Cyprus-Forum.com

[repulsewarrior]

No wonder why this thread is much longer than the other fake one. Just like our brothers in Bosnia, we won't forget.

So how is it you have “brothers” in Bosnia?

The Ottomans were like the cuckoo which lays its eggs in other bird’s nests in the hope that the mother will raise the chick as her own. But this conniving bird’s exploitation doesn’t just stop there because the cuckoo being a physically larger chick than that of the chosen host, will also assassinate the genuine chick by pushing it off the nest at the first opportunity.

The cuckoo’s deceptive criminal act bears a striking resemblance to the behavior of the Ottomans who would leave a Muslim minority behind in countries they had previously invaded and occupied, which explains why you’ll find Ottoman remnants in places like Bosnia, Bulgaria, and Cyprus just to name a few.

Those incompatible Ottoman remnant minorities would then exploit 20th century western humanitarian laws by crying foul at the slightest attempts to streamline them into the greater population and would become the root of enormous strife in their respective victim countries including Cyprus!

...well said GR, and even in Turkey itself, this is true. the State is denied, because as Nations "they" can control the Agenda.

[bigOz]

No wonder why this thread is much longer than the other fake one. Just like our brothers in Bosnia, we won't forget.

So how is it you have “brothers” in Bosnia?

The Ottomans were like the cuckoo which lays its eggs in other bird’s nests in the hope that the mother will raise the chick as her own. But this conniving bird’s exploitation doesn’t just stop there because the cuckoo being a physically larger chick than that of the chosen host, will also assassinate the genuine chick by pushing it off the nest at the first opportunity.

The cuckoo’s deceptive criminal act bears a striking resemblance to the behavior of the Ottomans who would leave a Muslim minority behind in countries they had previously invaded and occupied, which explains why you’ll find Ottoman remnants in places like Bosnia, Bulgaria, and Cyprus just to name a few.

Those incompatible Ottoman remnant minorities would then exploit 20th century western humanitarian laws by crying foul at the slightest attempts to streamline them into the greater population and would become the root of enormous strife in their respective victim countries including Cyprus!

...well said GR, and even in Turkey itself, this is true. the State is denied, because as Nations "they" can control the Agenda.

Absolute rubbish! Balkans were invaded bu a variety of people including Turks from Asia before the Ottomans! Western Empires always tried to expand their domain and religion by invading them - hence I have no clue what your scattered point is!

More importantly, your argument sounds like you support genocide as a justifiable act just because they were Ottoman remnants and not Italian, French or English! What do you exactly mean by "crying foul at the slightest attempts to streamline them" - does that mean the Serbians were justified in doing what they did to Bosnian people? A simple "Yes" or "No" would do Get Real - and remember these acts were recognised "Human Crimes" by the rest of Europe!

Furthermore, there are millions of ethnic Turks living in the Balkans and in Russia, if a Turk considers them to be "brothers" it's their prerogative. As for Bulgaria, they are so many that, do not be surprised if they take over the government of your long time ally Bulgars! (Quite a few are already members of the parliament)

Shall we now return to the topic of this thread and its contents without further distraction/deviation? Justify your long lost leaders, your priests' and European press reports that favoured the Turkish invasion, rather than call it unjustified It is your kind of foolish mentality that brought down the might of Turkey on your stupid heads - you carry on with the same mentality and see how far (or should I say back) it will get you

[Jerry]

It is your kind of foolish mentality that brought down the might of Turkey on your stupid heads

But that was the plan all along, wasn't it OZ. Provoke the Greek Cypriots, cry out "we are facing genocide" and wait for "the might of Turkey" to save us.

If the Greek Cypriots were not suitably enraged your masters gave them a helping hand “The false-flag operations successfully destabilized the island, and helped Turkey’s military objectives.” http://therearenosunglasses.wordpress.c ... e-flag-op/

You are sounding just like the carpetbaggers, they spout the same genocide crap in order to justify theft of our property. If you care to look beyond 1963-74 and outside the island you will see that YOU started it.

