Cyprus-Forum.com

[Get Real!]

GR, you are an idiot living in the wonderland... you imagine thinks and then you convince yourself that they are real The Greeks came to Cyprus in the exact same way as they went to all other Greek islands. Now tell me what is your "Cypriot culture" which is so different from Greek culture... and which links you to those prehistoric people you talk about. Clue: The Chirokitians didn't make Halloumi Also tell me what is your non-Greek Cypriot language. And write me your national anthem. There was never such thing as Cypriot ethnicity. The prehistoric people you talk about were different people who came from different places... some of them might have been from middle east, others maybe blacks from Africa...nobody knows exactly, and we have nothing in common with their culture or language. The majority of the people in Cyprus are Greek and this is even written in our constitution:

http://www.presidency.gov.cy/presidency/presidency.nsf/all/1003AEDD83EED9C7C225756F0023C6AD/$file/CY_Constitution.pdf?openelement

Article 1
The State of Cyprus is an independent and sovereign Republic with a
presidential regime, the President being Greek and the Vice-President
being Turk elected by the Greek and the Turkish Communities of
Cyprus respectively as hereinafter in this Constitution provided.

Article 2.1
the Greek Community comprises all citizens of the Republic who are
of Greek origin and whose mother tongue is Greek or who share the
Greek cultural traditions or who are members of the Greek-Orthodox
Church;

Enough said

King of fools,

Why don’t you remind us who conceived, wrote up, and signed these preposterous documents, and why Cyprus is in perpetual quagmire!

If not because they REMOVED the natural Cypriot ethnicity and created a dual foreign pseudo-Cypriot existence!

Brainless people like you are in abundance and that’s why they keep getting away with catastrophic crimes against our country like this!

[erolz66]

Careful GR - keep up like this and I will soon be proposing you stand as candidate for Euro MP so I can vote for you

[Sotos]

GR, you are an idiot living in the wonderland... you imagine thinks and then you convince yourself that they are real The Greeks came to Cyprus in the exact same way as they went to all other Greek islands. Now tell me what is your "Cypriot culture" which is so different from Greek culture... and which links you to those prehistoric people you talk about. Clue: The Chirokitians didn't make Halloumi Also tell me what is your non-Greek Cypriot language. And write me your national anthem. There was never such thing as Cypriot ethnicity. The prehistoric people you talk about were different people who came from different places... some of them might have been from middle east, others maybe blacks from Africa...nobody knows exactly, and we have nothing in common with their culture or language. The majority of the people in Cyprus are Greek and this is even written in our constitution:

http://www.presidency.gov.cy/presidency/presidency.nsf/all/1003AEDD83EED9C7C225756F0023C6AD/$file/CY_Constitution.pdf?openelement

Article 1
The State of Cyprus is an independent and sovereign Republic with a
presidential regime, the President being Greek and the Vice-President
being Turk elected by the Greek and the Turkish Communities of
Cyprus respectively as hereinafter in this Constitution provided.

Article 2.1
the Greek Community comprises all citizens of the Republic who are
of Greek origin and whose mother tongue is Greek or who share the
Greek cultural traditions or who are members of the Greek-Orthodox
Church;

Enough said

King of fools,

Why don’t you remind us who conceived, wrote up, and signed these preposterous documents, and why Cyprus is in perpetual quagmire!

If not because they REMOVED the natural Cypriot ethnicity and created a dual foreign pseudo-Cypriot existence!

Brainless people like you are in abundance and that’s why they keep getting away with catastrophic crimes against our country like this!

You can't remove something which never existed you idiot. There was never such thing as a "Cypriot Ethnicity"... Snap out of your fantasies! Who conceived and wrote up those documents were the British... if it was up to the Cypriots then Cyprus would be part of Greece like all other Greek islands. Just because the British forced some so called independence in Cyprus this action didn't change our ethnicity.

