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Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Maximus » Sat May 10, 2014 12:15 pm

Paphitis wrote:
What is evident to me is that all these maximalist claims will result in major roadblocks to a solution and in that time there will be thousands more settlers. It will only get worse.

Someone will have to pay off each settler and provide an inducement for them to return to Turkey on there own accord and there is no way Turkey will accept this liability so then it comes down to the RoC.


This is not a good enough reason to make the settlers Cypriot citizens.

If they lose their ill gotten gains, the looted GC property with a temporary work permit, then you give them some incentive to return but if you give them a Cypriot citizenship, then you make them the Cypriot governments problem.

Who is the maximalist?
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Paphitis » Sat May 10, 2014 1:18 pm

Maximus wrote:
Paphitis wrote:
What is evident to me is that all these maximalist claims will result in major roadblocks to a solution and in that time there will be thousands more settlers. It will only get worse.

Someone will have to pay off each settler and provide an inducement for them to return to Turkey on there own accord and there is no way Turkey will accept this liability so then it comes down to the RoC.


This is not a good enough reason to make the settlers Cypriot citizens.

If they lose their ill gotten gains, the looted GC property with a temporary work permit, then you give them some incentive to return but if you give them a Cypriot citizenship, then you make them the Cypriot governments problem.

Who is the maximalist?


I made no reference to GC owned property which would have to be returned to the rightful owners.

However, anyone born in Cyprus or married to a Cy citizen will become a permanent resident by default and eventually a Cy citizen.

Sener is no fool. He knows exactly how it is and so do I.
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Maximus » Sat May 10, 2014 1:50 pm

He contradicts himself but I do not think that is going to happen.

If he does get into the European Parliament, he will receive overwhelming opposition to his suggestions to make the majority of the settlers Cypriot citizens. That's all that will happen.
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Paphitis » Sat May 10, 2014 2:18 pm

Maximus wrote:He contradicts himself but I do not think that is going to happen.

If he does get into the European Parliament, he will receive overwhelming opposition to his suggestions to make the majority of the settlers Cypriot citizens. That's all that will happen.


Who said anything about the majority? Do you have any statistics as to how many were born in Cyprus and how many have married RoC citizens?

There is not a single sane person in the EU or UN who will challenge their right to stay and the RoC Government knows this.
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby bill cobbett » Sat May 10, 2014 2:21 pm

Well yes, there's no ref to numbers, let alone a "majority".

Anyways, Sener Levent has made clear his position on the matter of the Illegal Settlers, some can live it whilst others can't.

Below is an article which featured in Politis last Summer, one in which Levent questions the acquiescence in the current situation...

"... Şener Levent wants an uprising in divided Cyprus

With an eye to the protests in Turkey and Egypt, the Turkish Cypriot columnist Şener Levent laments in the liberal daily Politis that people on the divided island of Cyprus have not also started an insurrection:

"I sat in front of the television and watched the protests on Tahrir Square into the early morning.

What a rebellion! What a crowd! The Apocalypse is nigh! ...

Tahrir Square in Cairo and Taksim Square in Istanbul are in a state of vibrancy. Why does nothing happen here? Where is our Tahrir Square, our Taksim Square?
Or do we have no reason to rebel?

How can a people whose homeland has been divided for 40 years remain so calm?

The people sit in front of their televisions and watch the rebellions in other countries. As if we had no real problems, no reason to react the same way.

There are as many protesters on Tahrir Square as Cyprus has residents. If a tenth of the Cypriot population were to gather and march in the direction of Famagusta [in Turkish-occupied "Northern" Cyprus], the walls would soon be falling here at home." ..."
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Maximus » Sat May 10, 2014 2:33 pm

bill cobbett wrote:Well yes, there's no ref to numbers, let alone a "majority".

Anyways, Sener Levent has made clear his position on the matter of the Illegal Settlers, some can live it whilst others can't.

Below is an article which featured in Politis last Summer, one in which Levent questions the acquiescence in the current situation...

"... Şener Levent wants an uprising in divided Cyprus

With an eye to the protests in Turkey and Egypt, the Turkish Cypriot columnist Şener Levent laments in the liberal daily Politis that people on the divided island of Cyprus have not also started an insurrection:

"I sat in front of the television and watched the protests on Tahrir Square into the early morning.

What a rebellion! What a crowd! The Apocalypse is nigh! ...

Tahrir Square in Cairo and Taksim Square in Istanbul are in a state of vibrancy. Why does nothing happen here? Where is our Tahrir Square, our Taksim Square?
Or do we have no reason to rebel?

How can a people whose homeland has been divided for 40 years remain so calm?

The people sit in front of their televisions and watch the rebellions in other countries. As if we had no real problems, no reason to react the same way.

