Cyprus-Forum.com

[Jerry]

Lordo you just don't get it, do you. The Annan Plan in all its versions was illegal. Don't take my word for it, check this out:-

http://alfreddezayas.com/Articles/cyprussettlers.shtml

And
"The parties to the UN negotiations, Greece, Turkey, the (Greek) Cypriot government and the (still internationally unrecognised) Turkish Cypriot administration met in April at Bürgenstock in Switzerland, having allowed Kofi Annan in advance to make his own arbitration decisions on any unresolved issues when the negotiations ended; in their final stages a last minute tranche of extra demands were made by the Turkish military—which the Turkish Cypriots had not asked for and did not want. Urged on by the EU and the US, Annan accepted them all—including the proposal that Turkish troops remain in the island in perpetuity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annan_Plan_for_Cyprus

[Maximus]

why would the EU urge this on?

[Lordo]

Lordo you just don't get it, do you. The Annan Plan in all its versions was illegal. Don't take my word for it, check this out:-

http://alfreddezayas.com/Articles/cyprussettlers.shtml

And
"The parties to the UN negotiations, Greece, Turkey, the (Greek) Cypriot government and the (still internationally unrecognised) Turkish Cypriot administration met in April at Bürgenstock in Switzerland, having allowed Kofi Annan in advance to make his own arbitration decisions on any unresolved issues when the negotiations ended; in their final stages a last minute tranche of extra demands were made by the Turkish military—which the Turkish Cypriots had not asked for and did not want. Urged on by the EU and the US, Annan accepted them all—including the proposal that Turkish troops remain in the island in perpetuity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annan_Plan_for_Cyprus

of course they were going to remain on the island. all 650 of them. big wow. that was part of the treaty of guarantee. now, if you are nice towards the tcs and they are no longer fearful of all your elam activities perhaps you could convince your tcs friends to ask for the gurantee to be removed maybe a decade later. but lets look at the guarantee and what it really means and how it is seen by the majority of the tc population.

so you want the guarantee to be removed. this is actually what you mean by this statement. well at least this is how the tcs hear it.

if at some stage in the future i as a greek cypriot grab you by the throat and my elam friend behind you stab you in the back, that brute swine over there is not allowed to come to your defence. of course all the tcs will agree with that and also at the same time pigs will fly if you wait long enough in evolution for them to grow wings. ask your resident ornihologist she will explain it all.

as to legality, if un and eu supported it it is legal enough for me. it is also illegal for the czech republic that has german properties against their wishes but it is acceptable to the germans. you don't hear the germans saying this is illegal. they accepted it as price to pay for past aggression and wrong doing for a better future even though it is unlawful for a small number of people. you are looking for utopia, keep on searching you will get there in the end, and by that i mean in the end of the world.

you takes your choice and you pays the price my friend. legal or otherwise.

[Jerry]

why would the EU urge this on?

Can't you work that one out yourself.

Illegal Annan Plan accepted = solution of Cyprus problem = Turkey joins the EU

[Jerry]

so you want the guarantee to be removed. this is actually what you mean by this statement. well at least this is how the tcs hear it.

if at some stage in the future i as a greek cypriot grab you by the throat and my elam friend behind you stab you in the back, that brute swine over there is not allowed to come to your defence. of course all the tcs will agree with that and also at the same time pigs will fly if you wait long enough in evolution for them to grow wings. ask your resident ornihologist she will explain it all.

as to legality, if un and eu supported it it is legal enough for me. it is also illegal for the czech republic that has german properties against their wishes but it is acceptable to the germans. you don't hear the germans saying this is illegal. they accepted it as price to pay for past aggression and wrong doing for a better future even though it is unlawful for a small number of people. you are looking for utopia, keep on searching you will get there in the end, and by that i mean in the end of the world.

you takes your choice and you pays the price my friend. legal or otherwise.

Absolutely no need for foreign troops in a member State of the EU. If the international community really cared about settling the Cyprus problem according to the terms of the UN Charter it should have proposed the supervision and control of police and security forces by the EU for an interim period. Instead they caved in to Turkey's demands. Tell me Lordo, where else on this earth are foreign troops (not UN troops) "legally" stationed to make sure that citizens "behave" themselves?

Illegality is acceptable to you, the EU and UN because it suits your purpose and is expedient. The Germans were prepared to accept an illegality, the Greek Cypriots were not - that's why they voted against the illegal Annan Plan.

