Cyprus-Forum.com

[Lordo]

secondly you were right of what inonu said to kucuk, but why did you leave out what kucuk said to inonu. did he not say but they will kill us all.

Actually, Kücük's and Denktash's reply to Inönü was not what you wrote, but this, "we would rather come to Turkey than return back to the RoC"!

It tells me that they had a choice, and going back to the RoC's government was not one of them, because Taksim was their goal. Inönü knew that TCs outside the RoC's government would result of the what the TCs are facing today, isolation and for Turkey to babysit them at great cost to Turkey, and that was even without the foresight that the RoC would one day become an EU member and holding Turkey's future EU membership in her hands.

So please tell us o wise one which date could they return to government wihtout fear of their lives. while you are at it please also exolain why makarios refused the compromise agreed by clerides and dengtas in 1972.

but please dont make to laughable otherwise our sides may split from laughter as today is an important date in the cyprus problem as you are well aware i am sure Zeki and Cemaliye were murder for no reason other than gc thirst for tc blood and enosis..

[Kikapu]

Thank you for proving me right as the the effective say is what the GCs will never accept tahts why they reject BBF with political equality.

Who are you talking to and what are you talking about?

God you are dumb what do you think the UN resolution is referring to when they clearly state there should be an effective say of the two communities, unlike your treacherous plan gave the GC community an open door to take 100% of the effective say into their own hands to manipulate and use the true democracy and human rights you peddle which yourself admitted can be done to pass laws to the detriment of the other community.

As usual you don't know the difference between your ass from the hole in the ground when it comes to about my BBF plan or very much else for that matter.

What you need to remember is that the RoC is in the EU, therefore, any and all non democratic proposals or resolutions from the past are no longer viable.

In a True Federation every federal state has an equal say. It does not mean only once ethnic group run that state solely which it did not say in the above UNSC resolution. When referred to politically equal communities in a Federation, are they not talking about politically equal communities of those living in each state? Does it not mean that all those living in a state are considered to be a community of that state and that state has an equal say in the Federal government? Where does it say that ONLY one ethnic community politically represents that state in the Federal Government.? It does not. The Kikapu's BBF plan I gave you was based on True Democracy, even though strict TC/GC Rotating Presidency was not very Democratic and neither was it proposed by the UNSC resolutions, and don't expect it to be offered again by the GCs.

[Kikapu]

secondly you were right of what inonu said to kucuk, but why did you leave out what kucuk said to inonu. did he not say but they will kill us all.

Actually, Kücük's and Denktash's reply to Inönü was not what you wrote, but this, "we would rather come to Turkey than return back to the RoC"!

It tells me that they had a choice, and going back to the RoC's government was not one of them, because Taksim was their goal. Inönü knew that TCs outside the RoC's government would result of the what the TCs are facing today, isolation and for Turkey to babysit them at great cost to Turkey, and that was even without the foresight that the RoC would one day become an EU member and holding Turkey's future EU membership in her hands.

So please tell us o wise one which date could they return to government wihtout fear of their lives. while you are at it please also exolain why makarios refused the compromise agreed by clerides and dengtas in 1972.

but please dont make to laughable otherwise our sides may split from laughter as today is an important date in the cyprus problem as you are well aware i am sure Zeki and Cemaliye were murder for no reason other than gc thirst for tc blood and enosis..

So you admit that your statement was incorrect and mine was correct in what Kücük and Denktas said to Inönü.

Inönu did not have any fears of the TCs returning back to the government at any time, or else he wouldn't have asked then to do so, not unless Inönü wanted the TC leaders to commit suicide. Is that what you are saying, Lordo?

Lets not go all over the place with the Cyprus problem. Lets deal with your statement about Inönü and Kücük.

[repulsewarrior]

The "Turkish Cypriots" must create a democratic, legitimate and meritocratic 'Cypriot' effigy of themselves first.

...and if "Greeks" want a Cypriot State, they too would form a Cypriot Constituency, an equal to this Turkish Constituency, so that the Republic, the Federal Government, can represent its Citizens as Individuals, defending them as Persons, not as "Greeks" and "Turks", but with an Identity that has no other Distinction or discrimination, as Cypriots.

...(at least) three governing bodies must exist.

whether the Constituent states are equal or not in size would not matter, within these states their electors choose to sustain their Distinct Identity and with their tax dollars effect this Agenda, their Political Equality can be secured only if there is a representation of these voters not as Persons, where as one identity they represent themseves as a majority, but as Individuals, where as Human Beings they seek to better their condition. as majorities they can demonstrate their good-will to others within their Territorial Jurisdictions, United as One People they demonstrate their will universally with a recognition and respect as Men/Women toward each other as a larger Family of Man.

...there is Freedom and there is Liberty; equality as Individuals, equality of Persons: this is Bicommunal, recognising these needs.

[Pyrpolizer]

Thank you for proving me right as the the effective say is what the GCs will never accept tahts why they reject BBF with political equality.

For your information VP, the matter of Government was perhaps the ONLY chapter the leaders have agreed on almost everything even from the time Talat was President.

The reasons for not finding a solution are a)the property issue b) The settlers issue c)the percentage of land issue under each Fed state d)The form of BBF that the Turkish side translates as a confederation or almost 2 separate countries e)Turkey's demands for continuing guarantees.

Coming back to the clarification provided by the UN, what is definitely very clear is that political equality DOES NOT MEAN NUMERICAL EQUALITY.

