Cyprus-Forum.com

[cypezokyli]

drousiotis report is found in english and greek to be downloaded at

http://www.makarios.ws/cgibin/hweb?-A=975&-V=alfadi

comes close to that movie with robert de niro and dustin hoffman... what was the name exactly? "wag the dog" i guess. the only difference was that ...well it was just a movie

now the question is where do the traitors get their money?

[Piratis]

Personally I have absolutely no doubt that the Americans would at least pay to get what they want. They have also threatened us that a thousand bricks will fall on our head if we didn't accept their plan.

The ones that believe that international powers mind their own business and they do not get involved in the internal affairs of other countries are naive. The Americans wanted the Annan plan to be accepted. Do you honestly believe they would do nothing in order to promote their own interests?

Claiming that both Cyprus and US had common interests in accepting the Annan plan is one thing. No problem with that. Thats your opinion which most disagree.
Claiming that the Americans would do nothing in order to promote their own interests is very naive though.

[bg_turk]

Americans had an interest in the Annan Plan being accepted?

What would the USA gain in such an eventuality?

[Main_Source]

I thought you were an expert on evertything to do with Cyprus?

[Piratis]

Divide and rule my friend. The americans and the british want a conflicting situation in Cyprus. A truly united Cyprus could potentially demand the removal of the British bases and of their Echelon listening points.

This aim was served perfectly by the illegal Turkish occupation. However on May 1st a problem appeared: Cyprus was entering the EU and we would have a veto power over Turkey. (and I guess you know how much the Americans want Turkey in the EU). The solution: "solve" the Cyprus problem in a way that maintains partition and conflict and at the same time it legalizes it and ties the hands of Greek Cypriots so they will not be an obstacle in Turkey's accession.
Why do you think after 30 years of occupation they were rushing to push the Annan plan on us just days before we entered the EU?

[bg_turk]

Divide and rule my friend.

Haha, amigo eres loco, how much more divided can cyprus get than it is now? If their interests were to divide and "rule" Cyprus they would have recognized the TRNC right away,

The americans and the british want a conflicting situation in Cyprus. A truly united Cyprus could potentially demand the removal of the British bases and of their Echelon listening points.

This aim was served perfectly by the illegal Turkish occupation. However on May 1st a problem appeared: Cyprus was entering the EU and we would have a veto power over Turkey. (and I guess you know how much the Americans want Turkey in the EU). The solution: "solve" the Cyprus problem in a way that maintains partition and conflict and at the same time it legalizes it and ties the hands of Greek Cypriots so they will not be an obstacle in Turkey's accession.

So if TCs were to accept a unitary state, you say Britain and the USA would be against such a state and would try to block it?

Why do you think after 30 years of occupation they were rushing to push the Annan plan on us just days before we entered the EU?

It had nothing to do with them Piratis, but everything to do with the political processes in Turkey and TRNC. Turkey realized the fialure of the intransigent diplomacy of Denktash too late, and tried to rush the settlement before you could enter the EU. The USA and UK had nothing to do with the timing.
If you had rejected the settlement earlier, before your accession treaty was realized, you wouldnot have entered the EU.

[Piratis]

If their interests were to divide and "rule" Cyprus they would have recognized the TRNC right away,

You are missing the point. What they want is two conflicting sides and them in the middle. So if GCs try to say anything against their bases they will threaten us with recognition of "TRNC" and we would back off. If the TCs/Turkey tried to refuse their demands for listening points etc they would equally threaten them that they would stop supporting the continuation of their illegality.

On the other hand if the recognized the "TRNC" they would have huge problems with maintaining the bases here, and in the future, after a grace period of some decades, the TCs/Turkey could also tell them to f*ck off and they will not have something powerful to press them with.

This is why if we do not get united both sites will always be losers.

So if TCs were to accept a unitary state, you say Britain and the USA would be against such a state and would try to block it?

A unitary state, or a federal state or whatever that would be normal without conflicting interests of TCs and GCs is against their interests and they would not support it. Thats for sure.

It had nothing to do with them Piratis, but everything to do with the political processes in Turkey and TRNC. Turkey realized the fialure of the intransigent diplomacy of Denktash too late, and tried to rush the settlement before you could enter the EU. The USA and UK had nothing to do with the timing.

So you think that Turkey alone without the help of their good allies was able to determine the timing? Sorry bg_turk but you really way overestimate the power of Turkey in international politics.

If you had rejected the settlement earlier, before your accession treaty was realized, you wouldnot have entered the EU.

Thats a theory. Which would mean that no expansion would have happened since Greece was clear that would veto any expansion that would not include Cyprus.

[cypezokyli]

piratis i think u r completely missing the point here. and i mean REALLY missing the point. if u want to believe even without seeing that the americans payed is one thing.
if specific organisations or specific people are acussed without facts then it is a problem. peoples lives are stigmatised, and are labeled traitors without any proof, and the worse is that the president himself participated. i hope that is not the democracy u r so much in favor of.

moreover it seems to be completely irrelevant to you that all the channels together with our political leadership have lead the public opinion to believe sth that was wrong. or sth that cannot be proven with facts. and then we accuse the turks and their propaganda arsenal.

i would perfectly agree with you to punish or publicly offend anyone who got many from the americans to support the annan plan. honestly i completely agree. and if u want to generalise: all those who voted yes are traitors or all of them got money from the americans i also dont mind. but when this mud is directed to specific persons then one should at least provide some evidence. or else i dont even want to know what your democracy actually means.

[Main_Source]

America purposely did their best to imbalance Cyprus with the Greek Junta and EOKA B...what makes you think they are going to give up now?

[Piratis]

I said some simple facts:
- The americans would pay money in order to promote their interests.
- Somebody receives that money

Do you disagree so far?

Beyond that, I would agree with you that it is incorrect to make accusations against specific people if they can not prove them in courts.

The problem is that the people that complain, including Drousiotis and Politis newspaper, are among the people that throw the most mud at others. If they are not correct to others, then why do they expect others to be correct to them?