[DrCyprus]

Turkey is not mighty, just a regional bully.

[bigOz]

It is your kind of foolish mentality that brought down the might of Turkey on your stupid heads

But that was the plan all along, wasn't it OZ. Provoke the Greek Cypriots, cry out "we are facing genocide" and wait for "the might of Turkey" to save us.

If the Greek Cypriots were not suitably enraged your masters gave them a helping hand “The false-flag operations successfully destabilized the island, and helped Turkey’s military objectives.” http://therearenosunglasses.wordpress.c ... e-flag-op/

You are sounding just like the carpetbaggers, they spout the same genocide crap in order to justify theft of our property. If you care to look beyond 1963-74 and outside the island you will see that YOU started it.

I do not agree with your points above! To start with you clearly have not read the two long lists of factual statements made by sources other than Turkish such as European, and Greek press including Makarios and another priest of yours! For if you did, you would know that you have no grounds for any such claims.

Second point is, why look outside Cyprus? People can only be directed or lead to do wrong if they are suitable candidates for it! Greece, Europe and even the Greek Cypriots who constantly played the Turkish song "Bekledim de gelmedin" ("I waited but you never turned up") through loudspeakers during 1974 attacks or put up in big letters on top of the Military Camp in Famagusta "If you have the balls come and get it!", never in a million years believed Turkey would invade. This was clearly due to what that had been getting away with over the previous 11 years when Turkish villages and civilians were destroyed, murdered, and denied all their human rights. Turkey was helpless, except on one occasion when the Air force commander at the time (I believe "General Irfan Tansel"), refused the Turkish Prime Minister's and NATO instructions that the Air-force should not interfere. But when it became obvious that yet another ethnic cleansing / atrocity was about to tahe place in the hands of EOKA-B supported by the National Guard in Erenköy, he gave the order to bomb the shit out of the heavily armed 3000-4000 Greek/GC forces in the area (against ill armed 500-600 TC students and locals) together with all surrounding GC villages in the neighbourhood. That air Force General had to resign his post afterwards before he could be charged with "disobedience"!

However, Turkey's inability of not being able to interfere and being stopped by NATO every time, spoiled the GCs rotten and especially EOKA-B, who were now convinced Turkey could do Fluck all. That was the reason they dared to go for Enosis and not fear the Guarantor power Turkey in doing so - after all there were over 20,000 mainland Greek forces stationed illegally on the island backing them up!

What provocation and what pre-planned Turkish invasion are you talking about when Turkey suffered 5 years from being exempt from any military aid or arms sales by the USA after the invasion? When the whole of North Cyprus has been deprived of any direct travel, trade or recognition. Why did those who wanted and planned the invasion not complete the deal by recognising TRNC? They hated the GCs so much and wanted Turkey to invade so desperately why they decided to block any economic activity with EU and USA from North Cyprus - including not recognising its sea and airports! Anyone who comes up with conspiracy theories in the light of above and all the events listed in this thread is fit to be the Head Clown in a Russian Circus

Stop going on about any partition demands by TCs - the whole world knows they were in response to Enosis demands by the GCs - at least hey did not ask for "Union with Turkey" for the whole island. Finally even just these 5 statements including those by your "beloved" community leaders should disqualify your claims about other sources inviting and causing the Turkish Invasion READDD!

In a speech on 4th September 1962, at Panayia, Makarios actually said “Until this Turkish community forming part of the Turkish race which has been the terrible enemy of Hellenism is expelled, the duty of the heroes of EOKA can never be considered as terminated."

In his book "The Way the Wind Blows" former British Prime Minister, Sir Alec Douglas-Home said "I was convinced of the view that if Archbishop Makarios could not bring himself to treat the Turkish Cypriots as human beings he was inviting the invasion and partition of the island."

In an article on 28th February 1976 in the Greek Cypriot press Father Papatsestos said: It is a rather hard thing to say, but it is true that the Turkish intervention saved us from a merciless internecine war.The Sampson regime had prepared a list of all Makarios supporters, and they would have slaughtered them all."

