Nikitas wrote: However, the present attitude of Turkey, as it is expressed everyday, at every opportunity, in every type of international forum, is to deny the existence of RoC.
It denies the legitimacy of a RoC government that is not based on the 1960's agreements that founded it.
Nikitas wrote:Today any TC can walk south and claim the benefits of his citizenship in the RoC. Can a GC claim any such benefits if he was born in the territory now occupied by the TRNC? The answer is no and the criteria applied in the denial are purely racial.
The RoC of claims to represent all Cypriots and it's international recognition as the sole legitimate government of all of Cyprus and all Cypriots is dependent on this. The TRNC has never claimed to represent all Cypriots and it has no international recognition either. Yes it's criteria for citizenship are raced based to a large degree, though not totally. However actually this is not that different from the citizenship criteria of any state in many ways, maybe different by degree but not by principal.
Nikitas wrote:So when we compare what was, it is useful to cross check with what is, and how each community and each side has behaved since 1974 and not limit it to the 50s and 60s.
I do not seek to only speak of events pre 74, but I do think you can not understand events post 74 without understanding pre 74.
Nikitas wrote:If Enosis had happened the TCs would have been relegated to second class citizens, probably, though by no means certainly.
My personal view is that enosis had of happened then GC would have effectively been relegated to 2nd class citizens to some degree and TC to third class to some degree.
Nikitas wrote:Judging by what actually happened in the north since 1974 it is equally probable that if Turkey ever takes over the whole island it will erase the GCs, and in my book erasure is kind of worse than second class status.
Firstly I do not think Turkey has any serious ambition to take over the whole Island but who knows I may be wrong. I also think you are being a little hysterical and kind of insulting to GC in your assertion that had Turkey taken control of all of Cyprus or should it do so in the future GC would be 'erased'. Despite Turkey taking control of the north since 74, TC have not been erased. Yes our numbers have been 'diluted' (and we could argue till the cows come home how much and I am not even sure anyone really actually knows in any case) but it is also true that TC retain dominate control of the internal political life of northern cyprus as well as a large degree of its economic life and is social / cultural life. Turkish mainland settlers are, not entirely but predominantly 'second class' citizens in the north vs TC. I think the status of the GC community in Cyprus, that has withstood foreign rule for centuries (including as Sotos never fails to point out 400 odd of Ottoman rule), under Turkish rule since 74 or today would not in fact be 'erasure'. It would probably be similar to that of Kurds in Turkey. Not great but not 'erasure' either.
Nikitas wrote:The other point is that the GC insistence on maintaining the RoC flies in the face of any idea that they still want Enosis. For that reason alone you would think that Turkey would not be so antagonistic and hostile to the existence of the RoC. The fact that it is leads to the inference that it is hostile to any non Turkish presence on the island.
I do not think that today there is any substantial desire for enosis in the south. However the point I have been trying to get across to Sotos is I do fear there is still substantial support for the 'philosophy' behind it - namely that GC acting purely in their perceived self interest as GC have a RIGHT to impose anything they like on the TC community against their will simply because they the numerical larger community (or because they are the 'true cyriots' and we are not).
Whilst I accept the desire for enosis in the South is today not a serious concern I do also think it is , whilst unlikely, not beyond the realms of possibility that the world will 'turn' and there could be a resurgence of Greek nationalism that spreads to Cyprus and rekindles a desire for a 'Greater Greece' encompassing all Greek speaking people and territories. Unlike but not impossible to imagine in my opinion. The RoC in its current form and in its form essentially since 1965 does not represent a protection for either TC or Turkey for that matter against enosis or some possible future variant of it. It was the 'rights' the TC community had under the 60's agreements that were illegal removed that were such 'protection' and it will be some variant of those that will represent it in any future settlement, so to say you do not understand why Turkey is so antagonistic to the RoC as it currently exists because it 'protects' against enosis misses the point entirely.
Let me also say I understand GC fears concerning Turkey, its behaviour and its intentions. You have every reason to have such fears and concerns. I do not deny that. Turkey is not and easy neighbour to have. However as Cypriots I believe we need to recognise the facts of physical geography and power politics in the real world. Cyprus IS only 50km off the coast of Turkey and it and who controls it will ALWAYS be of strategic importance to Turkey (just ask a Cuban about being 80km of the coast of a more powerful and antagonistic neighbour). This to me is one of the most frustrating aspects of our failure as Cypriots to have ever built any real Cypriot unity between the GC and TC communities. The TC community could have been (and could potentially still be) the best and easiest means of Cypriots managing and dealing with its physical proximity to Turkey. The truth is that Turkey's position in in north Cyprus is extremely precarious. I absolutely believe that it could maintain its presence in the North for long were TC to stand up and say clearly and consistently - we do not want you in Cyprus. What people like Sotos (and I fear significant numbers of others) seem unable to understand is that his insistence that we had and have no right at all to resist the imposition of something like enosis on us in our homeland against our will plays such a massive part in what prevents us from be willing or able to do that. They prefer to say and think, probably to avoid cognitive dissonance, that is because we are (ethnically) thieves, greed, invaders, oppressors and the like. That is the frustration. As a TC I would be prepared to stand up and say clearly and consistently we no longer want Turkish presence in Cyprus but not while the alternative that is offered to me is essentially the state of affairs that we lived in Cyprus under from 63-74, which is what Sotos proposes once you strip away all the BS as far as I am concerned.