[Sotos]

Careful GR - keep up like this and I will soon be proposing you stand as candidate for Euro MP so I can vote for you

Really? I might disagree with GR on the identity issue but practically what me and him want is not very different. For example I wouldn't mind at all for the constitution to be rewritten and to remove every reference of Greek and Turk from it because I don't have anything to gain from such labels. You are the ones who want to divide everything along ethnic lines. The ONLY reason that you like what GR says is because you believe that what he says gives to you an excuse for your crimes in Cyprus... not because you ever wanted or you will ever want such a single Cypriot ethnicity to exist. Which is why you will fight against every step that could abolish divisions and discrimination ... which brings us back to the topic of this thread!

[erolz66]

Really? I might disagree with GR on the identity issue but practically what me and him want is not very different. For example I wouldn't mind at all for the constitution to be rewritten and to remove every reference of Greek and Turk from it because I don't have anything to gain from such labels. You are the ones who want to divide everything along ethnic lines. The ONLY reason that you like what GR says is because you believe that what he says gives to you an excuse for your crimes in Cyprus... not because you ever wanted or you will ever want such a single Cypriot ethnicity to exist. Which is why you will fight against every step that could abolish divisions and discrimination ... which brings us back to the topic of this thread!

No GR really believes that we should all just consider ourselves Cypriot and nothing else. As long as I believe that to be true of him I am happy to say yeah ok. You on the other hand would be happy to remove all reference to Greek and Turkish from the constitution because you believe doing so would allow your community to dominate Cyprus not as a Cypriot but as a Greek Cypriot. I believe that GR as a Cypriot would never try and advocate the handing of Cyprus over to foreign Greek rule, where as I believe you would try to do such just as you have done in the past. You may think that your differences are 'slight' but actually they are fundamental. This is nothing to do with excusing crimes. Unlike you I have never denied 'my sides' crimes, all I do is vociferously refute your constant denial of your sides crimes and your attempts to assign crimes to my side that are just not true. I would give up my 'turkishness' tomorrow if I believed you had given up your 'greekness', but you have not and nor do I think you are even capable of doing such.

[repulsewarrior]

erolz, to realise this dream, to be, a Turkish Cypriot, a Greek Cypriot must exist. i ask you again, calm yourself and understand this, you can say it too, i love Cyprus first, and act accordingly. yes or no, wouldn't you agree that it would solve our Problem if we were willing to meet as Constituencies, before resolving to reform the Constitution of our State?

wow, i was waiting for erolz's reply, but i guess i just got it, what is yours, sotos; Cypriot before Greek?

[erolz66]

wow, i was waiting for erolz's reply, but i guess i just got it, what is yours, sotos; Cypriot before Greek?

No RW you misunderstand. Not Cypriot before Turkish but Cypriot INSTEAD of Turkish. I actually trust GR, who renounces any Greekness in favour of just Cypriot. You I do not trust for whilst you talk about Cypriot before Turk / Greek, you also constantly support classic GC propaganda versions of history, ignore excesses of the extremist GC here whilst haranguing the TC here. In short you talk of Cypriot ahead of Greek but you do not ACT in a manner consistent with such talk. Just Cypriot and only Cypriot with GR, yeah I could go for that. Unitary Cyprus with you, with all your talk of 'constituencies' and Cypriot flags higher than Greek and Turkish ones, whilst you actually act like GC no different in essence from Sotos and B25 ? No sorry does not get my vote.

[Sotos]

Really? I might disagree with GR on the identity issue but practically what me and him want is not very different. For example I wouldn't mind at all for the constitution to be rewritten and to remove every reference of Greek and Turk from it because I don't have anything to gain from such labels. You are the ones who want to divide everything along ethnic lines. The ONLY reason that you like what GR says is because you believe that what he says gives to you an excuse for your crimes in Cyprus... not because you ever wanted or you will ever want such a single Cypriot ethnicity to exist. Which is why you will fight against every step that could abolish divisions and discrimination ... which brings us back to the topic of this thread!

