Cyprus-Forum.com

[RichardB]

War was the method used due to opposition to create peace which you have enjoyed for more that 32 years.

To Turkish nationalists, the invasion in 1974 was a “peace mission” to protect the Turkish Cypriots,and this was its proclaimed goal for the military invasion, where is the evidence? Were the 130,000 settlers from Turkey sent to restore constitutional legitimacy or change the demographics in Cyprus, and seize Greek Cypriot homes and land? The Turkification of towns, streets, even cemeteries (all given Turkish names) and the vandalizing of Greek churches and their conversion into mosques, was this done to protect Turkish Cypriots or ethnic cleansing?

As far as I know war was not declared and the turkish government has always insisted it was a peace operation (mission) If the Turkish military were (are)there to protect the cypriots in the north from the ROC why the change of demographics?

[Viewpoint]

RichardB

where is the evidence?

The population living there is all the evidence you need.

Were the 130,000 settlers from Turkey sent to restore constitutional legitimacy or change the demographics in Cyprus, and seize Greek Cypriot homes and land?

It is normal for settlers to come in an populate where there is work and a need for rebuilding of a specific area, the housing problems for this sudden influx of settlers was easy to solve as you know and another attraction.

The Turkification of towns, streets, even cemeteries (all given Turkish names) and the vandalizing of Greek churches and their conversion into mosques, was this done to protect Turkish Cypriots or ethnic cleansing?

We do not know Greek and cannot pronounce the names so of course over a number of years with no solution in sight and the formation of the TRNC naturally names started to change just they have done all over the world, eg London vs Londinium...

A mosque is also a house of god and place for worshipping, the vandalizing and loss of valuable artifacts is a disgrace but in such desperate times lives are more important than property and this occurred on both sides (1963-1974).

As far as I know war was not declared and the Turkish government has always insisted it was a peace operation (mission) If the Turkish military were (are)there to protect the cypriots in the north from the ROC why the change of demographics?

They change in accordance with demand for labour to make a country function, the division produced a chasm of land and property which if not utilized would have deteriorated and been demolished, look on the bright side many properties are only standing today because they have been used and many have been kept in good condition as many GCs have seen for themselves.

[RichardB]

The population living there is all the evidence you need.

18% of populayion living in 40% of land?

It is normal for settlers to come in an populate where there is work and a need for rebuilding of a specific area, the housing problems for this sudden influx of settlers was easy to solve as you know and another attraction

130,000 seems a lot to me when housing etc was only needed for 18% of population did none of the persons left in the north know how to build? So when the rebuilding was done why did they not return to Turkey? Oh I forgot they lived in the remaining Stolen properties

We do not know Greek and cannot pronounce the names so of course over a number of years with no solution in sight and the formation of the TRNC naturally names started to change just they have done all over the world, eg London vs Londinium

I'm afraid the only answer to your point here is boll*cks viewpoint . Why did you just not latinize the original Greek names into English lettering then you could read them?

They change in accordance with demand for labour to make a country function, the division produced a chasm of land and property which if not utilized would have deteriorated and been demolished, look on the bright side many properties are only standing today because they have been used and many have been kept in good condition as many GCs have seen for themselves

The demand for labour would not have been necessary if you had not taken more land than you culd cope with and had the population (owners) been allowed to return then there would have been no need to utilise their properties.

A mosque is also a house of god and place for worshipping, the vandalizing and loss of valuable artifacts is a disgrace but in such desperate times lives are more important than property and this occurred on both sides (1963-1974).

Ok I'll agree on this one

[raymanuva]

RichardB: "Ok I'll agree on this one"... please dont.
From the day of invasion till today? I am not sure about 30 years ago but now i see all mosques are being fixed and most of them are functioning! What about orthodox churches in occupied areas?

[RichardB]

raymanuva i give my opinion as i see fit to.

In this case VP stated thet the desecration of places of worship was a disgrace and i cannot find anything to disagree with in that statement.

I agree with you that mosques in the south are being repaired and this can only be for the good.

I would hope that the Orthadox Churches and other places of worship are being treated the same in the North maybe someone could let us know?

[bg_turk]

This may happen, its just another option so I don't see why you are so angry and aggressive, obviously its touched a raw nerve.