On 12th March 1977 Makarios had declared "In the name of ENOSIS that Cyprus has been destroyed."

On Independence Day 1985 the Greek Cypriot Daily Simerini lamented as follows: "We believed that we are Tcentre of the Earth. We thought that we, small and insignificant as we are, would be capable of exercising policy on an intercontinental plane. But also above all we underestimated the Turks. The unstable and fickle policy of our leaders has brought us to the brink of total disaster."

Now cut the ballaks and accept the truth - your leaders flucked up! EOKA-B flucked up! GCs as part of Cyprus stood by and did nothing to stop the crimes against TCs BECAUSE THEIRS PRIESTS AT CHURCH TAUGHT YOU EVERY SUNDAY THAT A GOOD TURK IS A DEAD TURK... You will not convince anyone outside your little political circle in Cyprus or this forum that there was a major plan to by outside forces to have Turkey invade Cyprus.

ACCEPT the truth that the only conspiracy or plan made by an outsider was by Greece, in the form union with Greece, backed up by EOKA-B, resulting in the inevitable invasion by Turkiye who merely exercised their Guarantor rights one of the 3 Guarantor powers of the Republic. Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps that is the reason why no one on earth had or is exercising any sanctions or embargoes against Turkiye? On the contrary Turkey is blocking your vessels from entering any of her waters, and stopping your flights from crossing over its air-space! Now go in the bathroom and have a good scream!

[Jerry]

You just don’t get it do you Oz. All the events below preceded your claims, they clearly demonstrate Turkey’s determination to take Cyprus back and they did not care about the consequences for the Turkish Cypriots.

Quote from Kutchuk
“From a legal as well as moral point of view, Turkey, as the initial owner of the island just before the British occupation, has a first option to Cyprus. The matter does not end there. From a worldwide political point of view as well as from geographical and strategical points of view Cyprus must be handed to Turkey if Great Britain is going to quit.” http://web.archive.org/web/200609290506 ... k-1954.htm

Quote from Menderes
“In this respect, Cyprus is only an extension of the Turkish mainland, and it is one of the main pillars of Turkey's security. Consequently, should a change in its present status come into consideration, that change must be based, not on ethnic grounds, but on other and far more important and permanent principles and realities, and these can only render it to Turkey” http://web.archive.org/web/200610121935 ... n_conf.htm

Quote from Zorlu
“Turkey believes that the status quo should be maintained in Cyprus. If this is to be upset then the Island should revert to Turkey.” http://web.archive.org/web/200608091534 ... london.htm


An interesting bit here for you Oz :- “with protection Turkish community on Cyprus being given second consideration.” – it gives the lie to Turkey’s purported reason for the invasion
289. Telegram From the Embassy in Turkey to the Department of State Ankara, November 14, 1958, noon. Embassy wishes restate that basic factor determining Turkish position is need for security of Anatolia with protection Turkish community on Cyprus being given second consideration. "Independence", which provides only "paper" guarantees security Anatolia would not be acceptable GOT. http://dosfan.lib.uic.edu/ERC/frus/frus ... prus4.html

PS it’s bollocks not ballaks

[bigOz]

You just don’t get it do you Oz. All the events below preceded your claims, they clearly demonstrate Turkey’s determination to take Cyprus back and they did not care about the consequences for the Turkish Cypriots.

Quote from Kutchuk
“From a legal as well as moral point of view, Turkey, as the initial owner of the island just before the British occupation, has a first option to Cyprus. The matter does not end there. From a worldwide political point of view as well as from geographical and strategical points of view Cyprus must be handed to Turkey if Great Britain is going to quit.” http://web.archive.org/web/200609290506 ... k-1954.htm

Quote from Menderes
“In this respect, Cyprus is only an extension of the Turkish mainland, and it is one of the main pillars of Turkey's security. Consequently, should a change in its present status come into consideration, that change must be based, not on ethnic grounds, but on other and far more important and permanent principles and realities, and these can only render it to Turkey” http://web.archive.org/web/200610121935 ... n_conf.htm

