Cyprus-Forum.com

[Paphitis]

Anyway, there is a far greater issue at stake.

The Turks were also pissed off with Downer on several issues. However, the Turks seemed to operate behind the scenes and in diplomatic ways whenever they expressed their concerns.

The question is an important one! Why are the Turks smarter than us.

One commentator said that Turkish Diplomats are mostly Harvard educated and very Westernized. I am sure that is true, but are Cypriot Diplomats not similarly educated?

There must be something else. This could be costing us big time which is a real concern.

[Demonax]

Anyway, there is a far greater issue at stake.

The Turks were also pissed off with Downer on several issues. However, the Turks seemed to operate behind the scenes and in diplomatic ways whenever they expressed their concerns.

The question is an important one! Why are the Turks smarter than us.

One commentator said that Turkish Diplomats are mostly Harvard educated and very Westernized. I am sure that is true, but are Cypriot Diplomats not similarly educated?

There must be something else. This could be costing us big time which is a real concern.

You've got an inferiority complex, Paphitis. If the Turks are smarter than us please tell us why they haven't managed to persuade a single nation to back their policy on Cyprus? Or why our diplomats managed to secure EU entry and continue to thwart Turkey's ambitions both through the EU and the UN?

Please explain the joint communique which was drafted by us and includes most of our red lines and none of Turkey's and has been adopted by the international community?

Just who are these smart Turkish diplomats you refer to? Bagis and Davutoglu?

And if Turkish diplomacy is so bloody clever, as you claim, please tell us which diplomatic triumphs Turkey has enjoyed in the last ten years? Starting with Syria...

[Paphitis]

Anyway, there is a far greater issue at stake.

The Turks were also pissed off with Downer on several issues. However, the Turks seemed to operate behind the scenes and in diplomatic ways whenever they expressed their concerns.

The question is an important one! Why are the Turks smarter than us.

One commentator said that Turkish Diplomats are mostly Harvard educated and very Westernized. I am sure that is true, but are Cypriot Diplomats not similarly educated?

There must be something else. This could be costing us big time which is a real concern.

You've got an inferiority complex, Paphitis. If the Turks are smarter than us please tell us why they haven't managed to persuade a single nation to back their policy on Cyprus? Or why our diplomats managed to secure EU entry and continue to thwart Turkey's ambitions both through the EU and the UN?

Please explain the joint communique which was drafted by us and includes most of our red lines and none of Turkey's and has been adopted by the international community?

Just who are these smart Turkish diplomats you refer to? Bagis and Davutoglu?

And if Turkish diplomacy is so bloody clever, as you claim, please tell us which diplomatic triumphs Turkey has enjoyed in the last ten years? Starting with Syria...

They can't persuade the international community because the law is not on their side! Simply put, International Recognition of a self declared "Republic" on occupied and sovereign RoC land that is internationally recognized as the RoC is simply not possible.

However, they do operate and conduct themselves quite well internationally. This has allowed them to dictate the agenda and the terms somewhat, whilst our lot can't even see past their own noses!

DIKO are against the Joint Communique! Now if it was so good, why is DIKO threatening to leave the coalition RoC Government?

And if it is so good as you say, then Downer played a part surely!

Personally, I am undecided about the Joint Declaration because there is robust opposition from DIKO. Therefore, I need to analyze the terminology used. A clear defining set of parameters must be included which defines the 2 equal states forming a solid Federation with a single sovereignty.

[Paphitis]

But maybe we do have some kind of inferiority complex.

Maybe that is the reason why we always seem to lash out or think the world is against us!

Personally, I think this is a big issue as it has the potential to cause damage to the RoC.

Take Downer for instance. I believe that Anastasiades' letter to Ban Ki Moon was not a great idea in the public domain. It is not constructive for Anastasiades or the RoC. Now, Downer it would seem will become Australia's Ambassador to the US and that is not a good thing if there is any bad blood between him and Anastasiades.

I will not be alarmist because fortunately, I don't think Downer would compromise the RoC. He genuinely feels very attached to the Cypriot People now because he practically lived in Cyprus for nearly 6 years and in that time, the island and its people have grown on him somewhat.

[bill cobbett]

Well there's no way the Republic could match Turkey's mega-millions of spending on the Washington Lobby. Several US lobbying firms are engaged by Turkey, operating under the guise of American-Turkish friendship groups.
... and such spending is what can get results in Washington.

Against that we have to acknowledge the contribution of the American Greek lobby... a very well organised and influential group.

Also acting against that Turkish PR in Washington has come a convergence of chance circumstances that has prob finally urged the USA to act to resolve CY and other regional problems. Things like the CY and Israel Gas, the falling out between Israel and Turkey, reports of AlQuaeda operating in Syria and indeed inside Turkey, ambitious moves by Russia in the Eastern Med, the internal strife and deterioration of human rights in Turkey etc etc

[bill cobbett]

... but as for Mr Downer, wasn't he the victim of his own "good offices" , ever trying to be impartial, not taking sides, not wanting to offend anyone...???

Sometimes in diplomacy soft and cuddly gets you nowhere, you have to be prepared to knock heads together. The Americans have made a start on this.... and we'll see more of the same.

[Paphitis]

... but as for Mr Downer, wasn't he the victim of his own "good offices" , ever trying to be impartial, not taking sides, not wanting to offend anyone...???

Sometimes in diplomacy soft and cuddly gets you nowhere, you have to be prepared to knock heads together. The Americans have made a start on this.... and we'll see more of the same.

I think he did knock a few heads but I think the difference is that he knows the time and place and he also has enough sense to do it in the private domain because at the end of the day, egos and face saving are important to most if not all Diplomats around the globe.

There are some wikilieaks documents whereby he was venting some frustration privately to US Officials privately. I think they were emails or some such thing where he made it known exactly what his views are of the UN. He called them a toothless tiger.

Also, never heard Downer say a bad word about Christofias or Anastasiades, but privately he probably would have given both a good bollocking.

He's been doing diplomacy for a long time and he does mind his Ps and Qs! Probably why he will be appointed by Australia in one of the most plum jobs that exist in Foreign Affairs.

He also was played a huge role in militarily intervening into East Timor. Probably the most precise and successful military operations the world has scene in the 20th Century. Real text book stuff.

[Paphitis]

Well there's no way the Republic could match Turkey's mega-millions of spending on the Washington Lobby. Several US lobbying firms are engaged by Turkey, operating under the guise of American-Turkish friendship groups.
... and such spending is what can get results in Washington.

Against that we have to acknowledge the contribution of the American Greek lobby... a very well organised and influential group.

Also acting against that Turkish PR in Washington has come a convergence of chance circumstances that has prob finally urged the USA to act to resolve CY and other regional problems. Things like the CY and Israel Gas, the falling out between Israel and Turkey, reports of AlQuaeda operating in Syria and indeed inside Turkey, ambitious moves by Russia in the Eastern Med, the internal strife and deterioration of human rights in Turkey etc etc

Yes there seems to be some convergence between RoC and US interests at the moment thanks to the Cy and Israeli Gas.

The US is becoming more pro-active, which is probably why the Turks had no choice but to agree to a Joint Communique.

The Turks will always prod and push until the 11th hour and then bail when they realize it is fruitless.