus because most Cypriots are ethnically Greek and therefore other Greeks are not seen as being foreign to us (at least not in the same way that an English or Russian is foreign). Most Cypriots do not want enosis anymore anyway so if that was all you were asking then a solution would be easy. But what the Turkish side demands is basically partition in a slightly different form.

[Get Real!]

My problem in what you say is that you define Greece as "foreign nation" to our "homeland". Please talk for yourself. I have no problem if you say "foreign nation to me", or "foreign nation to my community", but you can't speak for the whole Cyprus because most Cypriots are ethnically Greek and therefore other Greeks are not seen as being foreign to us

Problem is nobody’s buying your “ethnic Greek” shit so it looks like you’re stuck.

You’ve driven yourself into a dead end where there is no return so I don’t know what the hell you’re even posting anymore!

Emangoses mes des malakies tsie enneshi bou na bais tora...

[Get Real!]

Sotos used to read at school about Ektoras, and Ahilleas, and Persefoni, and Agamemnon, and all that horseshit which is now going around in circles in his brain because he so wanted to be a Greek God or Greek hero as described in the Greek history books that he took those stories to heart and now simply cannot accept that he’s not part of that golden age or at least its continuation!

He often marches up and down his garden dressed in a white tunic and olive branch on his head and recites Electra!

[erolz66]

My problem in what you say is that you define Greece as "foreign nation" to our "homeland". Please talk for yourself.

Who the fuck else do you think I am speaking for ? In any case from the minute Cyprus became an independent nation, Greece became by definition a foreign nation to it.

I have no problem if you say "foreign nation to me", or "foreign nation to my community",

Well whoop de fucking do - how gracious of you that you have no problem with me as a Cypriot and a TC claiming Greece is a foreign nation to me and my community. Am I supposed to thank you for this 'largess' on your part ?

Most Cypriots do not want enosis anymore anyway so if that was all you were asking then a solution would be easy.

You STILL do not get it do you ? I do not know if it is stupidity, obstinacy, denial or some combination or if you are just winding me up. The single simple thing I want is for you to accept that I had and have the RIGHT to not have my homeland and country given away to and ruled from and by (what is to me) a foreign nation against my will. If you had of been able to accept this then, then we would not be in the mess we are today. Yet even today it is not something you (personally) are willing to accept. Having it as a 'gift' is not good enough, being told 'do not worry about it we don't want it any more' is not good enough.

[Get Real!]

Truth be told… unless these brain-damaged generations age, die out, and fuck off from the planet there cannot be any progress for Cyprus.

Oi okka en tetrakoshia!

[boomerang]

these fools speak of Greece as a homeland when it suits them, then turn around and speak of Greece as different country when it suits them...very inconsistent...

[boulio]

if you were TC Boulio or if the numbers were reversed do you think YOUR views would be the same as they are today ?

im not a tc you are so what would your views be if the tc were 82% of the population?

Boulio you ask me a question and I give you an honest answer and ask you to answer the same question you asked me and all you do is refuse to answer the question you asked me and ask me the same question again. Seriously is this your idea of debate because it certainly is not mine. To me it feels you have a sole objective of trying to 'trap' me and no interest in better mutual understanding through discussion.

Anyway to answer your question AGAIN, if TC were 80% of the population of Cyprus and they sought at then end of British colonial rule not an independent Cyprus that included GC in it but instead to replace British colonial rule with that of Turkish colonial rule I would like to think that I would oppose such and support independence and not annexation after British rule. If in the face of calls by a majority TC population for annexation of Cyprus to Turkey I would like to think I would accept or at least be able to hear an argument from GC that as far as we choose to define ourselves not as Cypriots that could include GC with us but instead as Turks who happen to live in Cyprus then GC have a right as people in their own homeland who are not Turks to an equal and separate right to self determination. I say 'like to think' because I am trying to be as honest as I can and I can not really know if this would be the case or not.

So now will you answer your own question that you have badgered me to answer ? If TC were 80% of the population and sought to replace British colonial rule with annexing Cyprus to Turkey without any consideration for the wishes of GC, would you argue that they had a democratic right to do so and that the 18% GC minority had no right in their own shared homeland to resist such being imposed on them against their communal will ?

I'm not trying to trap you at all I know the answer already and all the rest is just window dressing,and by the way if a territory with a overwhelming majority wants to join a other entity I don't blame them as long as the minority in that territory has certain autonomous provisions and their rights as humans and citizens of that country are respected.

[Sotos]

My problem in what you say is that you define Greece as "foreign nation" to our "homeland". Please talk for yourself.

Who the fuck else do you think I am speaking for ? In any case from the minute Cyprus became an independent nation, Greece became by definition a foreign nation to it.

I have no problem if you say "foreign nation to me", or "foreign nation to my community",

Well whoop de fucking do - how gracious of you that you have no problem with me as a Cypriot and a TC claiming Greece is a foreign nation to me and my community. Am I supposed to thank you for this 'largess' on your part ?

Most Cypriots do not want enosis anymore anyway so if that was all you were asking then a solution would be easy.

You STILL do not get it do you ? I do not know if it is stupidity, obstinacy, denial or some combination or if you are just winding me up. The single simple thing I want is for you to accept that I had and have the RIGHT to not have my homeland and country given away to and ruled from and by (what is to me) a foreign nation against my will. If you had of been able to accept this then, then we would not be in the mess we are today. Yet even today it is not something you (personally) are willing to accept. Having it as a 'gift' is not good enough, being told 'do not worry about it we don't want it any more' is not good enough.

The mess we are today is created because of your constant invasions against my island and your refusal to ever let the Cypriot people free to take decisions for their own island in a peacefully democratic way. The alternative in taking decisions peacefully and democratically is trying to impose them by force... and this was your choice, not ours. As a minority you had the right for your human rights and maybe some minority rights but you had no right to determine on your own and against the majority about where Cyprus should and shouldn't belong. This was a COMPROMISE from our part, and it is a compromise we made in 1960 and it is only AFTER the 1960 agreements that your community had this legal right... not as a result of some international law that applies universally to all minorities but as a result of the specific agreements we signed in 1960. Now the question is why isn't this good enough for you? You have the legal right as you want it, and the majority of GCs don't even want enosis anymore anyway. So whats the problem with you? It is clear that you are not interested about a solution and the future, but you are just trying to find excuses to justify your crimes.