Quote from Zorlu
“Turkey believes that the status quo should be maintained in Cyprus. If this is to be upset then the Island should revert to Turkey.” http://web.archive.org/web/200608091534 ... london.htm


An interesting bit here for you Oz :- “with protection Turkish community on Cyprus being given second consideration.” – it gives the lie to Turkey’s purported reason for the invasion
289. Telegram From the Embassy in Turkey to the Department of State Ankara, November 14, 1958, noon. Embassy wishes restate that basic factor determining Turkish position is need for security of Anatolia with protection Turkish community on Cyprus being given second consideration. "Independence", which provides only "paper" guarantees security Anatolia would not be acceptable GOT. http://dosfan.lib.uic.edu/ERC/frus/frus ... prus4.html

PS it’s bollocks not ballaks

Jerry, I do teach English and Turkish and do know how to spell better than most English people! There is a thing called "camouflage" when it comes to using swear words in a forum - as long as you get the message

You are again trying to win a lost case by watering down the issue and going back to before the Republic days. I could give you another long list of what GC leaders and EOKA said in favour of ENOSIS long before any such statements were made by the Turks! But I will not waste my time because if you really want to see "the writing is on the wall" as they say. I am sure if you searched the same sources you came up with waht is above you will also discover the same.

As for what Zorlu said, you have taken a small part of the whole speech at the London Conference on Cyprus, August 31,1955. If you cared to read the whole thing you would see he had good reason and very valid points made in terms of "Treaty of Lausanne", just a part of the same:

By the Treaty of Lausanne, Turkey waived her rights in favour of Great Britain. She consented to this renunciation in view of certain security considerations and of political conditions. Consequently, any attempt to transfer sovereignty on the Island or to alter its fate would represent a change in those conditions. From the point of view of physical geography, Turkey's interest in the Island is unalterable, and there is nothing more natural than that Turkey should reserve the right to reassert her interest in the Island according to new conditions.

Turkey is not only in her rights in making such a demand but she is also duty bound to do so. For the importance of Cyprus for Turkey does not arise from a single cause: it is a necessity which emanates from the exigencies of history, geography, economy and military strategy, from the right to existence and security which is the most sacred right of every state, in short from the very nature of things. May I be allowed to explain briefly the justification of this statement.

This Island which by its geographical structure is a prolongation of the Anatolian Peninsula, of which the soil is Anatolian soil, of which the climate is Anatolian climate, has, ever since the time it came under Turkish sovereignty, been attached to the motherland as any other province of Turkey, and has constituted an inseparable part thereof; indeed, in all the course of history the fate of Cyprus has remained attached to that of the peoples settled in the Anatolian Peninsula and has, in return, affected the fate of the peoples living in Anatolia. If the Island was once part of the Hellenic world, it was only because at that time Anatolia was within the orbit of ancient Hellenic civilization. If it once belonged to Byzantium, it was only because Byzantium held sway over Anatolia; if Cyprus was once under the dominion of the Latin Empire, it was only because at the time the Latins aspired to rule over Anatolia. In the same manner, when, previously and subsequently, the Caliphs began to extend their rule over Anatolia, they also ruled over Cyprus. It was also thus that the Ottomans established their sway on Cyprus. It is not therefore admissible to try to consider the Island of Cyprus from the point of view of the present day composition of its population. The number of Turks on the Island was sometimes a majority and sometimes a minority of the Island population and yet this was never taken as a criterion of whether or not the Island was Turkish, and for three and a half centuries Cyprus and the other parts of Turkey lived in a state of complete interpenetration.

In any case, all this business of what you said what I said was all before Cyprus Republic was created, with a constitution that was accepted by GCs, TCs, mainlands Greece, Turkey and Great Britain. What happened afterwards and the mother of all troubles started, when EOKA-B and fanatic GCs decided Cyprus should also be a Greek island. The guilt and blame for the destruction of the Republic and the Turkish invasion (although self serving) has clearly been accepted by your prominent political and church leaders as listed in my previous posts - AND even by Greece in not so distant past!