[mouflonrouge]

Well the source of this is given as the "Afrika" paper in the Occupied Areas.

Where they got it from isn't cited.

Perhaps no coincidence that Downer was in CY for the first time in months yesterday and met with the Pres and with the spokesperson for Turkey and the Illegal Settlers, whose name i forget.

So where has it come from...? Who has been leaking their prefs to the press...???

Well a look at the 4 proposals may shed some light on that...

A "relaxed" or loose federation reeks of CONfederation.
NATO bases and NATO as guarantor is an oddball as CY isn't in NATO but it would give Turkey a foothold in two large areas of the Free Areas.
Property resolved largely through compensation has always been a Turkish ambition... and where's the money coming from...???
Adding the Gas to the negotiations, again very much what Turkey would like to see and taking the CY gas through Turkey was an idea first mooted by the US South East Europe Representative a few months ago.

Then look at what's missing... The Territory question... something that the Illegal Regime said only last week wasn't up for discussion or adjustment.

Conclusion at the mo.. If there is anything in this , this leak has has been prepared by Turkey and the US State Dept to test reactions before the resumption of talks in the Spring.

A possible leak of what they have in store for us. This is no doubt worse than the Annan Plan, and you're right to say that Turkey would legitimately be able to station troops in the free areas. Does this mean we will be surrounded with Turkish troops since they will have a stranglehold over the 'north'?

No mention of territory or the return of Famagusta, Karpasia or Morphou. So Turkey to control the 'north' and be able to station troops in the south.

I wonder if the US State Department consulted Noble or Israel about the possibility that their Gas will transit through a Turkish Energy hub to the EU. And what happens to the Billions being invested to build a jointly operated Liquefied Natural Gas Plant

Now, are we silly enough to accept a worse plan than what was tabled and rejected in 2004? Nothing surprises me anymore.

I would further add, that the timing of this 'leak', just before presidential Elections in Cyprus where Anastasiades will doubtlessly be elected, is worrying for the fact that Anastasiades may be willing to accept anything even though he has stepped up the pre election rhetoric.

[Lordo]

exactly my friend. cypriots are ruled by their heart and the germans by their brain.

which explains why the germans have gone from strength to strength since the war and the cypriots are bankrupt.

enjoy. nothing more to say.

as to expediencies, nothing of the kind. i am prepared to donate all my wealth (£6.66) to the pot for compensation in order to unite cyprus to the satisfaction of the majority of both communities. leave the elam boys where they belong.

[Kikapu]

..was it Lordo? Annan 5 was unread on the day of the referendum. would (did) you vote for something so unclear?

it was negotiated over decades. it was also agreed by both parties that if there was areas of non-agreement the un was going to find the middle ground between them. i am afraid there comes a time when you say enough is enough thats the best we reach now. otherwise you and up like a pup chasing his own tail. gurubedos likes that game.

having voted for the representative one has to accept their decision. and move on. if you aexpected 1 millin people to read a 10,000 page document before you offered it to the vote i suspect you would wait about a million years.

you don't need to read the document. you read the salient points of compromise, gains and losses. it was supported by the un eu greece. you carry on chasing the tail all you like the game is over.

But the agreement was to have a referendum, was it not, and referendum is what was done and people spoke, so respect it. The TCs too agreed to a referendum, so what's all this about a representative of the people can speak for them, because if that's what you want to argue, foolishly I may add, you will lose, since not only Papadopoulos said OXI to the AP 2004 in the last minute, but Denktash said OXI to AP 2004 from the beginning.

[Lordo]

It is not me that will lose my friend it is cyprus and the cypriots, to have negotiated and not support the plan show how honest tpapa was. to go on tv and cry against the plan required a lot of acting. oscar i think is the order of the day.

enjoy.

may he enjoy heaven with all his honesty.




this is real democracy at work to be admired around the world.

[Kikapu]

It is not me that will lose my friend it is cyprus and the cypriots, to have negotiated and not support the plan show how honest tpapa was. to go on tv and cry against the plan required a lot of acting. oscar i think is the order of the day.

enjoy.

may he enjoy heaven with all his honesty.




this is real democracy at work to be admired around the world.

Then you have no idea what democracy is in that case if what people voted doesn't mean a thing to you.