There are as many protesters on Tahrir Square as Cyprus has residents. If a tenth of the Cypriot population were to gather and march in the direction of Famagusta [in Turkish-occupied "Northern" Cyprus], the walls would soon be falling here at home." ..."


Doing such a thing in Cyprus would be a sure way to start a war with Turkey and their fanatics north of the Green line. There is a lot of them, like these "new Cypriots" he thinks are Cypriots.

On the other hand, it would separate the weat from the chaff.
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Maximus » Sat May 10, 2014 2:50 pm

Paphitis wrote:
Maximus wrote:He contradicts himself but I do not think that is going to happen.

If he does get into the European Parliament, he will receive overwhelming opposition to his suggestions to make the majority of the settlers Cypriot citizens. That's all that will happen.


Who said anything about the majority? Do you have any statistics as to how many were born in Cyprus and how many have married RoC citizens?

There is not a single sane person in the EU or UN who will challenge their right to stay and the RoC Government knows this.


Is their right to stay compatible with the EU aquis?

Please show me a law that says they are legally entitled and have a right to stay AND where the RoC government has acknowledged and knows this....
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby Maximus » Sat May 10, 2014 2:59 pm

Pay attention. Levent is not talking about the law, he is talking about their right to stay under political expediency.

This is what Turkey wants, to change the demographics of the island, now, with your help.
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby GreekIslandGirl » Sat May 10, 2014 3:08 pm

Changing the demographics of the island is EXACTLY what Turkey has wanted to do since Britain brought her into the equation early in the 1950s.

There is nothing admirable about legalising these crimes and capitulating on the criminality forced on Cyprus - yet again.

We have to strive for the best, if that is what the scaremongers are referring to as "maximalist". That is the ONLY way societies improve!

This TC politician is yet another seeking to continue the cycle of suppression of Cyprus!

Strive for the best! Do not support those who wish to fill our country with tools of criminals by offering them Cypriot citizenship.
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Re: Vote for Sener Levent ... !!!

Postby CopperLine » Sat May 10, 2014 3:22 pm

Let's look at the proposal like this : divide up all those who might make a claim to citizenship into different categories. Different people on this forum will have tolerance or intolerance for different categories and that will give shape to the particular kind of settlement possible and acceptable to different groups.

Category A* : all those people, born before 1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents who were both also citizens of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus throughout their lives.

Category B* : all those people, born before 1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents who were BOTH also citizens of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus for at least five** years.

Category C* : all those people, born before 1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents ONE of whom was also citizen of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus for at least the last five** years.

* Where Cyprus refers to pre-1974
** Different durations would yield different implications.


Category D^ : all those people, born post-1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents who were both also citizens of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus throughout their lives.

Category E^ : all those people, born post-1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents who were both also citizens of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus for the majority of their lives.

Category F^ : all those people, born post-1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents who were both also citizens of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus for at least the last five** years.

Category G^ : all those people, born post-1974, who were born in Cyprus AND who were born to parents ONE of whom was also a citizen of Cyprus, AND have been resident in Cyprus for at least the last five** years.

^ Where Cyprus refers to both south/RoC and north
** Different durations would yield different implications.


Category H : all those people, regardless of age, who were born outside of Cyprus AND both of whose parents was born in Cyprus before 1974.

Category I : all those people, regardless of age, who were born outside of Cyprus AND ONE of whose parents was born in Cyprus before 1974.

Category J : all those people, regardless of age, who were born outside of Cyprus and NEITHER of whose parents was born in Cyprus AND have CITIZENSHIP in Cyprus^^ for at least five** years.

Category K : all those people, regardless of age, who were born outside of Cyprus and NEITHER of whose parents was born in Cyprus AND have been RESIDENT in Cyprus for at least five** years.

^^ Cyprus meaning here both south/RoC and north.
** Different durations would yield different implications.


Basically maximalists will not likely accept any category other than Category A and D (possibly Category H), but many wouldn't accept even these categories for Turkish Cypriots. By contrast those keenest for a settlement will more likely accept more categories for citizenship down the list, even categories J and K which are essentially what people refer to as 'settlers'. By the way categories J and K would also cover the thousands of British and other European or Russian, etc, who have retired to or otherwise settled in Cyprus, as well as covering the usual Turkish settlers.

With a bit of research once could put numbers to these eleven categories. Thus I suspect that categories F, G, H, and I might be the largest categories - covering all those London Cypriots and Sydney/Melbourne Cypriots - i.e, the second/third generation Cypriot diaspora. Also each of these categories could be subdivided further, producing different and possibly significant nuances. For me, I'd consider everything up to and including Category K because I think a settlement based on unification is essential for all Cypriots, and better an imperfect settlement than another forty/fifty years of idiocy.
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