That being the case, your desperate attempts to look for alternative reasons, by cutting and pasting incomplete extracts from obsolete parts of history will not change the truth or support in any way that either the TCs were responsible for the start of the troubles, or Turkey's invasion was pre-planned!

To understand this better, you should know (rather than find out online) the state of affairs concerning USA, NATO and Europe at the time;

Greece was ruled by a strong CUNTA dictatorship that made PM Erdoğan look an angel. A CUNTA that was the puppet of US, and to the satisfaction of a joint European common market that took a lot of pleasure and profit from the underdeveloped neighbouring states such as Greece.

At the very same time Turkey was ruled by a very democratic Republican Peoples' Party (Ecevit) - a very clever, democratic leader who could read clearly through the intentions of the West - proper people's man who died with no earthly possessions for himself or family that may be worth a mention)

There was a serious cold war with USA and the Communist Russia - often threatening the the existence of the World with a possibility of a nuclear war.

By 1974, Makarios had long given up the idea of ENOSIS, trying desperately to find ways of getting rid of Greek army from Cyprus and returning to living with the TCs as thh leader of the original Cyprus Republic. His was more so supported by the Communist/Socialist parties who were gaining momentum and getting the majority of votes by winning the elections not too long before the 1974 troubles. A non-alligned Cyprus government who was flirting heavily with the Russians at the time!

Now Jerry, seeing you are so politically clever, stare long and hard at the above and tell me what you would have done if you were U.S.? They did exactly what they were doing to every other nation, even in less important parts of the world - never mind such a strategically important place as Cyprus, when Russians were desperate for a base in the warm waters of the Mediterranean. Would you plan an invasion with the current democratic (left of centre) government of Turkey, by designing a complicated, long and painful scenario? OR would you go for a short cut by supporting your servants the CUNTA in Greece to wipe out Makarios - AKEL supporters, using the mainland Greek forces together with EOKA-B? That way you would have a direct NATO stronghold in Cyprus in the form of a Greek army, destroy any possibility of a Communist or a Socialist state ever becoming influential in the Eastern Mediterranean and do as you please with your puppets in the CUNTA.

Anyone with more than a single cell in their brains would go for the second option! I do agree that - The worst that was going to happen would be the unlikely scenario that Turkey would go against NATO instructions and interfere militarily as a guarantor power! Although not preferable, if that happened, this was another loyal NATO member that would serve the original purpose anyway. So the American interests did not care who the fluck owned or shared the island, they did not give a toss whether it was a republic or a dictatorship, as long as it was governed by a right wing pro Western leadership. THEY WERE IN A WIN WIN SITUATION! However to the dismay of Turk hating Christian Europe, Turkey intervened and saved the lives of both GCs and TCs who would have otherwise been members of many more mass graves. Perhaps now you understand what is meant by your own press:

On Independence Day 1985 the Greek Cypriot Daily Simerini lamented as follows: "We believed that we are Tcentre of the Earth. We thought that we, small and insignificant as we are, would be capable of exercising policy on an intercontinental plane. But also above all we underestimated the Turks. The unstable and fickle policy of our leaders has brought us to the brink of total disaster."

I rest my case

[DrCyprus]

What is cunta? It sounds like a swear word to me. I thought you were a teacher of English.

[B25]

So according to BigoZ, the TCs were totally innocent in all of this, angels if you will and Turkey did us a favour!

Talk about the Flacking arrogance of this Turks.

[DrCyprus]

So according to BigoZ, the TCs were totally innocent in all of this, angels if you will and Turkey did us a favour!

Talk about the Flacking arrogance of this Turks.

He is just another Ottoman fanboy who still chooses to regard the Ottoman Empire as a benevolent force and all the gavurs as second class humanoid scum used by external forces to destroy this Ottoman paradise of honey and virgin vaginas. He probably thinks that Erdogan is the best thing that ever happened to Turkey, and that Turkey is something more than just the neighbourhood bully.