Cyprus-Forum.com

[GreekIslandGirl]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

[Tim Drayton]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

This is also my impression from looking at the GDP graphs. Perhaps we all only see what we want to see. While the whole world eventually became dominated by the neo-liberal paradigm post Thatcher-Reagan, Germany, France and Italy are countries that did not make a sharp break with the post-war consensus, welfare state model in the way that Thatcher did with ideological fervour. Germany did not shut down its industry; quite the reverse, it saw its engineering expertise as its life blood, continued to invest in it and even today Germany can compete with China on the world stage, manufacturing goods that the world wants to buy, while giving first-world rates of pay to the people who make them. None of these countries embarked on a mad dash to privatise everything in sight. For example, today, they all boast very efficient state railway systems that consume far less of the taxpayers' money in subsidy than the British private rail companies do. So, looking at the graph, and bearing in mind the huge boost that North Sea oil gave to the British economy in the 1980s, just where is that so-called Thatcher miracle? The UK simply has not outperformed these other three European countries.So just why did most of British manufacturing industry have to close, why did millions lose their jobs, why did the streets fill up with the unemployed? I see nothing in those graphs that justify all of that. The fact that other countries that did not follow this extreme path prospered just as well suggests to me that it was all futile.

Another point that strikes me is that per-capita GDP is shown to have risen steadily throughout the time of the Callaghan government, which is usually portrayed as a period of decline and strife.

Does this all just go to show that there are lies, damned lies and statistics?

[GreekIslandGirl]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

This is also my impression from looking at the GDP graphs. Perhaps we all only see what we want to see. While the whole world eventually became dominated by the neo-liberal paradigm post Thatcher-Reagan, Germany, France and Italy are countries that did not make a sharp break with the post-war consensus, welfare state model in the way that Thatcher did with ideological fervour. Germany did not shut down its industry; quite the reverse, it saw its engineering expertise as its life blood, continued to invest in it and even today Germany can compete with China on the world stage, manufacturing goods that the world wants to buy, while giving first-world rates of pay to the people who make them. None of these countries embarked on a mad dash to privatise everything in sight. For example, today, they all boast very efficient state railway systems that consume far less of the taxpayers' money in subsidy than the British private rail companies do. So, looking at the graph, and bearing in mind the huge boost that North Sea oil gave to the British economy in the 1980s, just where is that so-called Thatcher miracle? The UK simply has not outperformed these other three European countries.So just why did most of British manufacturing industry have to close, why did millions lose their jobs, why did the streets fill up with the unemployed? I see nothing in those graphs that justify all of that. The fact that other countries that did not follow this extreme path prospered just as well suggests to me that it was all futile.

Another point that strikes me is that per-capita GDP is shown to have risen steadily throughout the time of the Callaghan government, which is usually portrayed as a period of decline and strife.

Does this all just go to show that there are lies, damned lies and statistics?

What you say about Germany seems sound. The antithesis of Thatcher's approach, who took Hayek's Road to Serfdom to such an extreme, whilst believing some premise that the more unequal a society was the faster it would grow economically. What is worrying is that someone (Germany?) is doing exactly the same to Greece and Cyprus (forcing the privatisation of state assets, to be bought up by the few wealthy) as Thatcher did to the UK decades ago - even if it's not a policy they themselves have carried out at home!

[cyprusgrump]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

So before she took office it was way above the other economies...?

[GreekIslandGirl]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

So before she took office it was way above the other economies...?

Erm, if you wish a balanced viewpoint, you'll see that the UK was better than Italy and very, very close to the other two. In fact all four where (within statistical comparisons) virtually the same. The rest took off, the UK plummeted as Tim pointed out and then it took nearly 4 years of Thatcher's rule to get back to what it was before she came into power. Meanwhile, the other 3 where still growing well. Then for the rest of her term, the UK lagged behind. For example, whilst being a little better than Italy before Thatcher took over, the UK was some 88% the level of Italy by 1985 when she had several years in power.

I have never wished the woman ill, am in awe of some of her cheek, but I do realise she had a dogmatic view which refused to see reason and those sorts of dictators ... I mean rulers, are dangerous. Her self-belief was the destruction of a lot of what was Great about Britain. But, she's gone now and she was a frail old lady suffering from one of life's worst ironies. She has taught us a lot.

[danny1234]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

Your country is toast and you are concerning yourself with degrading the finest woman ever to hit the political arena. Your politicians have sold you down the river girl.

[Get Real!]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

Your country is toast and you are concerning yourself with degrading the finest woman ever to hit the political arena. Your politicians have sold you down the river girl.

Hello Mark, how's the revolution going?

[cyprusgrump]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

So before she took office it was way above the other economies...?

Erm, if you wish a balanced viewpoint, you'll see that the UK was better than Italy and very, very close to the other two. In fact all four where (within statistical comparisons) virtually the same. The rest took off, the UK plummeted as Tim pointed out and then it took nearly 4 years of Thatcher's rule to get back to what it was before she came into power. Meanwhile, the other 3 where still growing well. Then for the rest of her term, the UK lagged behind. For example, whilst being a little better than Italy before Thatcher took over, the UK was some 88% the level of Italy by 1985 when she had several years in power.

I have never wished the woman ill, am in awe of some of her cheek, but I do realise she had a dogmatic view which refused to see reason and those sorts of dictators ... I mean rulers, are dangerous. Her self-belief was the destruction of a lot of what was Great about Britain. But, she's gone now and she was a frail old lady suffering from one of life's worst ironies. She has taught us a lot.

I think you should check your glasses... Thatcher didn't become PM until 1979...

[Paphitis]

I think it is unfair to compare differing administrations with Thatcher.

The recent progress depicted on the graphs could be as a result of Thatcherite efficiency drives and reform.

All that is clear is that Britain was in trouble when she took office. A recovery took place from 1982 onwards. This recovery accelerated after she left office. And now, Britain is in a mess again, but with the advantage that it is in control of its economy and has its own financial sovereignty to print money and use inflation to its advantage whilst sitting on a pile of debt (again a Thatcher policy). A luxury the rest of the EZ DO NOT have, hence the disaster we have witnessed in Greece and Cyprus.

But the biggest thing she will be remembered for is Britains' role in ending the Cold War with the Soviet Union without a single shot fired, and for the Falklands War.

[GreekIslandGirl]

That table of figures also shows that throughout her term of office, Britain lagged behind the other major European economies and it wasn't till Blair's term of office that it caught up.

So before she took office it was way above the other economies...?

Erm, if you wish a balanced viewpoint, you'll see that the UK was better than Italy and very, very close to the other two. In fact all four where (within statistical comparisons) virtually the same. The rest took off, the UK plummeted as Tim pointed out and then it took nearly 4 years of Thatcher's rule to get back to what it was before she came into power. Meanwhile, the other 3 where still growing well. Then for the rest of her term, the UK lagged behind. For example, whilst being a little better than Italy before Thatcher took over, the UK was some 88% the level of Italy by 1985 when she had several years in power.

I have never wished the woman ill, am in awe of some of her cheek, but I do realise she had a dogmatic view which refused to see reason and those sorts of dictators ... I mean rulers, are dangerous. Her self-belief was the destruction of a lot of what was Great about Britain. But, she's gone now and she was a frail old lady suffering from one of life's worst ironies. She has taught us a lot.

I think you should check your glasses... Thatcher didn't become PM until 1979...

Where did I say otherwise? You're just proving you cannot analyse graphs.