[Viewpoint]

Thank you for proving me right as the the effective say is what the GCs will never accept tahts why they reject BBF with political equality.

Who are you talking to and what are you talking about?

God you are dumb what do you think the UN resolution is referring to when they clearly state there should be an effective say of the two communities, unlike your treacherous plan gave the GC community an open door to take 100% of the effective say into their own hands to manipulate and use the true democracy and human rights you peddle which yourself admitted can be done to pass laws to the detriment of the other community.

As usual you don't know the difference between your ass from the hole in the ground when it comes to about my BBF plan or very much else for that matter.

What you need to remember is that the RoC is in the EU, therefore, any and all non democratic proposals or resolutions from the past are no longer viable.

In a True Federation every federal state has an equal say. It does not mean only once ethnic group run that state solely which it did not say in the above UNSC resolution. When referred to politically equal communities in a Federation, are they not talking about politically equal communities of those living in each state? Does it not mean that all those living in a state are considered to be a community of that state and that state has an equal say in the Federal government? Where does it say that ONLY one ethnic community politically represents that state in the Federal Government.? It does not. The Kikapu's BBF plan I gave you was based on True Democracy, even though strict TC/GC Rotating Presidency was not very Democratic and neither was it proposed by the UNSC resolutions, and don't expect it to be offered again by the GCs.

And you have no manners but we wont curse your parents.

Communities have to be defined and clarified throughout all communications communities refers to the TC and GC communities, if it is to be north and south states then the voting structure will have to be developed to ensure equal TC and Gc participation.

[Pyrpolizer]

here's a little present for lordos bright contribution in this thread and others.

[Pyrpolizer]

Thank you for proving me right as the the effective say is what the GCs will never accept tahts why they reject BBF with political equality.

Who are you talking to and what are you talking about?

God you are dumb what do you think the UN resolution is referring to when they clearly state there should be an effective say of the two communities, unlike your treacherous plan gave the GC community an open door to take 100% of the effective say into their own hands to manipulate and use the true democracy and human rights you peddle which yourself admitted can be done to pass laws to the detriment of the other community.

As usual you don't know the difference between your ass from the hole in the ground when it comes to about my BBF plan or very much else for that matter.

What you need to remember is that the RoC is in the EU, therefore, any and all non democratic proposals or resolutions from the past are no longer viable.

In a True Federation every federal state has an equal say. It does not mean only once ethnic group run that state solely which it did not say in the above UNSC resolution. When referred to politically equal communities in a Federation, are they not talking about politically equal communities of those living in each state? Does it not mean that all those living in a state are considered to be a community of that state and that state has an equal say in the Federal government? Where does it say that ONLY one ethnic community politically represents that state in the Federal Government.? It does not. The Kikapu's BBF plan I gave you was based on True Democracy, even though strict TC/GC Rotating Presidency was not very Democratic and neither was it proposed by the UNSC resolutions, and don't expect it to be offered again by the GCs.

And you have no manners but we wont curse your parents.

Communities have to be defined and clarified throughout all communications communities refers to the TC and GC communities, if it is to be north and south states then the voting structure will have to be developed to ensure equal TC and Gc participation.

But that will violate UN's definition of equality as being EFFECTIVE SAY

[Pyrpolizer]

As for the 1963 events here's some educational information for lordo who was employed by RoC to teach turkish imish and has no Union to join imish and all those lies and fartings that he spreads around
http://www.cyprus-conflict.net/Patrick-chp%203.html

Here's just a small quote from the very beginning

Both sides had militias ready and eager to strike at the slightest provocation

[Lordo]

secondly you were right of what inonu said to kucuk, but why did you leave out what kucuk said to inonu. did he not say but they will kill us all.

Actually, Kücük's and Denktash's reply to Inönü was not what you wrote, but this, "we would rather come to Turkey than return back to the RoC"!

It tells me that they had a choice, and going back to the RoC's government was not one of them, because Taksim was their goal. Inönü knew that TCs outside the RoC's government would result of the what the TCs are facing today, isolation and for Turkey to babysit them at great cost to Turkey, and that was even without the foresight that the RoC would one day become an EU member and holding Turkey's future EU membership in her hands.

So please tell us o wise one which date could they return to government wihtout fear of their lives. while you are at it please also exolain why makarios refused the compromise agreed by clerides and dengtas in 1972.

but please dont make to laughable otherwise our sides may split from laughter as today is an important date in the cyprus problem as you are well aware i am sure Zeki and Cemaliye were murder for no reason other than gc thirst for tc blood and enosis..

So you admit that your statement was incorrect and mine was correct in what Kücük and Denktas said to Inönü.

Inönu did not have any fears of the TCs returning back to the government at any time, or else he wouldn't have asked then to do so, not unless Inönü wanted the TC leaders to commit suicide. Is that what you are saying, Lordo?

Lets not go all over the place with the Cyprus problem. Lets deal with your statement about Inönü and Kücük.

Are you saying that kucuk did not tell inonu that if they go back they would be killed. one never knows why one say what they say. i can only guess that perhaps inonu did not believe what kucuk was telling him or that he wanted them killed and then use the excuse to invade. who knows we will never know.

but kindly answer the question. after the 22 dec 1963 murder of the zeki and cemaliye incident please tell us the earliest date which kucuk could have returned to the government. be my guest the floor is yours but dont kill us from laughter is all i ask.