No GR really believes that we should all just consider ourselves Cypriot and nothing else. As long as I believe that to be true of him I am happy to say yeah ok. You on the other hand would be happy to remove all reference to Greek and Turkish from the constitution because you believe doing so would allow your community to dominate Cyprus not as a Cypriot but as a Greek Cypriot. I believe that GR as a Cypriot would never try and advocate the handing of Cyprus over to foreign Greek rule, where as I believe you would try to do such just as you have done in the past. You may think that your differences are 'slight' but actually they are fundamental. This is nothing to do with excusing crimes. Unlike you I have never denied 'my sides' crimes, all I do is vociferously refute your constant denial of your sides crimes and your attempts to assign crimes to my side that are just not true. I would give up my 'turkishness' tomorrow if I believed you had given up your 'greekness', but you have not and nor do I think you are even capable of doing such.

We are Greek and you are Turk. For us enosis was not "foreign rule" but FREEDOM because in a Greek state we would be free and equal citizens which was never the case when Cyprus was under foreign rulers. Identity and ethnicity is not something that you can change like clothes... I feel like being Greek today, Monday sounds like a good day to be Cypriot, I will be Mexican next week for a change It is something which is created gradually when a group of people feels closer to each other than with anybody else and have common interests. Turks ruled Cyprus for the 300 out of the last 450 years and they discriminated against the native Christian Greek population treating us differently than their own Muslim Turkish people... we were officially divided from the beginning and for a long time. And of course the Ottomans didn't offer to us our freedom to show to us that we could be free as just Cypriots. The message was clear that to be free you have to fight, and for having any chance to win you obviously have to unite... if every Greek island and city fought separately for its freedom then none of them would be free today... Greece could be another Kurdistan. Creating a Cypriot identity and Cypriot ethnicity is something that would take time and for such thing to happen we need to have a Cypriot state that treats everybody as equals without discrimination. And we also need to feel that we can have our freedom on our own without the need to unite powers with other Greeks. If you wanted to create this Cypriot identity and eventually a Cypriot ethnicity then you would want to take the steps that would lead us to such result. But you are NOT sincere and you are just looking for excuses to increase the division between us because you gain from it.

[erolz66]

We are Greek and you are Turk.

No actually you are Greek and I am British and Cypriot. I have never considered myself Turkish. I do not speak Turkish, I am not muslim and none of my family currently or historically lived in Turkey, but in Cyprus and Britain. I think I may be having 'a road to Damascus' experience here. It is actually your very Greekness that forces me to define myself as TC and not just Cypriot.

For us enosis was not "foreign rule" but FREEDOM because in a Greek state we would be free and equal citizens

Which is exactly the point. If you were Cypriot this would never be the case. As you say so often to me, if you want to be Greek and have the freedom of living in a Greek state why not fuck off to Greece and leave Cyprus to the Cypriots ?

Identity and ethnicity is not something that you can change like clothes...

Why not ? The American patriots chose to be American and not English. Seemed to have worked for them.

[Sotos]

No actually you are Greek and I am British and Cypriot. I have never considered myself Turkish. I do not speak Turkish, I am not muslim and none of my family currently or historically lived in Turkey, but in Cyprus and Britain. I think I may be having 'a road to Damascus' experience here. It is actually your very Greekness that forces me to define myself as TC and not just Cypriot.

I was actually suspecting that you are like GR. Somebody who was raised abroad and never acquired any of the actual identities of Cyprus. You acquired a foreign identity... British in your case... plus some identity which created in your own imagination and not an actual identity that exists in Cyprus. That explains how you could supposedly drop your Turkish identity so easily ... because you never had this identity to begin with. In reality having a Cypriot identity totally replace Greek/Turkish is something that can take at least some decades and only in an environment that promotes this ... like I wrote above!

Which is exactly the point. If you were Cypriot this would never be the case. As you say so often to me, if you want to be Greek and have the freedom of living in a Greek state why not fuck off to Greece and leave Cyprus to the Cypriots ?

I am a real Cypriot. You personally are for the most part a foreigner... not a real TC! You are the last person on earth who can tell to somebody like me to "fuck off" from my own island!

Why not ? The American patriots chose to be American and not English. Seemed to have worked for them.

Yes it worked. But have you seen the size, population and vast resources of America. The colonists ... who btw are not native Americans... took all that for themselves. It suited them perfectly ... they had the power to have their freedom and also keep all those lands and resources just for themselves. Now compare that with Cyprus.