I'd rather if the TRNC did not become of province of Turkey. The Yavru Vatan should stay as a seperate state and preserve its uniqueness

[Viewpoint]

This may happen, its just another option so I don't see why you are so angry and aggressive, obviously its touched a raw nerve.

I'd rather if the TRNC did not become of province of Turkey. The Yavru Vatan should stay as a seperate state and preserve its uniqueness

I agree bg_turk but becoming a province is just another option just like reunificaiton or recognition. Any of these could materialize over time if one sides hand is forced to accept any of the above.

[Viewpoint]

RichardB

18% of populayion living in 40% of land?

So according to your logic which is flawed the United Kingdom land distribution should be as follows which is the ethnic divide;

English 83.6%, Scottish 8.6%, Welsh 4.9%, Northern Irish 2.9%

Think you'll find they occupy approximately;

English 53%
Scottish 32%
Welsh 9%
Irish 6% of the land mass of the United Kingdom, proves my point really.

130,000 seems a lot to me when housing etc was only needed for 18% of population did none of the persons left in the north know how to build? So when the rebuilding was done why did they not return to Turkey? Oh I forgot they lived in the remaining Stolen properties

Not just housing who was going to work in shops hotels construction etc the population was not enough to support a viable economy. As the year went by and no solution was found then they stayed and had children which have now become 32 years old..

I'm afraid the only answer to your point here is boll*cks viewpoint . Why did you just not latinize the original Greek names into English lettering then you could read them?

Not everyone can read English and having Turkish names was convenient and logical for a Turkish speaking nation. You would never imagine the English putting Italian names on the towns and villages.

The demand for labour would not have been necessary if you had not taken more land than you culd cope with and had the population (owners) been allowed to return then there would have been no need to utilise their properties.

Sorry there just wasn't enough time to get the ruler and tape measure out to calculate the labour land balance while all hell had been let loose and it was the GCs that didn't want return and live under TC rule, you are free to return and live in the north today, why don't you?

Ok I'll agree on this one

Thank you.

[Viewpoint]

RichardB: "Ok I'll agree on this one"... please dont.
From the day of invasion till today? I am not sure about 30 years ago but now i see all mosques are being fixed and most of them are functioning! What about orthodox churches in occupied areas?

There is no question they should all be restored to their former glory. We will do this once we have the finance to back it up.

[RichardB]

So according to your logic which is flawed the United Kingdom land distribution should be as follows which is the ethnic divide;

English 83.6%, Scottish 8.6%, Welsh 4.9%, Northern Irish 2.9%

Think you'll find they occupy approximately;

English 53%
Scottish 32%
Welsh 9%
Irish 6% of the land mass of the United Kingdom, proves my point really.

I dont know if you figures are correct or not VP Even if i take it they are how can you make this comparison with the situation in Northern Cyprus . The people mentioned above are free to purchase Land/ Property anywhere in the UK with full title deeds knowing it is not stolen

Is this the same in Northern Cyprus?

Not everyone can read English and having Turkish names was convenient and logical for a Turkish speaking nation. You would never imagine the English putting Italian names on the towns and villages.

Again I must say I dont agree with your comments here I'm sure that you can give a literal translation in Turkish for Greek names without changing them eg 'Lapitos' is now 'Lapta' is there no I, O or S in the Turkish language?

Not just housing who was going to work in shops hotels construction etc the population was not enough to support a viable economy. As the year went by and no solution was found then they stayed and had children which have now become 32 years old[/quote

So So again I ask why take 40% of the Island Why take more than what is viable for you to use . Its like me having a factory that requires 40 people to run it when I only have 18 employees and I guess your answer would be to import labour but if that labour is coming illegally and residing in stolen property then is this right?

Sorry there just wasn't enough time to get the ruler and tape measure out to calculate the labour land balance while all hell had been let loose and it was the GCs that didn't want return and live under TC rule, you are free to return and live in the north today, why don't you?{/quote]

I would love to come and live in the north VP I myself do not have property there but my Wife does (with full title deeds) But unfortunately it is presently occupied. Do you have any suggestions?

And before you jump to conclusions I have never received any property in the south what I have has been paid for by pure hard graft

Been nice debating with you time for bed for me 'goodnight